Tombwfc

Literally in this thread people are being called 'entitled thickos' for not being pleased we got a point yesterday. And you yourself talking about us being a difficult club to manage because we have a massive fanbase and high expectations. It's not that hard - take your hyped up, vastly more expensive players and find a way to beat the absolute dross of League One. Which includes having more than one shot on target against a side who'd lost five in a row conceding 16 goals. It's not the weight of expectation which is why we're 6th, it's players and a manager currently not delivering on what they were brought here to do.

The 'toxic' part with Evatt came right at the very end when it was clear the wheels had long since come off (to everyone except Sharon). Before that he and the team continued to be backed and backed in big numbers home and away, despite many shocking results. It just feels a bit of a cop out that whenever we have a really indefensible result/performance, rather than just agree it's shite and needs to improve, someone will bring up our fans as being the issue. As though we're an entitled, unmanageable basket case. Our fans are as patient as any in the country and it isn't them failing to live up to expectations. After 2 wins in 11 (and a twatting at Swindon), a few moans and groans at games is the least they should be allowed.

There's no club of our size and expectation that wouldn't have had a disgruntled away end on a day like today. Luton have already sacked a manager this season and Huddersfield fans have been all over Grant. If you put a poll up on here tonight 90+% of people would still be backing SS, which is remarkable considering how mediocre his results have been and the fact we've spent years in this interminable division. I think 99% of managers would scoff at the idea we are a difficult club to manage - just win games with better players, massively increased resources and a fanbase selling out away ends up and down the country cheering the team on (apparently a big factor when teams play us at the Reebok).

"Objectively the results are similar" On this day two years ago we were second with 51 points.

Dan Nlundulu and Declan John started and won the Scottish Cup final. Dalby is absolutely nowhere near being good enough to be the main striker at L1 team chasing automatic promotion. And he never has been.

And so we're also apparently in touching distance of being in the bottom half. Thank God we've improved from the three years of 'mediocrity' you talked about. Bolton fans were incredibly patient (maybe too patient) with Evatt and now we're being incredibly patient (maybe too patient) with Schumacher.

This has to be a wind up. "touching distance"

"I don't for one second believe they are better sides than us"... as they move six and seven points clear. The arrogance of how we overrate our players is bizarre at times.

I'm not writing anyone off, but there's a reason Burstow isn't in the team at the minute. Dalby can hardly complain about lack of service given the chances he has missed. I'm sure many strikers would like to only be judged when they have the perfect cross dropped on their head.

Dalby has scored 2 in 18 this season and has 5 in 68 in his EFL career (49 of those were in L2). Burstow hasn't scored for nearly 3 months and has 12 career league goals, seven of which came in a 10 game span this season. It can hardly be a shock that they aren't the most clinical.

When ACD put one in the top corner in the last minute against Cardiff (or Orient) they would probably have argued that it was a bit of good fortune as a very low xG chance. But it's wasn't, he's a quality player and that's the kind of things quality players can do. Equally, it's not luck that players with no track record of scoring goals at this level are missing chances. It's just who they are. Not having the 'final bit of quality' has been a fixture of their entire careers.

We're 22 games into the season and still bleating about how we are the 'on another day' runaway league leaders. The 'best squad in the league' has spent 0 days in the top two and is now 7 points adrift of Lincoln City. To get to 92 points we need to go at 2.3ppg across the next 24 and we haven't looked remotely like stringing that kind of form together. We've won two away games and still have to visit all of the top three. Still time and a window to change things, but the facts are we've been miles off it. If the alarm bells aren't ringing now you're not paying attention.

I don't think you need to be Pep to work out why we looked solid playing virtually an entire game against 10 man Mansfield. You could draw our team & formation out of a hat and I'd expect us to look good in that situation.

