BLM

[miamiwhite]

32 minutes ago, wanderer1984 said:

 

And ironically the same country where an Englishman now needs more proof of identity to enter certain premises than it does for an illegal immigrant to enter the actual country.

[bolty58]

9 hours ago, DazBob said:

Okay, I think it's a good thing, there you go.

I don't need to justify why I think it's a good thing. You, on the other hand, first thing you do is put a negative slant on it... and to be honest, I'd have expected nothing less.

I also didn't resort to calling you a prick.

 

No. You have a favourite 'new' word which we are all painfully aware of.

Now then, much as I don't really get it other than to see it as positive discrimination virtue signalling, I have no problem in celebrating the lives of Marvin Gaye, Aretha Franklin, Prince Buster, King Stitt, Sir Coxsone Downbeat, Diana Ross, Reggie White, Antonio Freeman, Jay Jay Okocha, Toots, Archie Bell, Ramsey Lewis, Wilson Pickett, Clyde McPhatter, Eddie Floyd, Etta James, James Brown, Eusebio, Edson Arantes do Nascimento...........I could be here for hours.

I had already decided a few ice cold Pabst Blue Ribbons tonight whilst I actively celebrate quite a few of these fine peoples achievements from my armchair with my headphones on.

The difference is, I will be doing it because I want to - not because I want to display my virtuosity to some insignificant wankstain or other.

 

 

[Ani]

11 hours ago, miamiwhite said:

And ironically the same country where an Englishman now needs more proof of identity to enter certain premises than it does for an illegal immigrant to enter the actual country.

Let’s compare like for like then. What premises in this country do you need proof of identity to enter illegally ? 

[Ani]

5 hours ago, bolty58 said:

No. You have a favourite 'new' word which we are all painfully aware of.

Now then, much as I don't really get it other than to see it as positive discrimination virtue signalling, I have no problem in celebrating the lives of Marvin Gaye, Aretha Franklin, Prince Buster, King Stitt, Sir Coxsone Downbeat, Diana Ross, Reggie White, Antonio Freeman, Jay Jay Okocha, Toots, Archie Bell, Ramsey Lewis, Wilson Pickett, Clyde McPhatter, Eddie Floyd, Etta James, James Brown, Eusebio, Edson Arantes do Nascimento...........I could be here for hours.

I had already decided a few ice cold Pabst Blue Ribbons tonight whilst I actively celebrate quite a few of these fine peoples achievements from my armchair with my headphones on.

The difference is, I will be doing it because I want to - not because I want to display my virtuosity to some insignificant wankstain or other.

 

 

So you think it is a good idea ? Remembering and celebrating the cultural impact of the folk you mention ? Obviously some people will be motivated by the ‘look at me mentality’ but if you listening to the music you clearly love is passed onto younger folk who realise what music can and should be like compared to the shite today got to be a good thing. If as well they understand the circumstances that black people lived in America whilst making that music so we never go there again. It is a good thing. 

Edited October 2, 2020 by Ani

[Ani]

11 hours ago, wanderer1984 said:

 

Let’s start with every university has a Christian students society and a catholic one so the Jewish students group is nonsense. 
The thing he ignores is that all the legislation he talks about has been bought in to level the playing field. 
There is a black police officers group as the police could not attract black officers because of its own history. Would anyone seriously claim there was no racism in the police in the past ? 

[bolty58]

20 minutes ago, Ani said:

So you think it is a good idea ? Remembering and celebrating the cultural impact of the folk you mention ? Obviously some people will be motivated by the ‘look at me mentality’ but if you listening to the music you clearly love is passed onto younger folk who realise what music can and should be like compared to the shite today got to be a good thing. If as well they understand the circumstances that black people lived in America whilst making that music so we never go there again. It is a good thing. 

Errrrr, yes, no, I don't know.

Are you being indecisive Bolty? I don't know. Plink!

[bolty58]

21 minutes ago, Ani said:

Let’s start with every university has a Christian students society and a catholic one so the Jewish students group is nonsense. 
The thing he ignores is that all the legislation he talks about has been bought in to level the playing field. 
There is a black police officers group as the police could not attract black officers because of its own history. Would anyone seriously claim there was no racism in the police in the past ? 

There was racism everywhere in the past. The Germans bombed our chippy.

