BLM

[royal white]

8 minutes ago, Not in Crawley said:

Actually, its nice these things being discussed. There are still loads of folk who feel uncomfortable. Im still glad football is forcing these problems into life.

Why is anyone upset about a black power salute? More power to them.

pretty sure a black guy was the most powerful man on the planet not long back. What kind of power are you implying that “them” have

[royal white]

18 minutes ago, Casino said:

The club statement is from june

Maybe we need a new one

To childish apparently 

[Boby Brno]

20 minutes ago, Not in Crawley said:

Actually, its nice these things being discussed. There are still loads of folk who feel uncomfortable. Im still glad football is forcing these problems into life.

Why is anyone upset about a black power salute? More power to them.

No arguments from me brother. Keep the faith.

 

[Not in Crawley]

14 minutes ago, royal white said:

pretty sure a black guy was the most powerful man on the planet not long back. What kind of power are you implying that “them” have

So racism has ended? 

Give it a rest, why do you keep banging against this?

[royal white]

Just now, Not in Crawley said:

So racism has ended? 

Give it a rest, why do you keep banging against this?

Who said racism has ended? Banging against what? 

Im interested in what additional power “them“ should have 

[Not in Crawley]

1 minute ago, royal white said:

Who said racism has ended? Banging against what? 

Im interested in what additional power “them“ should have 

You didn't really understand Rudy's post did you? 

Its not about power, its about equitable power. Are you OK with that?

[royal white]

So you don’t want them to have more power just equitable. Glad you cleared that up. 
 

 

[Not in Crawley]

8 hours ago, kent_white said:

How about. Anybody British person who feels enough collective shame for crimes against humanity commited centuries before they were born can apply to have an extra 25% taxed from their wages and sent to redress the balance in the countries we used to occupy? 

That way the players/lefties/cultural Marxists/snowflakes can put their money where their mouths are and everybody who thinks it's a load of old bollocks doesn't have to.

I imagine they'd soon pipe down.

 

You're a bright bloke, I hope that's an ironic pisstake

[Not in Crawley]

4 minutes ago, royal white said:

So you don’t want them to have more power just equitable. Glad you cleared that up. 
 

 

Yes, what is difficult for you to understand? 

Despite the obvious.

[royal white]

Just now, Not in Crawley said:

Yes, what is difficult for you to understand? 

Despite the obvious.

I think it’s you struggling to understand. 
 

Players are kneeling, some fans think this is in support of BLM. 

Some fans don’t agree with BLM and boo (within their rights) to disapprove.

Clubs need to make it clear what their players are kneeling for. 

Millwall introduced linking arms which was a success, maybe other clubs should follow? 
 

it’s that simple 
 

To top it off we have fans that think they know why fans are booing and say they’re going to tell the police. Jesus wept. Please let us know where you sit so we can watch you go and grass.

What a time to be alive 
 

 

[Not in Crawley]

16 hours ago, gonzo said:

Or theyre pissed off footballers are taking it up on themselves to display support for the recent movement which has been hijacked by far left groups and has included a summer of destruction.

Maybe they dont like the fact the gesture continues to create divide on the issue when in their own personal lives its as multicultural as you get down then there? 

All one big community, a masively diverse mob of lads that have travelled the country together, best mates, family members, mixed race familes etc, all one big strong community that have a reputation for just that. Black, white, indian whatever theyre all together. They support black lives every single day and vice versa. 

They go to the match and youve got players that far from detached from any life struggles making gestures, supporting a movement that for them simply isnt there.

Youll say its ignorant to think like that,but its really not. Its life.

 

You are right to be angry, wrong to be angry on this point.

Thats where those boos come from. Misaligned cultural battles.

I'm glad players are taking the knee, its a lovely way to show solidarity, and to show that they can have a voice.

You don't agree? You made a decent shift from scribbling BMP logos on schoolbooks, give this the same patience and understanding.

[Not in Crawley]

Just now, royal white said:

I think it’s you struggling to understand. 
 

Players are kneeling, some fans think this is in support of BLM. 

Some fans don’t agree with BLM and boo (within their rights) to disapprove.

Clubs need to make it clear what their players are kneeling for. 

Millwall introduced linking arms which was a success, maybe other clubs should follow? 
 

it’s that simple 
 

To top it off we have fans that think they know why fans are booing and say they’re going to tell the police. Jesus wept. Please let us know where you sit so we can watch you go and grass.

What a time to be alive 
 

 

Again, what is wrong with a Black Power movement? And what is wrong with every community showing that everyone within that is welcome, and there are no gatekeepers? 

Grass? You are a child. Its by not calling out, this insidious crap happens. It takes more balls to tell some dickhead to stop booing when  players take the knee, than it does to ignore it. I'm just content that the days of fellas like you are numbered. 

