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54 minutes ago, ZicoKelly said:

Surely if he can get conference players to play his way he can get league two players too

Of course. I suppose its identifying them, presumably he and his team did that last year.

This year is more moneyball isnt it, possibly with input from above. 

We'll have to see.

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What do visiting managers say to their players just before sending their players out? "These blokes think they are Barcelona with their swanky stadium and tippy tappy building form the back... ta

Starting to get on my tits now this fucking idiot. Weve heard it all before pal. The only issue with our performances is you trying make a gaggle of spastics play like barca-fucking-lona.

And to think when we were in the lower reaches of the champ and in L1 some on here had us believe the Calibre of players we had were unable to play short sharp passing like this.    yet you’ve

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12 hours ago, Youri McAnespie said:

BEN t'other neet - Brown shoes with a suit...nay

And Tobias sat alongside favvered a victim of 'Des'...

Six games.

Day time, brown shoes are ok. Night time or evening, not ever.
 

That was the advice from a former colleague who was from very high ‘stock’. Public school, parent was a diplomat in Malaya and he spoke the language fluently, he has two former Bolton mayors in his lineage, a proper toff but the nicest bloke you’d ever meet. (Why he ended up a fireman, I’ll never know) but anyway, his upbringing was such that he knew when brown shoes were ok and when not.

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Just reading IE's post match comments, "Sometimes when you have 3 centre backs they are not as comfortable building attacks as a fullback or a midfield player....so I put an extra foward in who would drop back into space and enable full backs to get higher up the pitch.  I thought we could build attacks better using the midfield pivot...we have only been working at it a week but the results were really good.  I saw it last week and I think the decision has paid off".  Honestly I'm encouraged that he's changed it, but how could he not see that earlier?  Why wouldn't all of the above be the case since the 1st training session?  It feels like we've wasted a month, and that the recruitment has been flawed.  Its been built around wingbacks, so we have no wingers and about 6 centre backs.  Yes it has to be 4 at the back but we need the players to implement it, at the moment the excellent Delfounso is arguably playing out of position to compensate.  I thought the IE model was all based on having round pegs in round holes? 

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5 hours ago, Johnnyrotten said:

Just reading IE's post match comments, "Sometimes when you have 3 centre backs they are not as comfortable building attacks as a fullback or a midfield player....so I put an extra foward in who would drop back into space and enable full backs to get higher up the pitch.  I thought we could build attacks better using the midfield pivot...we have only been working at it a week but the results were really good.  I saw it last week and I think the decision has paid off".  Honestly I'm encouraged that he's changed it, but how could he not see that earlier?  Why wouldn't all of the above be the case since the 1st training session?  It feels like we've wasted a month, and that the recruitment has been flawed.  Its been built around wingbacks, so we have no wingers and about 6 centre backs.  Yes it has to be 4 at the back but we need the players to implement it, at the moment the excellent Delfounso is arguably playing out of position to compensate.  I thought the IE model was all based on having round pegs in round holes? 

The simple answer to all of that is that he and the players need and deserve time. Competitive game time

Breaking it down to the specific points you make, either needs somebody who is close to the squad everyday and analysing everything they do. Or educated guesswork as fans. Apologies if you’re part of the coaching team.

But I’ve got 5 mins so I’ll play along.

how could he not see that earlier?  Why wouldn't all of the above be the case since the 1st training session?  Maybe he did, but wanted more than one session to work on Plan A. Maybe he didn’t because he hadn’t seen these players play competitively together and he’s is still looking at combinations in different formations.  

It feels like we've wasted a month, and that the recruitment has been flawed.

Really? Any time spent working with these players on various formations is time well spent. If you’re suggesting recruitment is flawed then you’ve either written these players off after 2 league games or you’ve insider knowledge that the manager and players are wasting their time on the training pitch.

Its been built around wingbacks, so we have no wingers and about 6 centre backs. 

IE damned if he does, damned if he doesn’t here. He’s quickly recognised another formation might (and did on Saturday) work. Maybe based on the fact that the players implemented this better suggests the players are more versatile than you give them credit for. And that IE hasn’t thrown all his eggs into the “5 at the back” basket.


Yes it has to be 4 at the back but we need the players to implement it,

Why does it have to be 4? And what is your expertise with these players to know exactly what formations they can/can’t play in? Maybe he wants them to be fluid enough to play in a variety of formations based on the opposition he’s playing?

at the moment the excellent Delfounso is arguably playing out of position to compensate. 

