NZ Shootings

[royal white]

40 minutes ago, kent_white said:

Strange that you should pick this terrorist atrocity in particular to highlight the issue.

Well seeing as though the bombs in the Philippines were only a few weeks back and the genocide in Nigeria is till ongoing it was probably a good time. Also considering there’s a hell of a lot more more Nigerians and Filipinos living over here than folk from New Zealand you’d of thought it may have got a mention.

Well done in again having no input to the question. 

Edited March 16, 2019 by royal white

[Zico]

Both got coverage in the news, maybe not front page headlines, but they weren't ignored, going back further boko Harem had plenty when they nabbed all them school kids

Even found an article where a Muslim leader came out and condemned the attacks in the Philippines

https://www.apnews.com/e4993b5a9c38472aa748bf76b3389ac2

Thing is, incidents like this are that common now and ongoing, it probably takes something either close to "home" or for it to occur somewhere where it never happens for it to be considered shocking and therefore given more coverage, which in turn makes folk think they are deemed more important, even though the reality is they're all equally terrible tragedies

[Not in Crawley]

19 hours ago, Traf said:

If you need a label for these people : murderers will suffice.

Not right/left
Not Muslim/Christian
Not Black/White

Just fucking murderers.

I’m afraid that’s too simplistic - there are real issues here with religion, society at large and we see certain views propagated on here which are distasteful.

its too easy to just say, “they’re mental” 

[bolty58]

No one in their right mind could possibly justify or condone what this murderous nutter has done. I hope they throw the key away and, if NZ had capital punishment, I would be happy to hear that he'd been executed.

There is however an uncomfortable truth to face for some (one or two I can think of on here).

If there had never been an Al Qaeda, 9/11, Manchester, 7/7, Bataclan, German Xmas market, Marseilles, London Bridge, ISIS, Madrid train and hundreds of other atrocities I could list, there would never have been a Christchurch.

Not an excuse in any way - just a statement of fact.

Religion is a poisonous cancer which highlights differences between people rather than what unites us. The sooner the world agrees to universally abolish religion the better. How many thousands of years that will take I have no idea.

[Tonge moor green jacket]

I'm convinced that there's some deep within humans of a need to belong. Whether that is a street, neighbourhood, town, country, football team, knitting group or religion.

I once postulated a theory that much if not all the troubles in Ireland could be resolved in a generation. By taking all children off parents and bringing them up together in an independent, neutral environment.

When old enough to be robust put them back.

Clearly an impossible action, but you'd get the drift.

No doubt other issues would emerge as with any society, but the main religious one would be resolved.

 

[birch-chorley]

12 hours ago, royal white said:

As bad as this was today why do only certain atrocities get reported on? 

Thousands if Christians have been butchered in Nigeria in the last 12 month, how many reports in the press? What about the Filipinos killed during mass in the Philippines earlier this year, again hardly any coverage. 

Why are some deaths worthy of mains stream headlines and others hardly a mention? 

Atrocities in other wise safe places like Manchester, Paris, New Zealand are much more shocking than atrocities in back waters where they happen regularly like the Middle East, Africa and parts of Asia 

I also think it’s more news worthy over here as we can relate to these places as they have similar cultures and many people will have been to these places 

[Zico]

Other reasons why it would be headline news:

- terrorists attack in NZ are rare

- white on Muslim terrorist attacks are rare

- terrorist attacks streamed live online are rare

[Not in Crawley]

2 hours ago, bolty58 said:

No one in their right mind could possibly justify or condone what this murderous nutter has done. I hope they throw the key away and, if NZ had capital punishment, I would be happy to hear that he'd been executed.

There is however an uncomfortable truth to face for some (one or two I can think of on here).

If there had never been an Al Qaeda, 9/11, Manchester, 7/7, Bataclan, German Xmas market, Marseilles, London Bridge, ISIS, Madrid train and hundreds of other atrocities I could list, there would never have been a Christchurch.

Not an excuse in any way - just a statement of fact.

Religion is a poisonous cancer which highlights differences between people rather than what unites us. The sooner the world agrees to universally abolish religion the better. How many thousands of years that will take I have no idea.

Ok - work back by your own logic.

is it just Islam/religion that cause those atrocities? Or something else that fueled it?

Again, it’s too simplistic to just state it as a religious ‘battle’

There is something much bigger at play here. I one sense Traf is correct, some people will attach themselves to any cause, the real question is why this one and on that there are some very uncomfortable home truths that some folk - even on here - should pay mind to.

[bolty58]

11 hours ago, Not in Crawley said:

Ok - work back by your own logic.

is it just Islam/religion that cause those atrocities? Or something else that fueled it?