So fucking what? As Mr. Freeman says, there isn't an issue if you'd just stop talking about it.

Do you concede that there are those trying to profit from this? Maybe treated more leniently under the law than us despicable white honkys? Others simply trying to just feel good about their displayed virtues when deep down they are the true racists which is why they over compensate so much?

Thought not.

Edited October 2, 2020 by bolty58

[DazBob]

5 hours ago, bolty58 said:

Now then, much as I don't really get it other than to see it as positive discrimination virtue signalling, I have no problem in celebrating the lives of Marvin Gaye, Aretha Franklin, Prince Buster, King Stitt, Sir Coxsone Downbeat, Diana Ross, Reggie White, Antonio Freeman, Jay Jay Okocha, Toots, Archie Bell, Ramsey Lewis, Wilson Pickett, Clyde McPhatter, Eddie Floyd, Etta James, James Brown, Eusebio, Edson Arantes do Nascimento...........I could be here for hours.

I had already decided a few ice cold Pabst Blue Ribbons tonight whilst I actively celebrate quite a few of these fine peoples achievements from my armchair with my headphones on.

 

 

I'm reading this and can't help but see David Brent keep listing his favourite black actors to the only black employee.

[Ani]

55 minutes ago, bolty58 said:

There was racism everywhere in the past. The Germans bombed our chippy.

So fucking what? As Mr. Freeman says, there isn't an issue if you'd just stop talking about it.

Do you concede that there are those trying to profit from this? Maybe treated more leniently under the law than us despicable white honkys? Others simply trying to just feel good about their displayed virtues when deep down they are the true racists which is why they over compensate so much?

Thought not.

Think I prefer you when you indecisive.

strange you ask a question then assume my answer despite the fact you read my earlier post that agreed some people do this say ‘look at me’.

might be you age or too much sun. 😎

Not sure I agree that just stopping talking about it makes it go away. I see plenty of moral indignation from plastic lefties that is clearly for show and this does damage to the genuine cases. The ‘because I am black innit bro’ movement is almost a parody. 
On balance over your lifetime do you really think you have been discriminated against as a white heterosexual male ? 

[Zico]

1 hour ago, DazBob said:

I'm reading this and can't help but see David Brent keep listing his favourite black actors to the only black employee.

 

[Ani]

11 minutes ago, Mr Grey said:

Let's get away from colour and let's just have Police Officers.

I'm an Examinations Manager, In my network we have men, women, white, Asian, black etc.....

We have one group, it's called 'The National Association of Examinations Officers' (NAEO). All of us do a very similar job, we all support each other and we are all in regional network groups of all colours and gender.

And has the NAEO every had issues recruiting members from the BAME community ?

 

[Ani]

But if people just do not apply ? 

[mickbrown]

14 hours ago, wanderer1984 said:

 

If I was that way inclined I’d point out he doesn’t look English. Just saying. 

[athywhite1958]

23 minutes ago, Ani said:

But if people just do not apply ? 

If people don't apply then surely they don't want the job, 

[Ani]

11 minutes ago, athywhite1958 said:

If people don't apply then surely they don't want the job, 

Or they think the organisation would not want them or are worried about reaction from their own community

 

To counter this a group is set up so they can speak to people who have been through this and see what support is there. Coppers on the job have somewhere to turn to discuss the same issues with fellow officers. 
 

Is that really bad ? 
 

In London 20 years ago at the time of the McPherson report 2% of coppers were from a BAME background. It is now 14%. (Progress). Think about 40% of population are from BAME (need to profess more) * figures from a BBC report. 
 

So why would people be annoyed that there is dedicated group within the police to support officers who encounter specific issues because they are from BAME community ? 

[athywhite1958]

The last 2 companies I have worked for (one of them I was responsible for recruitment in the North West) have Employee Assistance Programmes (EAP) which is there for everybody and are as diverse as anything I have seen.

If they aren't applying because of an adverse reaction from others then that is the fault of the community or social group they mix in, if they genuinely want to 'get on' they will apply for jobs regardless of what others think.

As Mr Grey said all certain information on applications were blacked scored out so that you hadn't a clue who they were

[Ani]

8 minutes ago, athywhite1958 said:

The last 2 companies I have worked for (one of them I was responsible for recruitment in the North West) have Employee Assistance Programmes (EAP) which is there for everybody and are as diverse as anything I have seen.

