THIS NEW BUDGET

[gonzo]

21 minutes ago, kent_white said:

I agree. And there a shit load of tradies taking the absolute piss with tax. They need to be paying their way too! 

Indeed there is but it's nowhere near the gravy train it once was for the self employed.

All depends on what you want out of life. If you want a mortgage you need proof of earnings. You go on holiday HMRC know about it. They have your DVLA too.

As it stands you get punished for doing better. I went limited etc and then got hammered on corporation tax. Have staff your going to get hammered In the next budget. Rising wages but not rising prices.

 

[kent_white]

14 minutes ago, gonzo said:

Indeed there is but it's nowhere near the gravy train it once was for the self employed.

All depends on what you want out of life. If you want a mortgage you need proof of earnings. You go on holiday HMRC know about it. They have your DVLA too.

As it stands you get punished for doing better. I went limited etc and then got hammered on corporation tax. Have staff your going to get hammered In the next budget. Rising wages but not rising prices.

 

Maybe that's it. The age old problem. That private businesses think the public sector are taking the piss and vice versa? Divide and conquer. 

Ultimately as a country we are a non profit making entity as we need to borrow to even maintain services. We collectively need to put more into the coffers if we want to invest and grow. 

Shit news. Highly unpopular. But true. 

 

[Casino]

42 minutes ago, Blondi said:

All these pensioners moaning about their fuel allowance being taken away, bet most of them voted for Labour too.

fairly sure you would be wrong

its only over 60s where the the tories have a majority

theres only them still believing what they read in the mail

https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/49978-how-britain-voted-in-the-2024-general-election

[Ani]

2 hours ago, gonzo said:

I'm talking about the rafts or privately run shops and businesses. 

Small businesses don't get away with not paying tax mate. 

As it stands if you run a bistro with 4 staff you're are going to get nailed with what's projected. 

Small places like that are already on knife edge.

I'm not talking about self employed painters. 

 

 

I did not say you did tbf. My point is that everyone blames other sectors but no politician mentions the cash economy. 
 

Some small businesses do get away without paying tax. Bet everyone on here has had jobs done cash in hand. 

[Ani]

31 minutes ago, gonzo said:

Indeed there is but it's nowhere near the gravy train it once was for the self employed.

All depends on what you want out of life. If you want a mortgage you need proof of earnings. You go on holiday HMRC know about it. They have your DVLA too.

As it stands you get punished for doing better. I went limited etc and then got hammered on corporation tax. Have staff your going to get hammered In the next budget. Rising wages but not rising prices.

 

How many people do you know that during the pandemic could not get any money because their accounts did not show much income. 
 

It is rife, I know one lad who is applying for a mortgage. His Accountant has said show 3 months full earnings and he will ratify the accounts. I get loads do it properly and fairly but the ones ripping it off do not think they are doing anything wrong. 

[Sweep]

I wonder if it just won't be as bad as has already been touted......we'll find out tomorrow I guess.

Whilst the average employee might not see any change in his pay packet, the talked a bout change in NI for employers, may well cause an issue, especially for businesses that are already hand to mouth. As Gonzo points out about, there could be quite a dramatic impact in smaller businesses, but until we get all the detail, nobody knows how good or bad it's likely to be in reality

[Ani]

10 minutes ago, Casino said:

fairly sure you would be wrong

its only over 60s where the the tories have a majority

theres only them still believing what they read in the mail

https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/49978-how-britain-voted-in-the-2024-general-election

 Bit irrelevant really as was not mentioned in the election that they would take it away.

The problem with what Labour have done is that they used the easiest metric to measure rather than actual affordability. So some people who do not need it still get it - if you live abroad for instance. Others who do need it lose out. 

[Sweep]

2 minutes ago, Ani said:

How many people do you know that during the pandemic could not get any money because their accounts did not show much income. 
 

It is rife, I know one lad who is applying for a mortgage. His Accountant has said show 3 months full earnings and he will ratify the accounts. I get loads do it properly and fairly but the ones ripping it off do not think they are doing anything wrong. 

