Coronavirus

[Boby Brno]

Matt le Tissi whatsit has gone full on, Tin Foil loon.

 

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, ZicoKelly said:

I dunno what his angle is, but he and gonzo were talking like we don't need any restrictions in place given the nhs wasn't overwhelmed

But if we can't say for sure why that is, why veer from the path we're on

We can do a lot more now than we could in April, May and June

So what exactly, other than a return to the previous normal, are folk looking for?  I'm just happy my daughter is back in nursery, and i hope schools go back so other parents can crack on

Other than that, everything else can wait for me

Don't get me wrong, i get all the economic reasons and I'm currently 50% down on average monthly income

Can't say I'd feel comfortable if we crack on so i can get back to 100% if it means more people start dying

 

Let's see how it turns out, I get your perspective.

It'll be interesing to see how we get out of here.

[bolton va va]

It's sensible to make a gradual return to " normality " so that if the figures start rising again, we can put the brakes on again ( like the holiday quarantines ) rather than letting everybody loose to cough & spit over each other......there'll be no going back then.

[Boby Brno]

Just now, boltondiver said:

Let's see how it turns out, I get your perspective.

It'll be interesing to see how we get out of here.

Respect your views but when you say ‘we’ are you talking about Little old UK or the whole world?

Take a look at what other countries are doing and as I’ve said previously, we are just playing at this.

Of course, the whole world, apart from some notable exceptions, could be wrong. 

 

[Guest]

15 minutes ago, Boby Brno said:

Respect your views but when you say ‘we’ are you talking about Little old UK or the whole world?

Take a look at what other countries are doing and as I’ve said previously, we are just playing at this.

Of course, the whole world, apart from some notable exceptions, could be wrong. 

 

I’m mostly interested in our country, but I don’t wish harm on other countries, and we’re all interconnected.

[birch-chorley]

Whilst it’s safe to say most developed countries have approached the first wave in a similar way, it’s also safe to say that our economy has taken a bigger hit than most 

Partly due to the approach that we took, partly due to the fact that our economy relies on social interaction more than others (service economy etc) 

Question is how does everyone approach the second wave (and the third, fourth, fifth, sixth.....) 

Suffocating our economy further in order to hold on for a vaccine doesn’t seem that palatable to me. It might never come and if it does it might be a similar situation to Winter flu and it’s back every year anyway 

Once the economic impact really starts to bite, job losses rise and millions can’t pay their mortgage public opinion will turn. It won’t be about saving the NHS, it will be about saving jobs. 

On another note, why are we so scared about Winter? Some of the worst areas in Europe and in the US are in the warmer Southern Areas (genuine question) 

[Zico]

1 hour ago, boltondiver said:

Let's see how it turns out, I get your perspective.

It'll be interesing to see how we get out of here.

It will

And I get other perspectives

The general global attitude seems to be caution

Brazil did nowt and they've not flattened the death curve

The states tried to re open and saw an increase

The pattern seems to be that if you try to crack on it doesn't go away

And with so much uncertainty, I'd say be cautious and take it step by step, because depsite fucking around at the start we are on the right path

But I also think the consequence of fucking around is folk don't take it as seriously as perhaps they should

10/20 years ago I'd have a totally point of view

Dare say i would if this had happened in another 10 years either

I just can't afford for any reversal back to full lockdown or to catch it, financially or for my folks wellbeing

Edit: and I'm well aware this whole thing is subjective

Edited August 21, 2020 by ZicoKelly

[Casino]

Have there been any changes made today?

[Zico]

Just now, Casino said:

Have there been any changes made today?

Wigan can go back to lockdown lite in a few days

[radcliffe white]

3 minutes ago, Casino said:

Have there been any changes made today?

Tighter rules in oldham & Blackburn 

still can’t meet the lads at the pub 

[MancWanderer]

3 hours ago, Casino said:

Have there been any changes made today?

Yep. Thanks to Alexandra Park and Werneth I now can’t have anyone in my house or garden. And I can’t visit anyone 

Dont know whether it’s local chatter, media reporting, social media or fact, but word is it’s due to a couple of large families ignoring all the rules and spreading it locally. Fucktards if true. Virtually nothing in neighbouring areas. 