If they aren't applying because of an adverse reaction from others then that is the fault of the community or social group they mix in, if they genuinely want to 'get on' they will apply for jobs regardless of what others think.

As Mr Grey said all certain information on applications were blacked scored out so that you hadn't a clue who they were

20 years ago the McPherson report came out and highlighted the issues the Met Police had/have. Comparisons with other companies are not like for like. 

Edited October 2, 2020 by Ani

[Ani]

1 minute ago, Mr Grey said:

Birch has done this to death, and did a bloody good job of putting his opinion across.

He did put over a good argument about levels at senior levels in businesses. 
I am still not sure why people object to having an association that represents black officers.  

[Ani]

Just now, Mr Grey said:

I don't object, if it's about equality there is no need.

Equality: the state of being equal, especially in status, rights and opportunities regarding race, gender, disability etc...

How do you measure equality ? The BAME community is under represented in the police. So based on that outcome it is not equal. 
So having an association that is dedicated to helping those officers (current and potential) to help over come barriers, which I imagine can initially be very much from other members of the BAME community is a bad idea how ? 
Young black kid wants to be a copper but is worried he will be called a coconut goes to a recruitment fair and meets another black person who is a copper who explains how the black police officer association helps by putting them in touch with others who have been through it. 

[Tonge moor green jacket]

18 minutes ago, Ani said:

How do you measure equality ? The BAME community is under represented in the police. So based on that outcome it is not equal. 
So having an association that is dedicated to helping those officers (current and potential) to help over come barriers, which I imagine can initially be very much from other members of the BAME community is a bad idea how ? 
Young black kid wants to be a copper but is worried he will be called a coconut goes to a recruitment fair and meets another black person who is a copper who explains how the black police officer association helps by putting them in touch with others who have been through it. 

There is a federation which protects all officers from all sorts of issues. Perhaps speaking to these will provide the information they need, both about race issues and all manner of other issues that a young officer may encounter. 

[Ani]

9 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

There is a federation which protects all officers from all sorts of issues. Perhaps speaking to these will provide the information they need, both about race issues and all manner of other issues that a young officer may encounter. 

Young black lad comes from a community where people do not trust the police. Do you honestly think having an association that is dedicated to help kids like him overcome barriers run by other black folk is harmful ? 

[Tonge moor green jacket]

1 minute ago, Ani said:

Young black lad comes from a community where people do not trust the police. Do you honestly think having an association that is dedicated to help kids like him overcome barriers run by other black folk is harmful ? 

Potentially, yes. By its very name and existence it has the potential to be divisive. A federation offering precisely the same support and advice, representing everyone irrespective of skin colour etc must be better.

Turn it round, do you honestly believe having such a federation is harmful?

[Ani]

40 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

Potentially, yes. By its very name and existence it has the potential to be divisive. A federation offering precisely the same support and advice, representing everyone irrespective of skin colour etc must be better.

Turn it round, do you honestly believe having such a federation is harmful?

Why would the federation be harmful ? 
 

I just looked and the black police federation has 4000 members so clearly people in this situation think it has some benefit. 

[Ani]

26 minutes ago, Mr Grey said:

How about going in to Schools, that's what the Police, Fireman, Ambulance personnel etc did when I was at school, and with schools being more diverse than they have ever been, your targeting ALL young people.

It's a career choice, and to be honest I have see a lot of BAME police officers, so obviously the push for more has worked, but how many white people didn't get those jobs because they weren't in that bracket? Now as you know that's positive discrimination. 

If it's about equality and the best person for the job, race and gender should not come into it.

You keep trying to turn it to positive discrimination and totally on recruitment. 
The discussion is why is having an association to support black coppers a bad thing. 
If there is this positive discrimination you talk about why are BAME communities under represented in the police force ? 
If you want this to be equal and a community is under represented for whatever reason should there be actions to balance it out ? 
 

[Tonge moor green jacket]

4 minutes ago, Ani said:

Why would the federation be harmful ? 
 

I just looked and the black police federation has 4000 members so clearly people in this situation think it has some benefit. 

You're mixing things up.

The police federation is not the black police officers association. 

So I'll ask again, is the police federation harmful?

I'm sure you'll say no, and given its size, scope and representation it isnt an organisation that, by its existence, excludes the majority.