[royal white]

6 minutes ago, Not in Crawley said:

Again, what is wrong with a Black Power movement? And what is wrong with every community showing that everyone within that is welcome, and there are no gatekeepers? 

Grass? You are a child. Its by not calling out, this insidious crap happens. It takes more balls to tell some dickhead to stop booing when  players take the knee, than it does to ignore it. I'm just content that the days of fellas like you are numbered. 

But you have said you’re going to report people for booing even though you don’t know why they’re booing, do you realise how much of a wet wipe you’re coming across as. Pathetic. 
 

If a player chose not to kneel would you say he’s racist? 

Edited December 11, 2020 by royal white

[MickyD]

7 hours ago, Not in Crawley said:

You're a bright bloke, I hope that's an ironic pisstake

You’re also a bright bloke, I’m amazed you needed to ask.

[gonzo]

6 hours ago, Not in Crawley said:

You are right to be angry, wrong to be angry on this point.

Thats where those boos come from. Misaligned cultural battles.

I'm glad players are taking the knee, its a lovely way to show solidarity, and to show that they can have a voice.

You don't agree? You made a decent shift from scribbling BMP logos on schoolbooks, give this the same patience and understanding.

Woah baby...Im not angry! 

You say

 "Thats where those boos come from. Misaligned cultural battles."

Im saying they dont, and know for an absolute fact they dont. Ive been over why they dont. You called me narrow minded or whatever, but in that particular incident ive explained why those booes weren't just a kneejerk show of racism.

As for the wider issue of racism, of course it exists, of course its still a huge problem. However the systematic race thing just doesnt stack up against the actual data, as birch explains a lot better than me.

Of course people want equality and equal opportunities for all races. But it will always be impossible when, as simplistic as its sounds, you dont have equal amounts of people.

You say my life experience offers a very isolated view, I say yours does. Your not at street level. I am. 

I work amongst some of the most impoverished areas in the UK, theres no white privilege in any of those places, trust me.

My sister in law is black is a social care boss across the north west. Not much white privilege across that lot either. 

A good mate of mine knows the millwall supporter groups, that where my information comes from on that matter. As ive said before, its as multicultural as it gets down there.

Like Ive said before, your telling a particular group of people there is a problem that they just cant see.

Its making a divide and makes an uncomfortable situation, families and friends that have grown up and lived together are all of a sudden being told they are different.

Thats why people dont like it. 

[birch-chorley]

7 hours ago, Not in Crawley said:

Again, what is wrong with a Black Power movement? And what is wrong with every community showing that everyone within that is welcome, and there are no gatekeepers? 

Grass? You are a child. Its by not calling out, this insidious crap happens. It takes more balls to tell some dickhead to stop booing when  players take the knee, than it does to ignore it. I'm just content that the days of fellas like you are numbered. 

Still being shitty rather than supporting your belief in systemic racism with some ONS data 

Please share with us some data that clearly shows our system (Education, Healthcare, Welfare etc) is racist 

Rather than post hundreds of shitty posts, you could have shared ten that backed up your points with the ONS data that you demanded from me

I honestly think it’s not there and that’s why you won’t share it. You’ve probably read something somewhere that twists the data sets to put the White population at the top of the data when in reality the ONS splits out ethnicity and whites tend to be mid table at best 

[Duck Egg]

1 hour ago, birch-chorley said:

Still being shitty rather than supporting your belief in systemic racism with some ONS data 

Please share with us some data that clearly shows our system (Education, Healthcare, Welfare etc) is racist 

Rather than post hundreds of shitty posts, you could have shared ten that backed up your points with the ONS data that you demanded from me

Statistically, are black people more likely to be subjected to stop and search, over represented in prison, under represented in the boardroom and universities?

Systemic and institutional racism is far harder to quantify as it's more of an idea or notion.  The death of Stephen Lawrence being a prime example.

I think the UK has made great strides in supporting and promoting racial equality in our society but equally I'm sure there's much more still to be done.  I'm a white bloke with, I think, a comfortable upbringing and lifestyle, I'm not likely to recognise inequality that easily.

[gonzo]

Up here white males 16-24 are more likely to be stop and searched. Why is that?

There also less representation of people in the boardroom room of people from poverty ridden back grounds.

Like Kent says, poverty leads inequality. Not the colour of skin.

Its totally imbalanced to just pick random stats without delving in to the reason for those stats.

Theres not a chance imo somone in this day and age is getting denied a job or opportunity because of the colour of their skin in this country. Their background yes, sheer colour of skin, ethnicity. No.

 

 

[Duck Egg]

20 minutes ago, gonzo said:

Up here white males 16-24 are more likely to be stop and searched. Why is that?