[Alf Hartigan]

Fucking hell fire, is anyone actually sticking to these guidelines. I'm not and I can't think of one other person that is.

[jayjayoghani]

8 hours ago, birch-chorley said:

On another note, why are we so scared about Winter? Some of the worst areas in Europe and in the US are in the warmer Southern Areas (genuine question) 

This interests me. I'm following the pandemic closely in 3 countries, UK, NZ and Australia. I'm suspecting the contagiousness of this virus is affected by temperature, I notice @peelyfeet was talking more humidity. My conclusion isn't that rigorous though I admit. 

Melbourne (coldest capital mainland Australia) has struggled massively with its 2nd wave recently. This is after getting on top seemingly really easily in April when temperatures a lot warmer. Same folk, same measures didn't work as well in June/July. A hotel quarantine failure is responsible of +90% of all cases btw. 

Auckland has struggled with one outbreak, now with over 100 active cases again in little over a week, likely due to a hotel quarantine failure. A lot of spread at a cold storage company. 

Brisbane/Queensland on the other hand with higher winter temperatures, keeps getting small outbreaks but they never seem to cause additional infections.

Edited August 22, 2020 by jayjayoghani
Corrected

[birch-chorley]

6 hours ago, jayjayoghani said:

This interests me. I'm following the pandemic closely in 3 countries, UK, NZ and Australia. I'm suspecting the contagiousness of this virus is affected by temperature, I notice @peelyfeet was talking more humidity. My conclusion isn't that rigorous though I admit. 

Melbourne (coldest capital mainland Australia) has struggled massively with its 2nd wave recently. This is after getting on top seemingly really easily in April when temperatures a lot warmer. Same folk, same measures didn't work as well in June/July. A hotel quarantine failure is responsible of +90% of all cases btw. 

Auckland has struggled with one outbreak, now with over 100 active cases again in little over a week, likely due to a hotel quarantine failure. A lot of spread at a cold storage company. 

Brisbane/Queensland on the other hand with higher winter temperatures, keeps getting small outbreaks but they never seem to cause additional infections.

Some of the worst countries in Europe were originally Spain and Italy through March, April & May (decent weather)

In the US, outside of New York the southern states like Florida and Texas seem to have been hit hard

 

 

[jayjayoghani]

1 hour ago, birch-chorley said:

Some of the worst countries in Europe were originally Spain and Italy through March, April & May (decent weather)

In the US, outside of New York the southern states like Florida and Texas seem to have been hit hard

 

 

Well clearly it's not the only factor. Plus Northern Italy and large parts of Spain are cold in March/April when the bloodbath kicked in.

Combine that with human factors in the UK, like poor health, non-compliance and downright stubbornness and Govt ineptitude, I fear for you all. 

[Biggish Dave]

13 hours ago, radcliffewhite1 said:

Tighter rules in oldham & Blackburn 

still can’t meet the lads at the pub 

Only in certain areas - but there are no pubs left in them areas of blackburn 

[Spider]

12 minutes ago, jayjayoghani said:

Well clearly it's not the only factor. Plus Northern Italy and large parts of Spain are cold in March/April when the bloodbath kicked in.

Combine that with human factors in the UK, like poor health, non-compliance and downright stubbornness and Govt ineptitude, I fear for you all. 

 

Typical unpatriotic response that.

We’ll battle through and win because spitfires, churchill, brexit, stiff upper lip, farage, village cricket, blue passports, crusades, Henry viii, Shakespeare, everyone speaks English, lager lager lager.

Only cowards and unpatriotic types would hide abroad.

[peelyfeet]

2 hours ago, birch-chorley said:

Some of the worst countries in Europe were originally Spain and Italy through March, April & May (decent weather)

In the US, outside of New York the southern states like Florida and Texas seem to have been hit hard

 

 

The theory is low humidity indoors is a big factor. Aircon, heating and poor ventilation create low humidity, dries out and reduces the weight of the droplets and  allows aerosol to float in the air for longer. High humidity, makes the aerosol heavier, and so it drops to the floor. Being outside, the wind massively dilutes. The thinking now is contact transmission is low, its breathing in aerosol that is main form of transmission. Aircon that doesnt take in fresh air  just spreads it over a greater area. There's multople examples of infection tracing , seems to be indoors, small spaces,  no fresh air. There was a choir practice in usa, 61 people, 2.5 hrs in a room, 1 asymptomatic person, 32 confirmed as caught it within days,  20 suspected.

