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Wanderers Ways. Neil Thompson 1961-2021

SW away


captainmed

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There are 2 ways in which this can be viewed; as a fan and as a professional.

The latter is now tremendously important for clubs. Very few top clubs (or aspiring top clubs) won’t have an analyst who deals with every bit of data possible in order to find an extra edge to performance. Ignorance and avoidance of this will put clubs on a lesser footing in comparison to their rivals who benefit from this.

As a fan I imagine you will love or hate it. I like it. I do think there’s a reality check needed by some fans though who place too much importance of their own (or some other amateurs) interpretation of the limited data they can see (which is a drop in the ocean compared to what the professionals are seeing). There’s certainly a current fad to throw out Opta stats and Expected goals to back up an opinion and put their team top of a table.

Treated with an open mind and a little skepticism as a fan I think you can find it interesting. As a club I’d say it’s a must.

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I think the fact we have not scored in 5 games out of 12 is the most worrying stat. 
 

in the three away 1-0s we very much deserved something, Burton at home definitely deserved more and that leaves Rotherham , did not go, but maybe they deserved to win but a goal could change things. 
 

if you do not score in nearly half your games your expected points won't be great. What this does show is that if Doyle can start banging them or indeed anyone as well as Dapo we would be in an even better position. 
 

We still ain't doing badly though ! 

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Would an analysist's role be to tell the club that our striker's chances to goals ratio is shit and be along the lines of,  "If he puts the ball in the net more often we'd be further up the table." or similar?

If so,  I reckon any of us could do that job. 

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I have often wondered if there would be value in clubs employing independent ex footballers/managers to watch the games and see if their appraisal of the players matches the manager's & coaching team. Someone with no relationship with any player.

As I often think, like any organisation and management, people will have favourites and it sways decision making. So does that keep them in the team longer than a wanker? Do they get more leeway coz they're a good egg, even though the output has dipped?? 

Every manager is accused of having favourites, maybe this would provide some objective feedback? 

NB. It may already happen for all I know!

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56 minutes ago, MickyD said:

Would an analysist's role be to tell the club that our striker's chances to goals ratio is shit and be along the lines of,  "If he puts the ball in the net more often we'd be further up the table." or similar?

If so,  I reckon any of us could do that job. 

The data should help to show why opportunities are being missed. Maybe a striker's positioning not being the best for when crosses delivered for example. Maybe a subtle change in movement or a slightly different approach from the wide players as to when they put the ball in?

Looking at some recent highlights, Doyle is sometimes in a slightly offside position when shots come in. Does that mean he's slow getting back on or possibly he's moving for a cross that doesn't happen or is blocked, and then he's just off for any follow up shots.

Just a simple scenario, but with so much data available, if an analyst can spot something and suggest the most subtle of changes, then that might be enough to turn a player's fortunes.

It might also suggest he's getting old or fitness levels aren't quite where they need to be.

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6 minutes ago, Casino said:

 

Why would a manager have 'favourites'

Why wouldn't they?

Plenty of examples over the years of managers taking a player with them if they move on. Allardyce and Nolan for example. Same with backroom staff, you get someone you trust.

Human nature to an extent, not just in football.

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32 minutes ago, Casino said:

 

Why would a manager have 'favourites'

Because some people are nicer than others, some connections are easier to forge, like any group dynamic. I don't mean intentionally.

Pretty sure every fan can think of a player they have been bemused are picked week on week over the years.

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3 hours ago, Ani said:

I think the fact we have not scored in 5 games out of 12 is the most worrying stat. 
 

in the three away 1-0s we very much deserved something, Burton at home definitely deserved more and that leaves Rotherham , did not go, but maybe they deserved to win but a goal could change things. 
 

if you do not score in nearly half your games your expected points won't be great. What this does show is that if Doyle can start banging them or indeed anyone as well as Dapo we would be in an even better position. 
 

We still ain't doing badly though ! 

So we haven't scored in nearly half our games & we are 2nd highest scorers in the League... Talk about famine or feast, we are averaging 3 a game when we do actually score.... Evatt must be tearing his hair out in frustration 😁

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55 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

Why wouldn't they?

Plenty of examples over the years of managers taking a player with them if they move on. Allardyce and Nolan for example. Same with backroom staff, you get someone you trust.

Human nature to an extent, not just in football.

He took Nolan with him cause he knew he would get the job done

Riddles poorly disguised dig is that he picks Doyle cos he's a 'favourite'

Theres a good reason Doyle is his 'favourite" and it's not cos he likes seeing him in his y fronts

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21 minutes ago, Casino said:

He took Nolan with him cause he knew he would get the job done

Riddles poorly disguised dig is that he picks Doyle cos he's a 'favourite'

Theres a good reason Doyle is his 'favourite" and it's not cos he likes seeing him in his y fronts

It genuinely wasn't, although get why you may have thought that, and Doyle is the most recent for me!!

But h.ave thought it before, do managers get any independent feedback on their squad? As working day in day out with people naturally leads to blindspots I would have thought, like anywhere.

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I think Evatt sees Doyle, Sarc, MJ, Santos and probably Jones as his reliable group. Call them favourites, or the best players or whatever.

It's possible that anyone in a managerial position could develop a blind spot, but equally, if they trust an individual, then they may get more time to get their form right.

