Chris Custodiet Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 16 minutes ago, wakey said: Don't know how much Ed put in Tom, but gut feel is millions not tens of millions. When we consolidated the debt it was set up to pay 10% interest. This offered significantly higher return than most alternatives at the time (banks were paying roughly bugger all), i.e. it offered an attractive return. It was also done via British Virgin Isles which has two main advantages - anonymity and tax-free. It's always seemed most likely to me that we set up an investment scheme offering attractive returns backed by a premier league asset, with the added advantages of tax free returns and anonymity. Attractive to investors and attractive to the club at a time when we needed millions to compete and thought we could keep flipping Anelka's at a profit on a semi-regular basis. What happened subsequently - given the interest wasn't paid and £180m+ was written off - is pure speculation. But if you follow it through, not implausible for a scheme of this nature, however well-intentioned the founders were. I don't wish to be rude but lets be honest, Wakey, you don't know very much at all do you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Custodiet Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 7 minutes ago, Casino said: our losses were in the 10s of millions in some years where do you think that was funded from PG was running a candyfloss stall on the car park in the summer, wasn't he? Must have made a mint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwfcfan5 Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 18 minutes ago, famouswanderer said: The thing thats pissing me off the most is dickheads on twitter going "lets just liquidate and start from scratch" And i think they are being serious. It would absolutely break me if that were to happen. They don't know what it means. Absolute idiots - who have no concept of what administration or liquidation mean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger_Dubuis Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 30 minutes ago, famouswanderer said: The thing thats pissing me off the most is dickheads on twitter going "lets just liquidate and start from scratch" And i think they are being serious. It would absolutely break me if that were to happen. I don't want that to happen but could see some positives in it, the main one being having a ground in Bolton.Dropping 8 divisions is an unfortunate downside of moving back to Bolton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwfcfan5 Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 1 minute ago, Roger_Dubuis said: I don't want that to happen but could see some positives in it, the main one being having a ground in Bolton.Dropping 8 divisions is an unfortunate downside of moving back to Bolton You talk as though liquidation means automatically there is a "new club". Why would this be the case? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Faustus Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 ST the Saviours innit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Tonge moor green jacket Posted March 4, 2019 Site Supporter Share Posted March 4, 2019 1 minute ago, Roger_Dubuis said: I don't want that to happen but could see some positives in it, the main one being having a ground in Bolton.Dropping 8 divisions is an unfortunate downside of moving back to Bolton Kinell. We'd still have to find somewhere to play. I'd prefer a takeover and stay at the uniBolt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger_Dubuis Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 12 minutes ago, bwfcfan5 said: You talk as though liquidation means automatically there is a "new club". Why would this be the case? Bolton is too big a town not to have a football club, it is inevitable a new club would be formed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwfcfan5 Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 5 minutes ago, Roger_Dubuis said: Bolton is too big a town not to have a football club, it is inevitable a new club would be formed. I don't think it is though. Someone has to pay for it. It needs to be co-ordinated otherwise you end up with competing ventures. It is far from certain - and I'm not convinced the people of Bolton have the patience to support a non-league team for years and years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wakey Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 13 minutes ago, Chris Custodiet said: I don't wish to be rude but lets be honest, Wakey, you don't know very much at all do you? You should try harder then Chris. Genuinely interested why you think that couldn't be the case. You think Ed put £150m+ in. I don't. The reasons why I don't I've already explained, but I'll summarise again. I don't think Ed ever enough brass. I base that on his estimated net worth of £65m - even allowing for the fact that could be well out, let's say he was worth double, it's still nwhere near enough. There is nothing to suggest Ed increased that net worth by a significant multiple subsequent to Strix. What limited indications there are don't point to anything successful. Based on the most generous of football benefactors (Walker, Abramovich etc) there's a precedent for how much of their wealth folk are prepared to blow on a football club. For Ed to be consistent with them, he'd have had to be a billionnaire. To me, it doesn't stack up. Feel free to give your reasons why anything I've said in the post you responded to isn't plausible. Incidentally, this is an example of a post that isn't being rude. Hope that helps in your future efforts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wakey Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 34 minutes ago, Casino said: our losses were in the 10s of millions in some years where do you think that was funded from I answered that in the rest of the post Casino. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barrycowdrill Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 Anyone who thinks admin or even worse liquidation is now maybe the best option and start it all again, wiping away nearly 150Yrs of history, expecting us to rise again like some fucking Phoenix from the flames is a bigger, more clueless cunt than both the current manager and the current owner End of Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tombwfc Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 40 minutes ago, wakey said: Don't know how much Ed put in Tom, but gut feel is millions not tens of millions. When we consolidated the debt it was set up to pay 10% interest. This offered significantly higher return than most alternatives at the time (banks were paying roughly bugger all), i.e. it offered an attractive return. It was also done via British Virgin Isles which has two main advantages - anonymity and tax-free. It's always seemed most likely to me that we set up an investment scheme offering attractive returns backed by a premier league asset, with the added advantages of tax free returns and anonymity. Attractive to investors and attractive to the club at a time when we needed millions to compete and thought we could keep flipping Anelka's at a profit on a semi-regular basis. What happened subsequently - given the interest wasn't paid and £180m+ was written off - is pure speculation. But if you follow it through, not implausible for a scheme of this nature, however well-intentioned the founders were. Thank you for explaining. I've no idea how that is possibly a more plausible explanation than just 'the estimates of Eddies wealth were incorrect'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwfc2003 Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 15 minutes ago, Roger_Dubuis said: I don't want that to happen but could see some positives in it, the main one being having a ground in Bolton.Dropping 8 divisions is an unfortunate downside of moving back to Bolton God you dont half talk some shit at times Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wakey Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 1 minute ago, Tombwfc said: Thank you for explaining. I've no idea how that is possibly a more plausible explanation than just 'the estimates of Eddies wealth were incorrect'. Sorry Tom, what's implausible? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birch-chorley Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 (edited) Genuine question but how bad would administration be? Plenty of other clubs have gone down that route and come back If it’s going that way anyway then we would be better off going now when we are dead and buried than at a later date when it could ruin another season I’m genuinely not sure how administration works but assume that one is appointed to clear the decks and pay the creditors. The creditors in this instance are ED’s family and other wealthy Bolton fans with a small amount to HMRC. I cant see a scenario where the major creditors push for liquidation The last set of accounts had us making a small profit, since then we have another £5m a season coming in from championship TV money, so I assume we are not making any substantial losses within a fiscal year. It’s just a case of us being a few months behind and constantly chasing the next TV instalment to catch up. As a business we have plenty of assets (ground, car park, Lostock) I certainly can’t see a liquidation scenario Edited March 4, 2019 by birch-chorley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wakey Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 8 minutes ago, Tombwfc said: Thank you for explaining. I've no idea how that is possibly a more plausible explanation than just 'the estimates of Eddies wealth were incorrect'. On second thought Tom, I'll DM you. Not the day or thread for this topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwfc2003 Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 3 minutes ago, birch-chorley said: Genuine question but how bad would administration be? Plenty of other clubs have gone down that route and come back If it’s going that way anyway then we would be better off going now when we are dead and buried than at a later date when it could ruin another season I’m genuinely not sure how administration works but assume that one is appointed to clear the decks and pay the creditors. The creditors in this instance are ED’s family and other wealthy Bolton fans with a small amount to HMRC. I struggle to see a scenario where the major creditors push for liquidation The last set of accounts had us making a small profit, since then we have another £5m a season coming in from championship TV money I assume we are not making any substantial losses. It’s just a case of us being a few months behind and constantly chasing the next instalment. As a business we have plenty of assets (ground, car park, Lostock) I certainly can’t see a liquidation scenario To go down the admin route, firstly we need someone to pay to put us into admin, but just as importantly we need someone to buy us to take us out of admin - - in all possibility would be as a First division club - maybe the appeal of the consortiums who have shown an interest in buying us is that we are only one step away from the promised land of the premier league Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwfcfan5 Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 2 minutes ago, bwfc2003 said: To go down the admin route, firstly we need someone to pay to put us into admin, but just as importantly we need someone to buy us to take us out of admin - - in all possibility would be as a First division club - maybe the appeal of the consortiums who have shown an interest in buying us is that we are only one step away from the promised land of the premier league And there are now rules in place that put you in embargo and under EFL scrutiny for 2 years...so in admin you're buying a league one club - with potentially a 2 year transfer ban and extra EFL financial scrutiny on its operations...I don't see that as a hugely attractive prospect. Sure the price is lower in that scenario but you own a club that likely cannot move forward for a considerable amount of time and you are left footing the bill. For an investment consortium what is the point of that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Faustus Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 2 minutes ago, barrycowdrill said: Anyone who thinks admin or even worse liquidation is now maybe the best option and start it all again, wiping away nearly 150Yrs of history, expecting us to rise again like some fucking Phoenix from the flames is a bigger, more clueless cunt than both the current manager and the current owner End of This I openly admit I am far from the brightest on the board, and I wont attempt to make head not tail of the accounts, or where we are upto etc- I'll leave that to those qualified/arsed about such matters. I do however like to think I am balanced in my views, and take differing sides of an argument before passing judgement. Admin could be disastrous, liquidation would be catastrophic... I didn't choose to support BWFC- they chose me; a kid from LH on day out with his mates. I underwent a life changing experience bounding across the Burnden pitch, which catapulted me onto an unparalleled rollercoaster for the next 25+ years. Nobody can come along and say to me, that's that and start afresh... How can a Wimbledon fan deny MK Dons? I hate how FCUM think they invented non league football. The only example I can think of is Rangers- literally carried on from where they left off. I cant see any Phoenix team doing that around here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Take Hunt Off Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 29 minutes ago, wakey said: On second thought Tom, I'll DM you. Not the day or thread for this topic. Aye its time to terminate the ED contribution debate its a bit like the orchestra playing on whilst the Titanic is sinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmjhb Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 Training ground closed due to a "food and fuel shortage". Brexit has clearly come early to Lostock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traf Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/17474243.shutdown-bolton-close-training-ground-because-of-food-shortage/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members burnden Posted March 4, 2019 Members Share Posted March 4, 2019 (edited) . Edited March 4, 2019 by burnden Deleted ,content same as above posts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter MickyD Posted March 4, 2019 Site Supporter Share Posted March 4, 2019 The start of things to come? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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