It is very early in the season but following yet another defeat, this time at the hands of a decimated Portsmouth side things are looking bleak, or are they?

 

OK there has been criticism of the manager and the players, but let's focus on the manger for now.

 

Sammy Lee has been brought up playing football as it should be played, pass and move etc with Liverpool and England but playing systems has a player doesn't make you a great manager.

 

Since the defeat at Anfield in January the Wanderers have looked shaky and struggled to get points and this has pretty much carried on into this season. Little Sammy has tried to introduce a new system and brought in his own players to apply a more attacking style to the game, but is this working for a side that has built up a reputation of being sold, getting stuck in?

 

This thread is not about slagging off Sammy Lee, just looking at the pros and cons of his style of play and possible credential as a manager as we know good coaches don't always make great managers.

 

Discuss!!!

It is very early in the season but following yet another defeat, this time at the hands of a decimated Portsmouth side things are looking bleak, or are they?

 

OK there has been criticism of the manager and the players, but let's focus on the manger for now.

 

Sammy Lee has been brought up playing football as it should be played, pass and move etc with Liverpool and England but playing systems has a player doesn't make you a great manager.

 

Since the defeat at Anfield in January the Wanderers have looked shaky and struggled to get points and this has pretty much carried on into this season. Little Sammy has tried to introduce a new system and brought in his own players to apply a more attacking style to the game, but is this working for a side that has built up a reputation of being sold, getting stuck in?

 

This thread is not about slagging off Sammy Lee, just looking at the pros and cons of his style of play and possible credential as a manager as we know good coaches don't always make great managers.

 

Discuss!!!

 

i didn't get past there

 

cos its bollocks

Cons:

 

No experience

 

48 years old, and yet no-one else ever felt he was good enough for the top job

 

Gives no impression of confidence when interviewed

 

Has signed a a bunch of reserves from teams that finished below us last year

 

He's a Scouser

 

Pros:

 

48 years old, and yet no-one else ever felt he was good enough for the top job

What's THE top job?

And do you know what he's been doing since he retired from playing? Have you bothered to back up your statement with facts? Has he even applied for any TOP jobs prior to this?

This s a completely fair point to raise 'Happy'. We do need debate because there was no fcukin debate before he was appointed, we just accepted Gartsides so called accumen for managerial appointments (I've nothing personal against Sammy Lee either). Although I would have loved to usher in this brave new world of free flowing attacking Liverpool style football there are some things that hold me back.

 

We achieved the success we had in this division playing to our strengths which is based on a DEFENSIVE structure. Even with skilful players over the years like Jay Jay, Youri and more recently Nico and Dioufy the way we succeeded was to keep things tight and that was obviously down to Big Sam. I went to Craven cottage in 1999 for Big Sam's first game in charge which ended being a dull 1-1 draw. I remember him saying in the aftermatch press conference that he loved 1-0 wins. Well he wasn't far off one that night. The main thing though was that we didn't capitulate after conceding a goal. LSL appears to not understand the importance of this approach.

He seems hellbent on attack. We were wide open today at Portsmouth. This was eptomised with Pompey's second goal. The ball went from ANELKA and then to the back of our net.

 

How on earth can half of our established players be expected not just to gel immediately with these new additions, but also with a system that quick frankly is completely alien to them. No wonder DIOUFY looked the way he did at sammy lee after a complete communication breakdown on the pitch. The five live commentator said it all, quote " He looked at Sammy Lee as if to say Who are these so called players you are pairing me with".

 

We are not and never will be like Liverpool both on the pitch and off it. We can't compete on those levels especially in the money driven, globalistic game that is now english football

 

No one more than me would like to see our results improve and I really hope they do. Having said that though having followed Bolton for 30 plus years now I have developed a gut instinct when I feel things are about to to take a turn for the worse.

 

For me to believe that LSL can turn things around he must first stop us shipping goals. So even a couple of 0-0 draws may be a start.

 

Somehow though just I can't see it .......

Edited August 18, 200719 yr by photosynth1

What's THE top job?

And do you know what he's been doing since he retired from playing? Have you bothered to back up your statement with facts? Has he even applied for any TOP jobs prior to this?

 

 

the fact is IF he has applied for other posts as manager, he has not been succesfull that says it all.

 

pros:

 

has signed players to pack out the squad instead of the likes of henrik

has managed to keep hold of anelka and diouf so far

has bit the bullet and tryed to change the was we play (this is also a con)

 

cons

 

the players hes signed to pack out the squad he is now trying to use as first team players

keeps playing a make shift defence

has no real form as a manager to backup getting this job

 

 

i think Gartside appointed him to stick two fingers up at BSA a sort of ill appoint someone who knows your tactics and will just carry on from you

Edited August 18, 200719 yr by eaststandlower

For me to believe that LSL can turn things around he must first stop us shipping goals. So even a couple of 0-0 draws may be a start.

 

That was beyond even Allardyce, though

the fact is IF he has applied for other posts as manager, he has not been succesfull that says it all.

Read what you just wrote, please.

the fact is IF he has applied for other posts as manager, he has not been succesfull that says it all.

 

pros:

 

has signed players to pack out the squad instead of the likes of henrik

has managed to keep hold of anelka and diouf so far

has bit the bullet and tryed to change the was we play (this is also a con)

 

cons

 

the players hes signed to pack out the squad he is now trying to use as first team players

keeps playing a make shift defence

has no real form as a manager to backup getting this job

 

 

i think Gartside appointed him to stick two fingers up at BSA a sort of ill appoint someone who knows your tactics and will just carry on from you

 

do you know what 'make -shift' means

 

he'd argue hes playing our best defence, or certainly the best available to him

 

dunno how that fits your description

 

 

and the second bit is quite clearly bollocks

Edited August 18, 200719 yr by Casino

do you know what 'make -shift' means

 

he'd argue hes playing our best defence, or certainly the best available to him

 

dunno how that fits your description

and the second bit is quite clearly bollocks

 

 

i was trying not to be over critical but hunt, samuel, sid and metie that defence is fuking sh1t and its down to LSL for buying sh1t. we where all over the shop again today and if it continues we'll be down by Xmas.