I understand he’s played left on a front 3 numerous times in his career. Even if I’m wrong I’d trust IE knows whether he can/can’t do this and whether he would be effective/comfortable in this role.

Not seen anything yet that isn’t round pegs in round holes whatever formation he’s played. And even if my opinion was wrong, it’s the opinion of IE that matters. 

 

 

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Still can’t believe folk are questioning him at this stage already.  We’ve just had our best performance , granted we lost and that’s a shitter, but the improvement was there for all to see. We will finish minimum playoffs this year and I will gladly have a sizeable charity bet with anyone that believes otherwise. 

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3 hours ago, Escobarp said:

Still can’t believe folk are questioning him at this stage already.  We’ve just had our best performance , granted we lost and that’s a shitter, but the improvement was there for all to see. We will finish minimum playoffs this year and I will gladly have a sizeable charity bet with anyone that believes otherwise. 

Yep, not much to disagree with there.

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14 hours ago, desperado said:

 

The simple answer to all of that is that he and the players need and deserve time. Competitive game time

Breaking it down to the specific points you make, either needs somebody who is close to the squad everyday and analysing everything they do. Or educated guesswork as fans. Apologies if you’re part of the coaching team.

But I’ve got 5 mins so I’ll play along.

how could he not see that earlier?  Why wouldn't all of the above be the case since the 1st training session?  Maybe he did, but wanted more than one session to work on Plan A. Maybe he didn’t because he hadn’t seen these players play competitively together and he’s is still looking at combinations in different formations.  

It feels like we've wasted a month, and that the recruitment has been flawed.

Really? Any time spent working with these players on various formations is time well spent. If you’re suggesting recruitment is flawed then you’ve either written these players off after 2 league games or you’ve insider knowledge that the manager and players are wasting their time on the training pitch.

Its been built around wingbacks, so we have no wingers and about 6 centre backs. 

IE damned if he does, damned if he doesn’t here. He’s quickly recognised another formation might (and did on Saturday) work. Maybe based on the fact that the players implemented this better suggests the players are more versatile than you give them credit for. And that IE hasn’t thrown all his eggs into the “5 at the back” basket.


Yes it has to be 4 at the back but we need the players to implement it,

Why does it have to be 4? And what is your expertise with these players to know exactly what formations they can/can’t play in? Maybe he wants them to be fluid enough to play in a variety of formations based on the opposition he’s playing?

at the moment the excellent Delfounso is arguably playing out of position to compensate. 

I understand he’s played left on a front 3 numerous times in his career. Even if I’m wrong I’d trust IE knows whether he can/can’t do this and whether he would be effective/comfortable in this role.

Not seen anything yet that isn’t round pegs in round holes whatever formation he’s played. And even if my opinion was wrong, it’s the opinion of IE that matters. 

 

 

Thanks for taking the trouble to respond/debate, although not really a need for the “coach/insider” refs, when did football fans lose the right to debate the manager’s tactics? If only the manager’s opinion matters were we wrong to debate Hill’s use of Bridcutt at centre back, etc?

I’ll agree to differ on a couple of points but recognise the sense in what you’re saying.  In general, you’re happy with the time spent working on one formation, fine, I think it should have been sorted out before the 4th competitive match and I think he may have signed a winger or 2 if he’d realised earlier (and may still do) with less emphasis on so many centre backs.  His comment about them not always being comfortable passers compared to midfielders – seems a logical observation whether it’s the 1st training session or the 40th.  

I’ve not written any players off, they may all turn out to be great for us, but it did look like we were short of right sided players when the young striker came on in that position v FGR and looked out of position and not ready yet (presume that would have been Politic if fit?).

I did say how pleased I was that he could change the system, most of us wanted that (reading comments on here), and he did.  That’s a huge positive, compared to the previous 2 managers repeating the same mistakes.

I think it has to be 4 at the back with this current set of defenders/wing backs unless we want to play a “backs to the wall game” eg against a team we expect to be dominated by (hopefully none in Div 2).  Where we expect to be the dominant team, it results in a lack of creativity and incisive play, the build up is too laboured, as agreed by IE’s comments himself and laid bare by the FGR game.  If personnel change that may not be the case, we’ll see.

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7 hours ago, Johnnyrotten said:

Thanks for taking the trouble to respond/debate, although not really a need for the “coach/insider” refs, when did football fans lose the right to debate the manager’s tactics? If only the manager’s opinion matters were we wrong to debate Hill’s use of Bridcutt at centre back, etc?

