Site Supporter Spider Posted September 10, 2012 Site Supporter Share Posted September 10, 2012 I spend much more time than I'd like to dealing with teachers. A fucking good proportion of them have no concept whatsoever of what is actually happening in the real world. None at all. Reading the editorial in the Guardian and offering sniffy opinions based on the purple prose of some organicly dressed twatclanger doesn't count. If they knew the truth, they'd shut their fucking traps, crack on with their jobs and stop moaning. I have no issue at all with the holidays, the pay or anything else. But for a supposedly bright sector of society they can be a blinkered, selfish and downright fucking pigthick shower of hippies at times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Spider Posted September 10, 2012 Site Supporter Share Posted September 10, 2012 I spend much more time than I'd like to dealing with teachers. A fucking good proportion of them have no concept whatsoever of what is actually happening in the real world. None at all. Reading the editorial in the Guardian and offering sniffy opinions based on the purple prose of some organicly dressed twatclanger doesn't count. If they knew the truth, they'd shut their fucking traps, crack on with their jobs and stop moaning. I have no issue at all with the holidays, the pay or anything else. But for a supposedly bright sector of society they can be a blinkered, selfish and downright fucking pigthick shower of hippies at times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
worthy10 Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 How about if you were told you hadn't got a job? I suppose it's relative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
worthy10 Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 Subjective? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Spider Posted September 10, 2012 Site Supporter Share Posted September 10, 2012 Is it shite. WHat kind of example are they setting? These people are supposedly the ones fetching the next generation kicking and screaming into the real world. All they are doing is giving them a day off, less education and a subconcious belief that sulking, feet stamping and acting like a fucking communist is acceptable. It isn;t. Go to work, you twats, teach our kids and use the summer holidays and your own time to make your point. THEN, you may have the support of 10% of the nation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Horwich Posted September 10, 2012 Moderators Share Posted September 10, 2012 Private sector wages bigger than public? In my experience...YES Discuss Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Spider Posted September 10, 2012 Site Supporter Share Posted September 10, 2012 Private sector wages bigger than public? In my experience...YES Discuss Longer hours worked in the private sector? I'd say so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Youri McAnespie Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 I'm not totally sticking up for teachers, but it's uncanny how many feel qualified to rip the piss out of them at the first opportunity, yet are fully prepared to entrust their children to such a motley collection of; lazy, bolshy, fuckwitted 'real work' avoiders for seven hours a day, five days a week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jules_darby Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 I'm not totally sticking up for teachers, but it's uncanny how many feel qualified to rip the piss out of them at the first opportunity, yet are fully prepared to entrust their children to such a motley collection of; lazy, bolshy, fuckwitted 'real work' avoiders for seven hours a day, five days a week. Errrm, don't think there's any choice is there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Spider Posted September 10, 2012 Site Supporter Share Posted September 10, 2012 I'm not totally sticking up for teachers, but it's uncanny how many feel qualified to rip the piss out of them at the first opportunity, yet are fully prepared to entrust their children to such a motley collection of; lazy, bolshy, fuckwitted 'real work' avoiders for seven hours a day, five days a week. At no point will anyone sensible argue the value and importance of teachers. They've worked hard to get where they are. But this is the thing, why acheive this considerable goal only to turn into a wheely-eyed leftie? They do this job "for the kids", yet these are the very people they are really damaging with these pointless strikes. You can make a point without having a day off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big E Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 I'm not totally sticking up for teachers, but it's uncanny how many feel qualified to rip the piss out of them at the first opportunity, yet are fully prepared to entrust their children to such a motley collection of; lazy, bolshy, fuckwitted 'real work' avoiders for seven hours a day, five days a week. Isn't there some silly law where you actually have to send kids to school? I think teachers get paid well for what they do. The ones I know who struggle with planning etc admit it is there piss poor time management that's the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Youri McAnespie Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 Errrm, don't think there's any choice is there? Educate them at home? Privately educate them? Let them wag it from 4 to 18? The list is endless... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Alf Hartigan Posted September 10, 2012 Site Supporter Share Posted September 10, 2012 Private sector wages bigger than public? In my experience...YES Discuss in my job, no, quite the opposite. but that's comparing like for like jobs. there is much more scope to make good money in the private sector though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Youri McAnespie Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 At no point will anyone sensible argue the value and importance of teachers. They've worked hard to get where they are. But this is the thing, why acheive this considerable goal only to turn into a wheely-eyed leftie? They do this job "for the kids", yet these are the very people they are really damaging with these pointless strikes. You can make a point without having a day off. If you pay peanuts you get monkeys - I know of quite a few who are qualified teachers, who've f*cked it off to work in the private sector. It's probably one of the most rewarding jobs going, but not financially so. A pay freeze of three years is relatively harsh for a public sector worker. Ironically, a lot of the posters knocking the teachers are the most critical of feckless parents in other threads. It's teachers who are often at the forefront of correcting the damage done by the latter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salford Trotter Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2012/mar/27/public-private-sector-pay The Public Sector wins hands down in practically every measure.