Site Supporter Tonge moor green jacket Posted September 8, 2019 Site Supporter Share Posted September 8, 2019 1 hour ago, Salford Trotter said: Bright enough to lose Johnson his first three votes as PM, the worst record of any new PM since the 16th century I understand. If you want to watch the dismantling of a party first hand by a bunch of extreme Tory zealots then watch the job Johnson's puppeteer is doing Govt has barely won anything on brexit, and will struggle to do so whilst the makeup of MPs remains as it is. Was inevitable they would lose recent ones; we've already seen parliament's response to this over months. As jol has pointed out, perhaps it is designed to enable a clear out etc. Something had to give. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulhanley Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 6 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said: Govt has barely won anything on brexit, and will struggle to do so whilst the makeup of MPs remains as it is. Was inevitable they would lose recent ones; we've already seen parliament's response to this over months. As jol has pointed out, perhaps it is designed to enable a clear out etc. Something had to give. A clear-out is exactly what this is. Long overdue. Parliament v the people is not sustainable for ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salford Trotter Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 4 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said: Govt has barely won anything on brexit, and will struggle to do so whilst the makeup of MPs remains as it is. Was inevitable they would lose recent ones; we've already seen parliament's response to this over months. As jol has pointed out, perhaps it is designed to enable a clear out etc. Something had to give. The Polls (if believed) haven't changed much once viewed across the spectrum of questions asked recently. There is not clear water between the leave/remain sides that suggests one will be run away winners. It still smacks of a hung parliament https://whatukthinks.org/eu/opinion-polls/uk-poll-results/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Casino Posted September 8, 2019 Moderators Share Posted September 8, 2019 A clear out of good Tory mps Which will result in a loss of Tory support, if not in the short term, definitely in the medium It might serve them well in a single issue election, but in the future, cant see it being a good thing Especially if we do leave no deal They're finished for years Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jol_BWFC Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 8 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said: Seems reasonable jol. I certainly think Boris wants to get brexit done, but it's appearing that it's going to need an election to do it. He does, as it’s his (current) brand. I think the existing position is a win-win for him. If he can achieve Brexit without a GE (that’s looking very unlikely, but you never know), then he is the man who delivered Brexit and gains support. If not, he gets a GE decided on Brexit. He became the conservative leader (by a huge margin from MPs and members) for backing Brexit so firmly and he was the prominent Brexiteer MP during the referendum campaign. His strongest chance of winning a GE is going to be when it’s based on his Brexiteer credentials. Win it now and get himself a full term. I have to say, I am intrigued by how he will manage the 31 October extension. He, Raab and Javid have all insisted he won’t request it. I don’t see how he can’t. Cummins is going to have to work hard to spin not leaving on 31 October. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jol_BWFC Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 19 minutes ago, Salford Trotter said: If the election is campaigned on a No Deal Brexit by Johnson then I don't believe he will have as much support as he expects. The electorate are more clued up on the economic implications of a No Deal exit and they know the carnage that would ensue thereafter. Also as you say, a lot depends on the way the labour and Lib Dems work together and for both parties to put so much energy into stopping No Deal but to abandon it when a GE comes along seems futile to me. The Brecon by election demonstrated what is possible with political co-operation so we will soon see how determined both sides are to get the outcome they want Assuming the election happens after the extension has been triggered, then Boris will have the potential to maintain that he can still get a deal done before 31 January (or whenever) - albeit he needs to work harder to make it look like he’s actually trying. It may placate some Brexiteers who don’t want a no deal. As per my last post, I’m assuming there will be an extension beyond 31 Oct. I can’t see how there wouldn’t. But with Raab and Javid being so clear today, they must have something up their sleeves. Intriguing. Perhaps they will argue about interpretation of the law and drag it through the courts after 19 October, appeal any decisions against them and hope it goes beyond 31 October? Would Bojo risk criminal proceedings against him? The Lib Dems and Labour will work together I’m sure, but I’m not sure it will be enough. Lots of twists and turns to come. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweep Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Moon boy said: Why don’t they want it on that date? Its not on their favour to do so yet. Honest mate, if you watch the news and read the papers they'll explain it to you. It's all about timing, and ensuring its not an easy run for Boris, and of course helping them to delay any form of Brexit. Edited September 8, 2019 by Sweep Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leigh white Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 Anyway, when it eventually pans out, we can have a debate on the situation in Hong Kong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Tonge moor green jacket Posted September 8, 2019 Site Supporter Share Posted September 8, 2019 1 hour ago, Jol_BWFC said: He does, as it’s his (current) brand. I think the existing position is a win-win for him. If he can achieve Brexit without a GE (that’s looking very unlikely, but you never know), then he is the man who delivered Brexit and gains support. If not, he gets a GE decided on Brexit. He became the conservative leader (by a huge margin from MPs and members) for backing Brexit so firmly and he was the prominent Brexiteer MP during the