That said, Evatt may be happy enough with what he's seeing from Doyle, though he obviously would like to see more chances finished. 

All a bit second guessing, but Evatt has consistently identified areas for improvement, and rectified them when he can. What he can't do is go upsetting the applecart and risk over reacting, particularly if the squad is light in a given area and funds are limited.

Man management isn't easy, and even the best make mistakes.

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4 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

All a bit second guessing, but Evatt has consistently identified areas for improvement, and rectified them when he can. What he can't do is go upsetting the applecart and risk over reacting, particularly if the squad is light in a given area and funds are limited.

 

I think you're right and this is probably about where we are...

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On 09/10/2021 at 21:27, MickyD said:

Just back.

One thing not really discussed is Dapo getting booked for being fouled. What the fuck? Immediately after that, Kachunga got caught with the ball giving them the free kick from which they scored. 
Also, the penalty claim in the dying seconds. Ref pointed to his knee as if to say either it had come up off his knee onto his arm or it had hit his knee not his arm. Either way, bollocks! It hit his outstretched arm. I will study the highlights show later.

Also, we have a new breed of dickhead watching us. A young girl by the name of Shannon, climbing all over the tram generally being an arse. Almost wanting folk to chastise her so she could have a go back.

She even joined in as the youngsters sang, “She’s got chlamydia!”

Just seen a online petition to get her banned. Supposedly lobbing things at the bar staff at SW. Seems a lovely young lady. 

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It doesn’t need an online petition, it needs someone (who isn’t also a dickhead) who could take her to football games, not let her over imbibe, not let her act the twat, etc., and generally try and stop her being feral.

She’s playing to the crowd in a way others have before her but not realising it is doing her massive social harm.

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1 hour ago, bolton_blondie said:

Just seen a online petition to get her banned. Supposedly lobbing things at the bar staff at SW. Seems a lovely young lady. 

Seen that. There’s a bit of a social media bandwagon building with this that I’m a bit uncomfortable with. There are certainly some mistruths, but on the other hand as Micky pointed out she’s not helping herself out with some of her actions.

My 16 year old lad showed me some of it. And I had to highlight that a lot  of the abuse she’s getting is bordering on bullying and victimisation and wouldn’t be happening (or wouldn’t be as bad) if it was a lad.

This myth that she was the one who got the bars shut is wrong, well certainly from what I saw anyway.

There’s no doubting she’s gobby, loud, grating and a tad embarrassing at times, but as I say I’ve seen loads of lads a lot worse.

I spoke to her at Longridge, she’s really passionate and follows us to lots of away games, got a crush on Politic. She was ok that day.

Don’t think it needs a witch-hunt from fellow fans.

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1 minute ago, desperado said:

Seen that. There’s a bit of a social media bandwagon building with this that I’m a bit uncomfortable with. There are certainly some mistruths, but on the other hand as Micky pointed out she’s not helping herself out with some of her actions.

My 16 year old lad showed me some of it. And I had to highlight that a lot  of the abuse she’s getting is bordering on bullying and victimisation and wouldn’t be happening (or wouldn’t be as bad) if it was a lad.

This myth that she was the one who got the bars shut is wrong, well certainly from what I saw anyway.

There’s no doubting she’s gobby, loud, grating and a tad embarrassing at times, but as I say I’ve seen loads of lads a lot worse.

I spoke to her at Longridge, she’s really passionate and follows us to lots of away games, got a crush on Politic. She was ok that day.

Don’t think it needs a witch-hunt from fellow fans.

You're right if it was a lad they wouldn't be getting such a backlash. Fair enough if she's passionate but she maybe just needs to be told to stop making a twat of herself. We've all been there, especially after a few drinks. I cringe at how gobby I can be. 

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4 minutes ago, bolton_blondie said:

You're right if it was a lad they wouldn't be getting such a backlash. Fair enough if she's passionate but she maybe just needs to be told to stop making a twat of herself. We've all been there, especially after a few drinks. I cringe at how gobby I can be. 

It’s very easy for a lad to say to another lad, “stop being a dick!”

 

Probably more difficult for a lad to approach a girl and say the same.

She put a post on FB saying she was a bit unhappy about the e-petition. Said it made her upset and feeling vulnerable, etc.

I guess eventually she’ll realise the gang encouraging her to be a knob are also the ones laughing behind her back.

 

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24 minutes ago, MickyD said:

It doesn’t need an online petition, it needs someone (who isn’t also a dickhead) who could take her to football games, not let her over imbibe, not let her act the twat, etc., and generally try and stop her being feral.

She’s playing to the crowd in a way others have before her but not realising it is doing her massive social harm.

I agree with this, been a bit uncomfortable seeing some of the stuff on there and I do wonder if it was a lad doing it if things would be different, I mean fucking hell we've had a lad eating a pie with a dildo in the stands ffs and I didn't see any petitions to ban that freak show!

I've seen her in passing at aways and via some of these videos on twitter acting up but I don't think there's any malice in it whatsoever. She like many others are just playing up to what they think an away fan "should" be acting like, egged on by sites along the lines of Football Away Days etc. Act dead mad, celebrate goals by dragging people down steps, chuck pyro about etc, and you'll get the likes.

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