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Casino Posted September 10, 2012 Moderators Share Posted September 10, 2012 so, not a lot to discuss now theres a shocker and, coincidentally for the last 3 years private sector pay has been pretty steady, while public sector rewards have increased noticeably Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maggie Tate Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 http://www.guardian....vate-sector-pay The Public Sector wins hands down in practically every measure.... Oh come on, read your own link man!! Time and time again the article says that it is complicated, unclear and basically a right fucking maze. To glibly claim that 'the public sector wins hands down every time' is gross over-simplification. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salford Trotter Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 The average annual Public Sector pension equates to c.£7.7k and double that of the average Private Sector pension of c.£3.7k. These pension statistics bring everything into focus for me and it's no wonder that many pensioner families struggle to make ends meet. I don't care how young you are it's never too early to think about your pension and I just wonder how many on here haven't even got a pension never mind adequate pension provision Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salford Trotter Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 Oh come on, read your own link man!! Time and time again the article says that it is complicated, unclear and basically a right fucking maze. To glibly claim that 'the public sector wins hands down every time' is gross over-simplification. Who said it was simple?? Of course it's complicated but that article seemed to indicate that Public Sector workers on the whole were better off so show me an article that contradicts that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cureforsanity Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 Well.......................as my owd dad used to say (well, in actual fact, still does) "Them as can, does, them as can't ...teach. And them as can't teach.......................teach teachers" And our kid is some high fallutin' teacher in yon private school darn sarf and has so far never been on strike because she gets paid shedloads of cash for trying to drag other folks (albeit rich 'uns) kids up where their parents are either too rich to be arsed or just plain too rich. No excuse, just lazy feckers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maggie Tate Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 Who said it was simple?? Of course it's complicated but that article seemed to indicate that Public Sector workers on the whole were better off so show me an article that contradicts that. I've no need, it's all in the link you posted. It clearly states that top earners are better off in the private sector, that a highly qualified/skilled person in the public sector will earn less than their private sector counterpart and that almost 50% of years see higher private sector wage rises. In any case, all serious analysis of the comparison emphasises what a pointless exercise it is. The public sector is full of people with whom the private sector has no or hardly any equivalents; social workers, teachers, nurses etc, then there are the complications of a lot of traditional public sector roles being contracted out to the private sector. And the job security srgument means less and less as the government announces more and more pubic sector redundancies. 1 in 5 people in my current line of work will no longer be there when the cuts are complete. My missus' cousin is a scientist with a PhD who looked at a private to public sector move a year or so back; same level of work, same responsibility and all that, she would have had to take a 35% salary cut, forego a five figure annual bonus and give up the company car (for which all associated costs including petrol were free. Oh, and a brand new one every two years). There again, you might argue the difference is made by work/life balance, the old pension arrangements or retirement age. I would probably agree it's easier to be bone idle and unproductive in the public sector (although have you phoned a bank or telephone or internet or TV provider lately??? Or have you ever had a builder who thinks 'I'll be round Tuesday' means you will need to phone him up to bollock him on the Friday???). So as you see, if you've read this far, it's tremendously complicated and that is why I told you you were simplifying. 'Public sector shit, private sector brilliant' won't wash. I speak as someone currently part-way through moving from public to private sector due to the prospect of at least twice the money, double the time off and around 35% fewer hours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salford Trotter Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 I've no need, it's all in the link you posted. It clearly states that top earners are better off in the private sector, that a highly qualified/skilled person in the public sector will earn less than their private sector counterpart and that almost 50% of years see higher private sector wage rises. In any case, all serious analysis of the comparison emphasises what a pointless exercise it is. The public sector is full of people with whom the private sector has no or hardly any equivalents; social workers, teachers, nurses etc, then there are the complications of a lot of traditional public sector roles being contracted out to the private sector. And the job security srgument means less and less as the government announces more and more pubic sector redundancies. 