referendum campaign. His strongest chance of winning a GE is going to be when it’s based on his Brexiteer credentials. Win it now and get himself a full term. I have to say, I am intrigued by how he will manage the 31 October extension. He, Raab and Javid have all insisted he won’t request it. I don’t see how he can’t. Cummins is going to have to work hard to spin not leaving on 31 October. It may yet be that he does go and get a short extension as instructed. Then try for a better deal. After all, no deal is only off the table temporarily. He would still have the no deal fall back: keeping the situation as it is. Sooner or later an election would have to happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon boy Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 3 hours ago, Sweep said: Its not on their favour to do so yet. Honest mate, if you watch the news and read the papers they'll explain it to you. It's all about timing, and ensuring its not an easy run for Boris, and of course helping them to delay any form of Brexit. So are they are being un- Democratic? I thought the Conservative Party are the elected Government?, and these people said that the uncertainty over Leave/Remain was costing millions of jobs? Didn’t the say they would carry out the wishes of the Majority before the Referendum and didn’t most of them campaign at the last GE to Leave?Is Boris having a coup? Ihaven’t got a tv and I can’t afford Newspapers can you explain how this has happened, please Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweep Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 21 minutes ago, Moon boy said: Didn’t the say they would carry out the wishes of the Majority before the Referendum and didn’t most of them campaign at the last GE to Leave Yes, but they lied, its what politicians do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leigh white Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 14 minutes ago, Sweep said: Yes, but they lied, its what politicians do. I lied once in a pub when the landlord asked me how old i was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon boy Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 36 minutes ago, leigh white said: I lied once in a pub when the landlord asked me how old i was. Are you a politician? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leigh white Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 33 minutes ago, Moon boy said: Are you a politician? I joined the Hari Krishna sect in 1969 and paraded up and down King St in Leigh with a shaved head, a white gown and a tambourine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jol_BWFC Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 On 07/08/2019 at 08:42, bwfcfan5 said: It is a common tactic of the far right frequenters of Breitbart etc...when in doubt mention Soros and random far right conspiracy theories about him. Bunch of extremist loons and best ignored. Interesting documentary on BBC2 this evening. Runs through some of the conspiracy stories around Soros and points out how it’s bullshit. It’s amusing how the far right have latched onto him and will try and pin anything on him, no matter how far-fetched. Literally just making things up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salford Trotter Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 2 hours ago, Moon boy said: So are they are being un- Democratic? I thought the Conservative Party are the elected Government?, and these people said that the uncertainty over Leave/Remain was costing millions of jobs? Didn’t the say they would carry out the wishes of the Majority before the Referendum and didn’t most of them campaign at the last GE to Leave?Is Boris having a coup? Ihaven’t got a tv and I can’t afford Newspapers can you explain how this has happened, please I'll chip in for a tv licence for you, it'll save a lot of explaining Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon boy Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 12 minutes ago, Salford Trotter said: I'll chip in for a tv licence for you, it'll save a lot of explaining Thanks, that’ll be great, can you recommend a programme or channel that will explain the truth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon boy Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 1 hour ago, leigh white said: I joined the Hari Krishna sect in 1969 and paraded up and down King St in Leigh with a shaved head, a white gown and a tambourine. Have you stopped now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jol_BWFC Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 6 minutes ago, Moon boy said: Thanks, that’ll be great, can you recommend a programme or channel that will explain the truth Fox News. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leigh white Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 22 minutes ago, Moon boy said: Have you stopped now? Yeah, just got in the Ale House on Henrietta St for a wind down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Casino Posted September 9, 2019 Moderators Share Posted September 9, 2019 So, parliament shut down after today Not like there's owt to sort out, I suppose Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwfcfan5 Posted September 9, 2019 Share Posted September 9, 2019 1 minute ago, Casino said: So, parliament shut down after today Not like there's owt to sort out, I suppose Don't see the problem. They can all go to their party conferences and shout about each other. That'll sort it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwfcfan5 Posted September 9, 2019 Share Posted September 9, 2019 Today Boris describes a no deal exit as "failure". So now we officially know. A no deal exit is a failure. Lets keep a note of that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwfcfan5 Posted September 9, 2019 Share Posted September 9, 2019 https://news.sky.com/story/boris-johnson-would-not-win-an-election-outright-polling-seen-by-no-10-suggests-11805584 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon boy Posted September 9, 2019 Share Posted September 9, 2019 24 minutes ago, bwfcfan5 said: Today Boris describes a no deal exit as "failure". So now we officially know. A no deal exit is a failure. Lets keep a note of that. Do you work for the BBC, you ‘accidentally ‘missed some words off what he said ‘A failure of Statecraft’ Don’t let the truth get in the way of a good story eh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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