I’ll agree to differ on a couple of points but recognise the sense in what you’re saying.  In general, you’re happy with the time spent working on one formation, fine, I think it should have been sorted out before the 4th competitive match and I think he may have signed a winger or 2 if he’d realised earlier (and may still do) with less emphasis on so many centre backs.  His comment about them not always being comfortable passers compared to midfielders – seems a logical observation whether it’s the 1st training session or the 40th.  

I’ve not written any players off, they may all turn out to be great for us, but it did look like we were short of right sided players when the young striker came on in that position v FGR and looked out of position and not ready yet (presume that would have been Politic if fit?).

I did say how pleased I was that he could change the system, most of us wanted that (reading comments on here), and he did.  That’s a huge positive, compared to the previous 2 managers repeating the same mistakes.

I think it has to be 4 at the back with this current set of defenders/wing backs unless we want to play a “backs to the wall game” eg against a team we expect to be dominated by (hopefully none in Div 2).  Where we expect to be the dominant team, it results in a lack of creativity and incisive play, the build up is too laboured, as agreed by IE’s comments himself and laid bare by the FGR game.  If personnel change that may not be the case, we’ll see.

Fair enough, apologies if my comments came across as patronising, you’re right, if we can’t  discuss and disagree on here it’s a poor do 👍

I suppose I’m frustrated with certain fans who aren’t giving the manager, players and process time. Not so much on here but even more so on other social media networks. As long as you don’t fall into that category when irreversible judgements are made after 2 games then fine. I suppose we both hope that some of your concerns are jumping the gun a little and that in a couple of months they’ve been ironed out and we are flying!

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21 hours ago, Escobarp said:

Still can’t believe folk are questioning him at this stage already.  We’ve just had our best performance , granted we lost and that’s a shitter, but the improvement was there for all to see. We will finish minimum playoffs this year and I will gladly have a sizeable charity bet with anyone that believes otherwise. 

I'm with 'Barp . There's 30 odd games left yet. Once it clicks we'll be on our way.

We've the best two scorers in this division. The season we expected is still on.

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3 hours ago, Francis Fogarty said:

I'm with 'Barp . There's 30 odd games left yet. Once it clicks we'll be on our way.

We've the best two scorers in this division. The season we expected is still on.

44 games left.

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Before I try to offer an alternative view that Is different to the masses, In terms of what has happened this season and today I don’t disagree, I’m struggling to think of many positives. However there are some realisms that can be lost in the immediate aftermath of an inept performance, And I’m not talking about the obvious realism that is staring us in the face - we are bottom without any points. 

What we are doing has never been done before as far as I’m aware - we have scrubbed out everything we have ever done in the past and started again. We are still in the realms of who rolls the the highest to start a game of monopoly. 

IE has realised formations, players and tactics with a new squad are going to have to change. Recruitment is still ongoing - We fielded 2 players who we signed a few hours ago.

Yes there are problems, yes at the moment it is a devastating, uninspiring and dispassionate offering.

But surely, even if you don’t see it now, raw after an embarrassing defeat, then later when the emotion has waned, THIS IS GOING TO TAKE TIME. 

I’m struggling to get my head around competing on an even keel with Colchester, Newport and fuck me (I still can’t believe I have to think, never well mind type it) HARROGATE!!

But this is reality, this is where we are at. Be something that we are often not very good at, be patient, let IE work out what will get us moving upwards again. If we don’t do this, then the alternative is, IMO, something which in the long term would send us backwards, not forwards.

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IE favourite line "it will come" and I believe him.

Imo, he his still the man, and will get it right, doesn't seem to set in his ways and he knows that wins breed confidence.

He's playing the long game, any win is a top win, and I'm sure there's more to come.

IESWA

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1 minute ago, Mr Grey said:

IE favourite line "it will come" and I believe him.

Imo, he his still the man, and will get it right, doesn't seem to set in his ways and he knows that wins breed confidence.

He's playing the long game, any win is a top win, and I'm sure there's more to come.

IESWA

Good post. Be reet and i’m pretty sure we’ll absolutely muller someone very soon - the day  when it all comes together.

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Just now, Burndens Bogs said:

Good post. Be reet and i’m pretty sure we’ll absolutely muller someone very soon - the day  when it all comes together.

A good 4 nil v some fucker would be nice, been a long time 😁

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