That Derby team had basically the same number of 3-0s (7) as 1-0 wins (8). They won 13 times away from home, eight by two or more goals and finished with a GD of +41. I only saw them play three times (vs us x2 and Pompey on TV) and admittedly they didn't look like 1970's Brazil. But equally I think there's a tendancy to make up narratives about teams we rarely watch. Derby were clearly a very good team and killed games off more often than not. That's the standard for getting automatic promotion. The more you let teams hang around at 1-0 the more likely you are to needlessly let points slip away (Reading being the classic example from this season as well as yesterday).

Do we? I've seen Morley play 50-60 odd times for Bolton. Don't think I ever saw him play for Wycombe. Would be surprised if anyone on here saw him play a significant number of times for them. Sure he's a nice lad and he's been a good pro here. But I'd back my own eyes and say I'd sell him to anyone for half a million.

Aware that Bolton fans are not a hive mind, but there definitely seems to be a prevailing sense on here that the teams around us are all shit and will stay shit. And so as long as we eventually get around to winning a few games at some point we'll glide past them. People are still writing off Stevenage and Lincoln as being teams we don't even need to bother ourselves considering, and yet it's mid-December and there they are above us. History will tell you that, whatever anybody is doing now, at least two teams will get up to or exceed 90 points. That can definitely be us, but we've had two entire years of talking about how any minute now we're going to go on a decisive title/promotion winning run and it hasn't materialised. The attitude needs to be that every game we don't win is a bad result.

On the day we played Huddersfield we were six points behind Cardiff and four behind Lincoln. We went 8 unbeaten and today we're seven points behind Cardiff and four off Lincoln (albeit there were/are games in hand involved). We've gone at 2pts per game over the last 10, our 'good run'. If we maintain that for the rest of the season that'll be 86 points which generally hasn't been good enough for automatic promotion. The point being, the standard for going up when you've had a shit start needs to be really, really high. I don't think we're in a bad spot, decently positioned and hopefully we'll strengthen further in January. But equally there's a sort of airy complacency around that we can afford to just keep writing off games like this.

This is all kind of nonsense though isn't it? At least when looking at how we're going to get promoted over the course of a whole season. By this logic we've 'gained' six points by beating Huddersfield and Cardiff and drawing at Luton (why the 7th and 8th placed teams are in this bracket is another question). But we're already 13 points down because we lost to Northampton, Burton & Wycombe away and didn't beat Reading, Lincoln or Bradford at home. Presumably now we need to be expecting to win them back at some point, so I'd say that turns losing from 1-0 up against 14th placed Wycombe into a shit result. Call me crazy, but I reckon the league table nearly half way through the season is the best measurement as to where we are. And that is, while not out of it by any stretch, very clearly below where we need to be.

I guess balancing out Wright and Vardy are the (literally) millions of 21-year-old non-league players who didn't mature into L1 and above players. I'm not writing him off, but it's obviously massively odds against on him ever making a difference to our first team. Which is totally fine, we should always be taking zero-risk punts on potential.

After they beat us last season they were 2nd by one point with three games go. Lost all three and then the play-off semi. It's no wonder they're patchy this season. Good test for us as man for man I guess they're probably a bit better than their league position.

There's being reactionary and then there's saying Thierry Gale is our best player and the side should be built around him. I like him, bags of potential, clearly an incredible option for a L1 side to bring off the bench. He's also had about four good games and plays in a team with Cozier-Duberry.

Never in doubt

Might be a game where Dalby becomes useful. Would certainly be getting Gale on sooner rather than later.

I hope Forss plays. Don't think any of the forwards are in good form (outside of ACD) and I doubt chopping and changing will help them.

I don't think anybody is saying they'd be unhappy if the next 15 away games were underwhelming 1-0 wins. Some teams are masters at finding a way to win ugly away from home and grind their way to win after win. Some teams are just shit away. But they might scrape the odd win if they're playing against a lower mid table side with 10 men. Maybe we have found a formula that finally works away from home. But on the basis of this game, seems like there's a bit of work to be done.