Again, it’s too simplistic to just state it as a religious ‘battle’

There is something much bigger at play here. I one sense Traf is correct, some people will attach themselves to any cause, the real question is why this one and on that there are some very uncomfortable home truths that some folk - even on here - should pay mind to.

Whichever way you want to spin it, the root cause is religion. You can arrive at whatever conclusion you want to - that is your right just as mine is mine.

'Conflicts' I use as evidence. The Irish 'troubles'; Rohinga; every Al Qaeda inspired atrocity; every ISIS inspired atrocity; abortion clinic employees murdered in the US; the Crusades; the gunpowder plot; the Spanish inquisition...........the list is a very long one.

Get our your deerstalker and magnifying glass and play Sherlock Holmes all you want looking for alternative reasons. I am sure 'dispossession' and 'poverty; will come high on your list. When they do, I will point to religious reasons as major contributors to those as well.

[Not in Crawley]

I wasnt dismissing religion as something people are attaching a cause to - I was alluding to conflicts begetting conflicts, that for most interventions, there is a massive knock on effect. 

[bolty58]

16 hours ago, Not in Crawley said:

I wasnt dismissing religion as something people are attaching a cause to - I was alluding to conflicts begetting conflicts, that for most interventions, there is a massive knock on effect. 

Fair points.

[bwfcfan5]

On 16/03/2019 at 23:47, bolty58 said:

Whichever way you want to spin it, the root cause is religion. You can arrive at whatever conclusion you want to - that is your right just as mine is mine.

'Conflicts' I use as evidence. The Irish 'troubles'; Rohinga; every Al Qaeda inspired atrocity; every ISIS inspired atrocity; abortion clinic employees murdered in the US; the Crusades; the gunpowder plot; the Spanish inquisition...........the list is a very long one.

Get our your deerstalker and magnifying glass and play Sherlock Holmes all you want looking for alternative reasons. I am sure 'dispossession' and 'poverty; will come high on your list. When they do, I will point to religious reasons as major contributors to those as well.

If it wasn't religion it would be something else. Some people need to belong to something, to have a badge to include and by definition exclude others. 

Its the same prinicple as football violence I guess. Taking away football doesn't solve the problem. 

[kent_white]

So if violence begats violence then the only logical solution is.........

[Spider]

1 minute ago, kent_white said:

So if violence begats violence then the only logical solution is.........

.......beer

[Tonge moor green jacket]

1 hour ago, Spider said:

.......beer

Women, fucking, curry.

[Youri McAnespie]

4 hours ago, kent_white said:

So if violence begats violence then the only logical solution is.........

Kill Cricket.

[Traf]

2 hours ago, Youri McAnespie said:

Kill Cricket.

Correct.

[deane koontz]

It's refreshing seeing a leader who has a touch of class about them.

[Traf]

43 minutes ago, deane koontz said:

It's refreshing seeing a leader who has a touch of class about them.

Jacinda Ardern?

Yes, very much so.

[bolty58]

Funny how different folk see things differently. Still, you guys up there would probably never have heard of her without this terrorist atrocity.

We get a lot more coverage down here.

[Traf]

1 hour ago, bolty58 said:

Funny how different folk see things differently. Still, you guys up there would probably never have heard of her without this terrorist atrocity.

We get a lot more coverage down here.

Yes, we obviously only get brief coverage of what happens down there.

Perhaps you can correct our opinions of her?

[frank_spencer]

53 minutes ago, Traf said:

Yes, we obviously only get brief coverage of what happens down there.

Perhaps you can correct our opinions of her?

She's a lefty. 

Oh and she wants a debate about removing the British monarch as head of state for NZ. 

2 things guaranteed to upset Bolty 

[Zico]

1 hour ago, frank_spencer said:

She's a lefty. 

Oh and she wants a debate about removing the British monarch as head of state for NZ. 

2 things guaranteed to upset Bolty 

more Trudeau* than Trump then, makes sense

 

*though he's not having a good time at the minute, and is getting a bit Trumpesque

[Tonge moor green jacket]

2 hours ago, Traf said:

Yes, we obviously only get brief coverage of what happens down there.

Perhaps you can correct our opinions of her?

Seem to remember something about her in the past, but can't remember what.

She had time off to have a baby iirc, but that's hardly a hanging offence.

Anyway, going off what we were told by our ex pat poster down there, she needs to get the pollution issue sorted.

[mickbrown]

9 hours ago, bolty58 said:

Funny how different folk see things differently. Still, you guys up there would probably never have heard of her without this terrorist atrocity.

We get a lot more coverage down here.

Of course we’ve heard of her.

We aren’t pig shit thick.