1 in 5 people in my current line of work will no longer be there when the cuts are complete. My missus' cousin is a scientist with a PhD who looked at a private to public sector move a year or so back; same level of work, same responsibility and all that, she would have had to take a 35% salary cut, forego a five figure annual bonus and give up the company car (for which all associated costs including petrol were free. Oh, and a brand new one every two years). There again, you might argue the difference is made by work/life balance, the old pension arrangements or retirement age. I would probably agree it's easier to be bone idle and unproductive in the public sector (although have you phoned a bank or telephone or internet or TV provider lately??? Or have you ever had a builder who thinks 'I'll be round Tuesday' means you will need to phone him up to bollock him on the Friday???). So as you see, if you've read this far, it's tremendously complicated and that is why I told you you were simplifying. 'Public sector shit, private sector brilliant' won't wash. I speak as someone currently part-way through moving from public to private sector due to the prospect of at least twice the money, double the time off and around 35% fewer hours. You make some fair points and as I said I didn't say it was simple. I've seen both sides, I've spent all of my working life in the Private Sector and I know, to my benefit, how lucrative it can be and my Mrs has spent all but 2 years of her career as a Civil Servant. So i do feel qualified. as you do, to comment with authority and as such the article I posted felt broadly in line with the consensus of opinion that i'd read about the 'average' employee in both sectors where comparisons are easier to gauge. Oh and by the way welcome to the dark side Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birch-chorley Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 I'm not totally sticking up for teachers, but it's uncanny how many feel qualified to rip the piss out of them at the first opportunity, yet are fully prepared to entrust their children to such a motley collection of; lazy, bolshy, fuckwitted 'real work' avoiders for seven hours a day, five days a week. I dont think anyone is saying that on the whole teachers cannot do a job. There are some really shit ones that cannot be sacked but I am sure that they make up a small percentage. It would be stupid to say 100% of teachers are up to the job, 95% maybee. The problem is that they are moaning that they get a shit deal. The salary is good and when you divide that by the hours worked the hourly rate is even better. Add in a huge pension in comparison to most and the fact you would have to murder someone to get sacked means that its a decent deal. The problem is most teachers have only teached and thus dont have a fucking clue what working 48 weeks a year in the private sector is like. Nobody is stopping them changing jobs if they are getting shat on so badly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Youri McAnespie Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 (edited) I dont think anyone is saying that on the whole teachers cannot do a job. There are some really shit ones that cannot be sacked but I am sure that they make up a small percentage. It would be stupid to say 100% of teachers are up to the job, 95% maybee. The problem is that they are moaning that they get a shit deal. The salary is good and when you divide that by the hours worked the hourly rate is even better. Add in a huge pension in comparison to most and the fact you would have to murder someone to get sacked means that its a decent deal. The problem is most teachers have only teached and thus dont have a fucking clue what working 48 weeks a year in the private sector is like. Nobody is stopping them changing jobs if they are getting shat on so badly. And those judging the teachers can do so because they've experienced teaching? I've done both, and in the 'real world' I've done jobs where you come home covered in shit from head to toe and almost too fucked to have a bath, eat your tea and half drink a can of stella before falling asleep...Teaching is a piece of piss - from 9ish to 3ish...it flies by and is one of the most rewarding jobs you can have, it really doesn't feel like work at all. The other shit is a different matter, when I was training it wasn't uncommon to get home at around 5pm only to start again at 6 or 7pm and work through to midnight or 1am preparing for the next day. All these myths about putting smiley faces next to pictures of mummy and daddy or reading teenage angst poetry - Bollocks! You're constantly assessed and monitored, you must have evidence of preparation and evaluation. If one could waltz in at 8am, wing it all day - then fuck off at 4pm without doing a jot until 8am the following day I'd still be doing it! The job security is there, but if you're good 'un - like in all walks of life, you end up taking up the slack left by the 'unsackable' feckless. What is a 'real job' anyway? I'll wager those on the frontline of say, the NHS, fire service or policing Afghanistan, would have differing definitions of 'real' work. Anyway, I'm not banging the drum too much, because it is rewarding and if you're not happy with the financial or bureaucratic aspect of the job you can always walk - I did. I'm just baffled why folk always get so foaming at the mouth with folk not a million miles away from themselves, in terms of finances and lifestyle. Edited September 11, 2012 by Youri McAnespie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traf Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 All this myths about putting smiley faces next to pictures of mummy and daddy or reading teenage angst poetry - Bollocks! You're constantly assessed and monitored, you must have evidence of preparation and evaluation. If one could waltz in at 8am, wing it all day - then fuck off at 4pm without doing a jot until 8am the following day I'd still be doing it! These "myths" are created by the lazy element amongst the profession (every job has them!) who give the impression that's how they do it. My brother in law is training to be a teacher and his wife already teaches (quite small and she's ugly, before anyone asks), so I do realise there's more to the job than meets the eye, but they both accept the money is good for the actual hours spent at "the office" and they also accept that the lack of wage rises is more than compensated by the job security. I wouldn't/couldn't do it. Too many feckless feral teenagers about, the job's not physically safe IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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