Politics

[Sweep]

13 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

The second paragraph doesn't add up?

If you sell the ten and get £10, then buy back for £50, you've lost £40.

Unless you're saying they went up ten times from £1 purchase fee, to £10 selling fee, yielding £90.

Then buying back at £50, yielding £40 overall, and still having your units.

Unless I'm missing something then isn't this just typical buying/selling on markets and normal risks?

I think he means if they drop to £0.50.....so then you sell at £10 and then buy back at £5, thus having made £5

 

I think 😶

[Ani]

1 minute ago, Sweep said:

I think he means if they drop to £0.50.....so then you sell at £10 and then buy back at £5, thus having made £5

 

I think 😶

Yes sorry. You lose £5. 

[Tonge moor green jacket]

2 minutes ago, Ani said:

Yes sorry. You lose £5. 

😂 You still have your items though, and for half what you initially paid. Not bad going.

Joking apart, it is clearly complex, and not without risk, hence wanting a more in depth explanation of why, how etc.

Edited September 12, 2019 by Tonge moor green jacket

[Ani]

19 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

The second paragraph doesn't add up?

If you sell the ten and get £10, then buy back for £50, you've lost £40.

Unless you're saying they went up ten times from £1 purchase fee, to £10 selling fee, yielding £90.

Then buying back at £50, yielding £40 overall, and still having your units.

Unless I'm missing something then isn't this just typical buying/selling on markets and normal risks?

As mentioned you buy back and lose £5. Sorry , but think principle is pretty clear. 

What hedge fund do is exactly what the market is about. It is a legitimate business. 

What is fucked up is the tax these funds make massive profits and pay no or little tax. 

What is immoral is JRM and his ilk investing assuming an outcome which is bad for the country but anyone saying this might happen being dismissed as project fear. 

[Ani]

JRM long term view that Brexit will be good for the country is based on the real rich getting richer and that having a knock on to the rest of us. 

I am sure there will Labour MPs involved in similar funds btw. 

Edited September 12, 2019 by Ani

[Sweep]

1 minute ago, Ani said:

JRM long term view that Brexit will be good for the country is based on the real rich getting richer and that having a knock on to the rest of us. 

I think even the most ardent "leaver" knows full well that somebody like JRM really isn't interested in the average man in the street, it perfectly clear what he's all about. If a nuclear bomb dropped on the North West, he wouldn't even flinch, unless he'd recently invested in Potassium Iodide of course, and then he might raise a little smirk

[Tonge moor green jacket]

The average mon, isn't really bothered about JRM either.

Just want to get on.

[mickbrown]

3 hours ago, Sweep said:

yes, but so what, do some deep research on George Soros (or something like that anyway)

Did Soros fund the Tory party that time he bent us over a barrel?

[Sweep]

Just now, mickbrown said:

Did Soros fund the Tory party that time he bent us over a barrel?

I don't know, as I wasn't arsed enough to do some "deep research" when somebody suggested that we all should 😃

[mickbrown]

Just now, Sweep said:

I don't know, as I wasn't arsed enough to do some "deep research" when somebody suggested that we all should 😃

😀

 

[mickbrown]

1 hour ago, Moon boy said:

Are they being silly with their money, because Parliament has blocked our exit on October 31st, and the majority of MP’s in our elected Parliament look like they are in a position to revoke A50 at the moment, surely Boris can’t do what he wants, after all he’s only the PM

If you are worried about ‘a rich minority of corrupt individuals manipulating the population try Blair, Miller, Greive, Adonis, Heseltine etc, etc,etc

How many of those you mention benefit if what they told you won’t happen happens?

Mogg is a special kind of twat. He’d gladly have your kids back  cleaning chimneys if he made a few quid from it. 

[Tonge moor green jacket]

These mega rich shorters: don't they also rely on someone buying these 'units' then losing a load in selling back for less?

Seems like money swings and roundabouts. A game of poker, taking money off each other.