There also less representation of people in the boardroom room of people from poverty ridden back grounds.

Like Kent says, poverty leads inequality. Not the colour of skin.

Its totally imbalanced to just pick random stats without delving in to the reason for those stats.

Theres not a chance imo somone in this day and age is getting denied a job or opportunity because of the colour of their skin in this country. Their background yes, sheer colour of skin, ethnicity. No.

 

 

I agree with much of that.  Definitely, poverty leads much inequality.

I can't agree with your last paragraph though.  I suspect there's still deep seated prejudices within some boardrooms and HR depts.  I'd like to think that will get better as the older generations retire.

[gonzo]

15 minutes ago, Duck Egg said:

I agree with much of that.  Definitely, poverty leads much inequality.

I can't agree with your last paragraph though.  I suspect there's still deep seated prejudices within some boardrooms and HR depts.  I'd like to think that will get better as the older generations retire.

Indeed. Think folk forget we are still pretty early in the integration process in the grand scheme of things. In numbers obvs.

The data will a match up in years to come.

Then we will be kneeling for asians

 

 

[Not in Crawley]

Poverty does lead to inequality, thats blindingly obvious.

Look at who lives in those areas. Thats the reality.

As for folk not being denied at job opportunity, again you are coming to it from the wrong angle. You are thinking about actually getting into the room in the first place and people making a call based on skin colour. 

From certain backgrounds there isn't the idea that a) certain jobs exist b) how to even get in the career c) lack of representation even if they get they d) educational boundaries

Again, Gonzo, you are coming to this position from an overly simplistic position, and it is damaging because then people who would support changenlike yourself, fail to recognise the inherent problem.

[kent_white]

1 minute ago, Not in Crawley said:

Poverty does lead to inequality, thats blindingly obvious.

Look at who lives in those areas. Thats the reality.

As for folk not being denied at job opportunity, again you are coming to it from the wrong angle. You are thinking about actually getting into the room in the first place and people making a call based on skin colour. 

From certain backgrounds there isn't the idea that a) certain jobs exist b) how to even get in the career c) lack of representation even if they get they d) educational boundaries

Again, Gonzo, you are coming to this position from an overly simplistic position, and it is damaging because then people who would support changenlike yourself, fail to recognise the inherent problem.

I agree with parts of this. Although I think it's also overly simplistic to just pick 'race' or 'skin colour' as the main driver as to why people aren't getting 'into the room'. Although it's probably easier to do a study on as it's much easier to quantify as opposed to something more abstract like 'class'.

Let's take what you're saying as read though. What changes would you like to see happen right now to improve things? And I really mean institutional changes rather than societal ones.

[kent_white]

I remember learning about a concept called 'self fulfilling prophecy' when I was younger and did sociology for a bit.

The idea is that if you grow up being told and therefore thinking that the world is pitted against you - you'll have poorer outcomes irrespective of whether the world is actually pitted against you (that's a really basic definition but it gives you the gist). 

It's always stuck with me that - and it's one of the reasons I think telling kids that they live in a system which is institutionally racist is such a dangerous idea. You'd better be damned sure what your saying is actually true to a significant degree. Otherwise you risk doing more harm than good.

[Escobarp]

My missus works for a bank. She has a big hand in recruitment policy and control from a risk perspective. 
I had the conversation with her the other day about their policy. They use software which removes gender race name etc from the applications and cv’s. They then shortlist. I asked her what happens if they get a shortlist of 8 white men from that exercise. She said they drop down the list of candidates until they find a woman and someone from an ethic background. This then displaces two of the white male candidates. 

obviously i asked was that fair and was that not discriminatory? She said yes it most likely was but they have a gender and race imbalance in their organization so are addressing it. 
 

So much for best person gets the job 

[Rudy]

1 minute ago, Escobarp said:

My missus works for a bank. She has a big hand in recruitment policy and control from a risk perspective. 
I had the conversation with her the other day about their policy. They use software which removes gender race name etc from the applications and cv’s. They then shortlist. I asked her what happens if they get a shortlist of 8 white men from that exercise. She said they drop down the list of candidates until they find a woman and someone from an ethic background. This then displaces two of the white male candidates. 

obviously i asked was that fair and was that not discriminatory? She said yes it most likely was but they have a gender and race imbalance in their organization so are addressing it. 
 

So much for best person gets the job 

I honestly honestly think that’s absolute horseshit. 
 

Not only is that not looking at the best person for the role but that’s also identifying people because of their race, there’s a certain irony in that. 
Next year I’ll have to create my own team of fitness and medical staff to create a rehab team. I’ll go off their experience, CV and general feel for them.

If that fails I’ll pick the one with the biggest tits.