Edited August 22, 2020 by peelyfeet

[jayjayoghani]

27 minutes ago, Spider said:

 

Typical unpatriotic response that.

We’ll battle through and win because spitfires, churchill, brexit, stiff upper lip, farage, village cricket, blue passports, crusades, Henry viii, Shakespeare, everyone speaks English, lager lager lager.

Only cowards and unpatriotic types would hide abroad.

Fwiw, hope I'm wrong! 

[Farrelli]

10 minutes ago, peelyfeet said:

The theory is low humidity indoors is a big factor. Aircon, heating and poor ventilation create low humidity, dries out and reduces the weight of the droplets and  allows aerosol to float in the air for longer. High humidity, makes the aerosol heavier, and so it drops to the floor. Being outside the wind massively dilutes. The thinking now is contact transmission is low, its breathing in aerosol that is main form of transmission. Aircon that doesnt take in fresh air  just spreads it over a greater area. There's multople examples of infection tracing , seems to be indoors, small spaces,  no fresh air. There was a choir practice in usa, 61 people, 2.5 hrs in a room, 1 asymptomatic person, 32 confirmed as caught it within days,  20 suspected.

That seems to be a very plausible theory.  It does beg the question how schools will ever be normal again.

[peelyfeet]

1 minute ago, Farrelli said:

That seems to be a very plausible theory.  It does beg the question how schools will ever be normal again.

If they can sort out getting fresh air in, will help a lot. I'm no specislist,  but from what I've read, most aircon and heating systems  don't use fresh air, they just alter  the temp of stale air and blow it around. I don't know if the school guidlines includes ventilation. Won't be easy when it's crap weather.

[jayjayoghani]

21 minutes ago, peelyfeet said:

The theory is low humidity indoors is a big factor. Aircon, heating and poor ventilation create low humidity, dries out and reduces the weight of the droplets and  allows aerosol to float in the air for longer. High humidity, makes the aerosol heavier, and so it drops to the floor. Being outside the wind massively dilutes. The thinking now is contact transmission is low, its breathing in aerosol that is main form of transmission. Aircon that doesnt take in fresh air  just spreads it over a greater area. There's multople examples of infection tracing , seems to be indoors, small spaces,  no fresh air. There was a choir practice in usa, 61 people, 2.5 hrs in a room, 1 asymptomatic person, 32 confirmed as caught it within days,  20 suspected.

Auckland and Melbourne have sufficiently cold winter climates, combined with poor building quality would mean air con heating is used a lot this time of year.

[jayjayoghani]

4 minutes ago, peelyfeet said:

If they can sort out getting fresh air in, will help a lot. I'm no specislist,  but from what I've read, most aircon and heating systems  don't use fresh air, they just alter  the temp of stale air and blow it around. I don't know if the school guidlines includes ventilation. Won't be easy when it's crap weather.

It's not my expertise but I know facade engineers recommend better insulated buildings that are absolutely airtight e.g. passivhaus standard. Managed ventilation systems via ducting and heat exchangers provide the clean air, and optimum environment of around 20 degrees and 40-60% humidity. Aircon not required. 

Only helps new designs obviously..

Edited August 22, 2020 by jayjayoghani

[Traf]

4 minutes ago, peelyfeet said:

If they can sort out getting fresh air in, will help a lot. I'm no specislist,  but from what I've read, most aircon and heating systems  don't use fresh air, they just alter  the temp of stale air and blow it around. I don't know if the school guidlines includes ventilation. Won't be easy when it's crap weather.

Schools plan to have all windows open where possible.

[peelyfeet]

1 minute ago, Traf said:

Schools plan to have all windows open where possible.

I hope that means, where there's a window, it will be open, and not shut, if it gets cold outside.