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, mickbrown said:

Did Soros fund the Tory party that time he bent us over a barrel?

I don’t think so

[bwfcfan5]

4 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

These mega rich shorters: don't they also rely on someone buying these 'units' then losing a load in selling back for less?

Seems like money swings and roundabouts. A game of poker, taking money off each other.

You don't seem to accept the fundamental point. The people throwing fortunes at the market gambling on our economy struggling are Brexiteers - telling everyone how anyone saying there will be economic issues are "project fear". They are also the ones funding Boris.

If you can't see the very obvious issue with that - well of course you can see it - but you don't want to. 

The fact that they can spend millions on betting against us - means they will be ok. But should their bet come off everyone else will suffer. 

 

Edited September 12, 2019 by bwfcfan5

[mickbrown]

1 hour ago, Sweep said:

No probably not, but if you could make a quick Billion or two now, then who cares about the future?!?  -  theoretically, you could make a quick buck, and then move on to other markets. Or to put it this way, if I could do something at work today, that mihgt net me say £1M, then I'd not at present be overly worried if my company existed or not next January, as I'd already be quids in, having "taken the money and run"

 

it's all very complex this shorting of money, and I don't pretend to understand it, I know that to profit, you generally have to be very ITK, and also have very deep pockets. And it does go wrong on occasion. As Miami pointed out earlier in this thread, the likes of George Soros have made plenty of money in this sort of activity

Not really. You just have to be able to cover your losses if it goes the other way. And you’ll have a ‘stop loss’ set to limit your losses 

If, hypothetically, you’ve skewed the bet by buying influence, then you’re quids in. 

Edited September 12, 2019 by mickbrown

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, bwfcfan5 said:

You don't seem to accept the fundamental point. The people throwing fortunes at the market gambling on our economy struggling are Brexiteers - telling everyone how anyone saying there will be economic issues are "project fear". They are also the ones funding Boris.

If you can't see the very obvious issue with that - well of course you can see it - but you don't want to. 

The fact that they can spend millions on betting against us - means they will be ok. But should their bet come off everyone else will suffer. 

 

You do make stuff up and treat them as facts; why?

[bwfcfan5]

1 minute ago, boltondiver said:

You do make stuff up and treat them as facts; why?

Did you read the article? Or was it not approved reading by Cummings?

[Tonge moor green jacket]

5 minutes ago, bwfcfan5 said:

You don't seem to accept the fundamental point. The people throwing fortunes at the market gambling on our economy struggling are Brexiteers - telling everyone how anyone saying there will be economic issues are "project fear". They are also the ones funding Boris.

If you can't see the very obvious issue with that - well of course you can see it - but you don't want to. 

The fact that they can spend millions on betting against us - means they will be ok. But should their bet come off everyone else will suffer. 

 

If their bet pays off, why will I suffer?

If the economy goes tits up first, then yes they benefit, but their bet hasn't caused the suffering. If it's their money to invest, so be it.

It's all hypothetical, you rigidly believe the world will end, I don't.

The port man has dispelled yet another pile of misinformation. However I'm sure it won't stop you bleating about a lack of food etc.

As for the money men, as I've said for ages, if they're doing nowt illegal then why get so excercised? I'll agree if they're avoiding paying taxes.

The article posted by Mick, does say that Boris has invested massive amounts in this. I hope they can show this, otherwise it would be a lie wouldn't it.

Him talking campaign fund donations isn't the same.

[bwfcfan5]

6 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

If their bet pays off, why will I suffer?

If the economy goes tits up first, then yes they benefit, but their bet hasn't caused the suffering. If it's their money to invest, so be it.

It's all hypothetical, you rigidly believe the world will end, I don't.

The port man has dispelled yet another pile of misinformation. However I'm sure it won't stop you bleating about a lack of food etc.

As for the money men, as I've said for ages, if they're doing nowt illegal then why get so excercised? I'll agree if they're avoiding paying taxes.