Strangely, something similar has happened to a painter and decorator I know, this weekend with regards to declared income. Firstly, his wife has a cash in hand cleaning business, and his business only declares something stupid like £21K per year - that way they maximise the benefits they can draw, which are currently close to £1500 per month (as they have 2 disabled kids). They've just been served 6 months notice on their rental property (which has always been a cash deal to one of their mates), that they've been in for about 10 years....all of a sudden, they're complaining because even though they can afford to pay rent, they can't get past any credit checks that the rental agencies want. I pointed out to him this weekend that you can't milk the system for everything that you can get on one side, and then complain because it's "holding you back" on the other side

[Tonge moor green jacket]

14 hours ago, Dimron said:

NI... read National Insurance

That is your Health Service and Pension. Sunak wanted to scrap it and bring in his American profiteering Insurance mates... and if you didn't have "insurance" you would be fucked and reliant on charity.

Even Johnson got it, he put up NI to fund the desperately needed improvements in the care system, then loony Truss took it down... and then Sunak wanted to scrap it.

What is wrong with funding care and health provision in society? We need to get NI where it should be and ring fence it rather than viewing it as some sort of tax.

Why have two taxes?

Merge it with income tax.

Save on administration. 

Oh, and it is a tax. What civilised societies are founded on.

No one objects to it, we all understand how it works.

We just want value for money.

 

[Traf]

1 hour ago, Blondi said:

All these pensioners moaning about their fuel allowance being taken away, bet most of them voted for Labour too.

The fuel allowance equates to 83p per day.
Anyone getting Pension Credit still gets the allowance.
To get Pension Credit, a single pensioner must have less than a grand a month coming on and a couple must have less than £1500 a month coming in.

[Tonge moor green jacket]

54 minutes ago, Casino said:

fairly sure you would be wrong

its only over 60s where the the tories have a majority

theres only them still believing what they read in the mail

https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/49978-how-britain-voted-in-the-2024-general-election

Nothing unusual there.

Without reading further, does it look at the numbers that didn't vote, or just ones that did?

In terms of actual numbers, iirc, only reform got an increased number. Maybe lib dem, though not sure.

 

[bolty58]

1 hour ago, Casino said:

fairly sure you would be wrong

its only over 60s where the the tories have a majority

theres only them still believing what they read in the mail

https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/49978-how-britain-voted-in-the-2024-general-election

Ageist shite yet again.

We remember. There is nothing new here. Comes around with monotonous regularity when the reds get in. Business (small to medium) will likely get royally rogered. The result?

Less employees many of which will go on the rock and roll and be a benefits burden rather than a tax contributor. Many of them will have voted Labour. Let them learn the hard way.

Still a way to go to the end of Q1 2025. That's when the shit from the fan will be six inches thick.

 

[gonzo]

1 hour ago, Ani said:

I did not say you did tbf. My point is that everyone blames other sectors but no politician mentions the cash economy. 
 

Some small businesses do get away without paying tax. Bet everyone on here has had jobs done cash in hand. 

You are confusing small businesses with self employed tradesmen.

Or maybe I am?

In my mind a business is a Ltd company with proper accounts. A shop, a cafe, a bistro, a contract cleaning firm or building company. 

Not a sole trader painter etc taking cash jobs only.

Edited October 28 by gonzo

[Casino]

1 hour ago, bolty58 said:

Ageist shite yet again.

 

 

just presenting the facts

younger folk do not vote tory

a cynic would even think labour thought fuck pensioners as they don't vote for us

[Casino]

1 hour ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

Nothing unusual there.

Without reading further, does it look at the numbers that didn't vote, or just ones that did?

In terms of actual numbers, iirc, only reform got an increased number. Maybe lib dem, though not sure.

 

he said those moaning wouldve voted labour

im saying they probably didn't

i suppose it depends which oldies are doing the moaning

[Ani]

49 minutes ago, gonzo said:

You are confusing small businesses with self employed tradesmen.

Or maybe I am?

In my mind a business is a Ltd company with proper accounts. A shop, a cafe, a bistro, a contract cleaning firm or building company. 