 

as for the second part that is my opinion i think he was given the job to continue from BSA because no one else knew what BSA had done behind the scenes better than his number 2

Pros:

 

I am struggling here.

 

Some good passing movements I suppose, we sometimes look a good team in midfield.

 

Cons:

 

Can't appear to organise a team.

Inexperienced as a leader and a manager.

The O'Brien signing looks poor and unimaginative.

We ended up today with a team trying to play passing football who didn't know each other.

Looks capable of seeing positives in getting relegated.

TV interviews don't inspire.

He hasn't dealt with an issue (defence/organisation) that was apparent all the way through our three games so far.

Seems able to achieve the worst possible results with the players available.

 

I could cope with losing matches if we were unlucky, or went on the pitch with an apparent method of how to win a game. We don't and all eight goals we have conceded have been soft goals and preventable. Newcastle, Fulham and Portsmouth have not had to put any effort into beating us, they have just had to stay solid and wait for our defence to gift them goals.

 

We are a good squad with good players. We were capable of taking 9 points from these 3 games.

Read what you just wrote, please.

Either he's applied elsewhere and not been rated, and therefore failed to get the post, or he hasn't felt that he'd get a job in the top job so hasn't applied, which as they say is hoist by his own petard.

 

And I am sure you know that the top job I am referring to is the manager's role, unless LSL is doing a different job that we don't know abouyt?

This s a completely fair point to raise 'Happy'. We do need debate because there was no fcukin debate before he was appointed, we just accepted Gartsides so called accumen for managerial appointments (I've nothing personal against Sammy Lee either).

Surely there was plenty of debate, I didnt post here then, just read, but on others forums there were plenty against LSL, he was certainly not someone I would have even had on a shortlist.

Have you bothered to back up your statement with facts?

 

I think you'll find that he never backs up anything with actual facts.

but hunt, samuel, sid and metie that defence is fuking sh1t and its down to LSL for buying sh1t.

 

Pretty sure this would have been fat sams defence if he had stayed

Surely there was plenty of debate, I didnt post here then, just read, but on others forums there were plenty against LSL, he was certainly not someone I would have even had on a shortlist.

 

 

The point i'm trying to make there is we didn't have much time for debate as the decision was already made

Pros:

 

We still have Anelka, Diouf, jussi, Campo and Faye on the books.

 

Cons:

 

Probably not for much longer.

Pros:

 

We still have Anelka, Diouf, jussi, Campo and Faye on the books.

 

Cons:

 

Probably not for much longer.

 

 

I was going to say the same thing in my earlier post but I'd said too much already

been in front in 2 away games now lost both

the writing was on the wall from january with the number of goals we shipped

we needed 4 quality defenders/midfielders not journeymen players or castoffs

2.A manager that can't organise a defence won't be managing long

 

that a pro or a con?

I think most of my feeling has been said above.

 

Fatshaft:

 

Gives no impression of confidence when interviewed

 

Has signed a bunch of reserves from teams that finished below us last year

 

Eaststandlower:

 

has signed players to pack out the squad instead of the likes of henrik

 

has managed to keep hold of anelka and diouf so far (can?t see this still being true in a few days)

 

the players he?s signed to pack out the squad he is now trying to use as first team players

 

 

I am all for attacking and passing football. Sadly, you need the players to do this. When we had Okocha, Youri etc, I was frustrated at the stifling of their football talents. Now it looks like we are asking donkeys to play football. Maybe with the likes of Alonso, Samuel McCann etc we might have to revert to hoof football as this is about all they can do.

 

I think the one thing he has done is demoralise Anelka and, more so, Diouf. These two are the only hope we have, and to offend them by dropping one, and making the other play up front with Nolan/Braten/Helgurson is not good. If one or both leave, the ripple will run throughout the club. Without them 2, look at the starting XI. I have to be honest and say it would be like a very average Championship side

I think most of my feeling has been said above.

the players he?s signed to pack out the squad he is now trying to use as first team players

I am all for attacking and passing football. Sadly, you need the players to do this. When we had Okocha, Youri etc, I was frustrated at the stifling of their football talents. Now it looks like we are asking donkeys to play football. Maybe with the likes of Alonso, Samuel McCann etc we might have to revert to hoof football as this is about all they can do.

 

I think the one thing he has done is demoralise Anelka and, more so, Diouf. These two are the only hope we have, and to offend them by dropping one, and making the other play up front with Nolan/Braten/Helgurson is not good. If one or both leave, the ripple will run throughout the club. Without them 2, look at the starting XI. I have to be honest and say it would be like a very average Championship side

 

I thought he had your 'full support'?

He does.

 

I will vocally back him all the way.

 

Doesn't mean I agree with some of his crazy choices, but I will bow to his knowledge in the belief that he can make it work.

 

At least he is trying something other than 8-1-1

The 1st half shambolic effort in the Newcastle game was worrying but what concerned me even more was that in the 2nd half when Alardyce came down from the directors box, he commanded the "managers area" and had a much better presence of his area, Lee just appeared out of his depth and spent most of his time next to the subs bench instead of making himself heard and seen.........even if it was just to make a stand against Allardyce. He just seemed weak and not up for the challenge.

 

Note: None of the above is related to body size

Pro: we've got to be in with a great shout of winning the fair play league!