The article posted by Mick, does say that Boris has invested massive amounts in this. I hope they can show this, otherwise it would be a lie wouldn't it.

Him talking campaign fund donations isn't the same.

Their bet hasn't caused the issue. But the fact they are using their money and influence to then bet against the economy and engineer a no deal Brexit whilst pretending that it will all be great.

Whether you individually suffer or not is moot. People shorted the housing market in the US ahead of the credit crunch recession. They made huge amounts of money. They did not cause the recession. But many across the world did suffer.

The issue here is that the market trading is not unusual. What is of concern is that the people betting on a negative outcome in case of a no deal Brexit are the same ones funding Boris and arguing for a no deal Brexit. 

[Ani]

2 hours ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

If their bet pays off, why will I suffer?

If the economy goes tits up first, then yes they benefit, but their bet hasn't caused the suffering. If it's their money to invest, so be it.

It's all hypothetical, you rigidly believe the world will end, I don't.

The port man has dispelled yet another pile of misinformation. However I'm sure it won't stop you bleating about a lack of food etc.

As for the money men, as I've said for ages, if they're doing nowt illegal then why get so excercised? I'll agree if they're avoiding paying taxes.

The article posted by Mick, does say that Boris has invested massive amounts in this. I hope they can show this, otherwise it would be a lie wouldn't it.

Him talking campaign fund donations isn't the same.

The port man provided a different view that expressed by Boris government. 

But you are picking and choosing who you believe. 

Good to know you no longer trust the views of Boris and the boys. 

[Tonge moor green jacket]

45 minutes ago, Ani said:

The port man provided a different view that expressed by Boris government. 

But you are picking and choosing who you believe. 

Good to know you no longer trust the views of Boris and the boys. 

You refering to yellowhammer?

That was a worse case scenario, depicting events with inadequate planning.

The port man detailed the plan already in place to protect imports, as a response to no deal, and explained work already done and being done to protect imports.

So the two aren't contradictory, merely evidence of preparation.

So there's no selective belief. Pleased to see action being taken as it should be.

Other than that I've never heard Boris express an opinion that food shortages etc will happen.

Edited September 12, 2019 by Tonge moor green jacket

[Spider]

Whether you like it or not, a capitalist society needs uber-rich people doing their thing up top.

They don't stay rich by putting it under the bed and that eventually filters down into investment that maintains a decent economy.

The alternative is a more socialist model which only suits those in positions of political power and rarely produces a thriving, robust economy.

It's an unpleasant thought for many, but the majority of us subscribe to this system in one way or another.

Brexit is a manipulative clusterfuck.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

You refering to yellowhammer?

That was a worse case scenario, depicting events with inadequate planning.

The port man detailed the plan already in place to protect imports, as a response to no deal, and explained work already done and being done to protect imports.

So the two aren't contradictory, merely evidence of preparation.

So there's no selective belief. Pleased to see action being taken as it should be.

Other than that I've never heard Boris express an opinion that food shortages etc will happen.

No, Yellowhammer isn't a worst case scenario, it's a doomsday FACT

[Ani]

1 hour ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

You refering to yellowhammer?

That was a worse case scenario, depicting events with inadequate planning.

The port man detailed the plan already in place to protect imports, as a response to no deal, and explained work already done and being done to protect imports.

So the two aren't contradictory, merely evidence of preparation.

So there's no selective belief. Pleased to see action being taken as it should be.

Other than that I've never heard Boris express an opinion that food shortages etc will happen.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/voices/brexit-yellowhammer-no-deal-michael-gove-boris-johnson-base-case-a9102041.html%3famp

strange that the original version that the damn lefties at the Sunday Times saw referred to it being base case. 

[Ani]

11 minutes ago, boltondiver said:

No, Yellowhammer isn't a worst case scenario, it's a doomsday FACT

Why would the Leave government produce a doomsday document and then try to avoid sharing it ?