Not a sole trader painter etc taking cash jobs only.

I am talking about the small businesses that have proper accounts but they do not put all jobs through the books. They get paid cash so do not charge VAT and pay temporary staff cash in hand , might 2-3 employees as well through the books.

Any business that takes business cash in hand the option is there. 

[mickbrown]

3 hours ago, gonzo said:

Indeed there is but it's nowhere near the gravy train it once was for the self employed.

All depends on what you want out of life. If you want a mortgage you need proof of earnings. You go on holiday HMRC know about it. They have your DVLA too.

As it stands you get punished for doing better. I went limited etc and then got hammered on corporation tax. Have staff your going to get hammered In the next budget. Rising wages but not rising prices.

 

Really?
 

Your corporation tax rate is lower than my income tax rate. 

[gonzo]

3 minutes ago, mickbrown said:

Really?
 

Your corporation tax rate is lower than my income tax rate. 

Added to personal tax I bet it isn't.

[gonzo]

56 minutes ago, Ani said:

I am talking about the small businesses that have proper accounts but they do not put all jobs through the books. They get paid cash so do not charge VAT and pay temporary staff cash in hand , might 2-3 employees as well through the books.

Any business that takes business cash in hand the option is there. 

I really don't think it's that easy anymore.

Trade accounts are monitored by HMRC. As are suppliers accounts. Large cash purchases are monitored too.

One man bands maybe. But small businesses with staff are scrutinised to fuck. 

Trust me I know all about it

 

[Casino]

2 hours ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

Merge it with income tax

 

Prob with income tax and NI is that the mega rich dont pay

There was a figure a couple of years back that showed the respective percentages paid in tax by Sunak and Starmer

As much of Sunaks earnings are from shares, his % was much lower

 

(I THINK )

 

[Ani]

15 minutes ago, mickbrown said:

Really?
 

Your corporation tax rate is lower than my income tax rate. 

But Corporation tax is paid out by the company before Gonzo takes his earnings. 
 

If he draws money out that is taxable other than a small amount I think that is tax if taken as dividends. No NI on dividends. 

[Ani]

14 minutes ago, Casino said:

Prob with income tax and NI is that the mega rich dont pay

There was a figure a couple of years back that showed the respective percentages paid in tax by Sunak and Starmer

As much of Sunaks earnings are from shares, his % was much lower

 

(I THINK )

 

You mean Capital Gains (I THINK 😊)

Sunaks income came through an investment so taxed at 20% , he still paid £500k in tax that year from memory

[Casino]

15 minutes ago, Ani said:

You mean Capital Gains (I THINK 😊)

Sunaks income came through an investment so taxed at 20% , he still paid £500k in tax that year from memory

yeah, shares/investments, whatever

CGT/Inheritance definitely need a good coat of looking at

[Not in Crawley]

4 hours ago, kent_white said:

Maybe that's it. The age old problem. That private businesses think the public sector are taking the piss and vice versa? Divide and conquer. 

Ultimately as a country we are a non profit making entity as we need to borrow to even maintain services. We collectively need to put more into the coffers if we want to invest and grow. 

Shit news. Highly unpopular. But true. 

 

I don't think the public sector are taking the piss, looking at the wages you need to have your bums feelings if you think that.

[Not in Crawley]

1 hour ago, gonzo said:

I really don't think it's that easy anymore.

Trade accounts are monitored by HMRC. As are suppliers accounts. Large cash purchases are monitored too.

One man bands maybe. But small businesses with staff are scrutinised to fuck. 

Trust me I know all about it

 

We're not scrutinised 'to fuck', we pay what we should.

Yes there is an annoyance that the more you earn the more you are taxed but then we get to claim all sorts as tax breaks from meals out for work, car insurance, travel, entaining, home office equipment such as a nice dining table etc etc etc

Also the better I do, the more I earn - not in a wage trap - the flip side is the stress that can you pay yourself(or the tax) at the end of a difficult month when you're chasing clients with regards to cash flow. 

I've worked both sides and being stuck on a grade wage without much opportunity to move out of it was pretty bleak.