Having been thinking about my assignment for uni, of which I'd decided to look into football hooliganism and the the use of modern technology, i've decided that it may not be ethical, will betime consuming and costly. So I was thinking that now I will do it on the move to The Reebok and the effects it has had on both Bolton and Horwich, and how this has affected the fans. I have read quite a few views on here on how dissatisfied the fans are with this move.

 

What d'ya reckon anyone? More achievable?

you could diverse into the old versus new stadia on a larger scale too...

 

or

 

how about the americanization of football since the premier league began...

 

including:

(new) all seater stadiums

facilities

cheerleaders & music

blokes in orange

more women & families

sky tv

 

etc

 

how about the americanization of football since the premier league began...

 

including:

(new) all seater stadiums ' date='yes but still not a patch on Amercan stadiums

facilities ,again not a patch on the way its done in the US if you had to wait that long for a beer they would be hell to pay

cheerleaders & music ,yes

blokes in orange , dont have then in the US just Police with guns seems to work

more women & families, yes

sky tv , they also black out games in the area, if the games not sold out to make sure if you want to see the game you turn up

Bump

 

 

 

I need some more feedback please

Bump

 

 

 

I need some more feedback please

 

That's my line 8-[

Blimey, I was tempted to make a rare re-appearence on this forum to ask something very similar. I can't remember the switch over from Burnden to the Reebok that well, as I was still only quite a young un at the time.

 

But for my course, I have to look at the switch from old style town centre stadiums to nice cosy suburban stadiums, like the switch we did. Did supporters at the time kick up much of a stink about moving the club out of Bolton (a bit)?

 

The yanks think nothin of movin their baseball teams from one side of the country to another. Although football teams over here don't make anywhere near as big moves, you could argue that us, Stoke and Derby movin to just out of town is a bit american-ised. But of course, we couldn't really build in Bolton because there was no room, and having a stadium in the middle of a town isn't practical anymore. Must be a nightmare for people living near Goodison and Anfield.

 

Then again, Arsenal are moving just round the corner, because their fans would be pissed off if they move out of Islington (so I'm told). Even though they buggered off from Woolwich to t'other side of London town at the beggining of last century.

 

Maybe you could take a look at whats happening with Wimbledon moving to Milton Keynes? There not used to having a local team at all in Milton Keynes, what did they make of it?

 

By the sounds of it I'm bieng asked to study the exact same area you are right now.

From memory, they came out with a constant stream of shit about Burnden being unsafe/unrepairable, they planted a seed about a new all singing all dancing stadium then announced it was going to be at the arse end of nowheree. There were very few complaints really, Sir Bruce of Rioch was at the helm and everything was rosey.

 

No one actually believed that this was going to happen as we all remember the plans for the shopping/sports complex with a pitch on the roof, exec boxes etc. We got the Normid

 

I think that the ground could have been built round where Atlantis was built but the Warbies were never going to go along with that.

 

Lastly, lets not forget all the building trade folk on our board at the time! Orbit Development and such like were companies owned by BWFC directors, awarded contracts by BWFC and run using insider information.

 

People, Chairman Gordon Hargreaves in particular, made millions out of the move to Horwich. This fact should never be forgotten. I believe Gartside knew what was going on, although that's just my opinion!

 

The yanks think nothin of movin their baseball teams from one side of the country to another. Although football teams over here don't make anywhere near as big moves, you could argue that us, Stoke and Derby movin to just out of town is a bit american-ised.  

 

Maybe you could take a look at whats happening with Wimbledon moving to Milton Keynes? There not used to having a local team at all in Milton Keynes, what did they make of it?

 

Wimbledon were origially going to move to Dublin. It would have given RoI a better class of football but (don't quote me) the FA said no. They couldn't expect any English/Welsh team to play away matches overseas.

 

Would have made a great away match in my opinion! :bb

From memory, they came out with a constant stream of shit about Burnden being unsafe/unrepairable, they planted a seed about a new all singing all dancing stadium then announced it was going to be at the arse end of nowheree. There were very few complaints really, Sir Bruce of Rioch was at the helm and everything was rosey.

 

No one actually believed that this was going to happen as we all remember the plans for the shopping/sports complex with a pitch on the roof, exec boxes etc. We got the Normid  

 

I think that the ground could have been built round where Atlantis was built but the Warbies were never going to go along with that.

 

Lastly, lets not forget all the building trade folk on our board at the time! Orbit Development and such like were companies owned by BWFC directors, awarded contracts by BWFC and run using insider information.

 

People, Chairman Gordon Hargreaves in particular, made millions out of the move to Horwich. This fact should never be forgotten. I believe Gartside knew what was going on, although that's just my opinion!

 

From my memory there was a fair bit of excitement about the move, quite a lot of people down there all the time watching it beinig constructed etc.

 

But none of us had any idea what the match day experience would be...i.e. not good for travel and drinking

From memory, they came out with a constant stream of shit about Burnden being unsafe/unrepairable, they planted a seed about a new all singing all dancing stadium then announced it was going to be at the arse end of nowheree. There were very few complaints really, Sir Bruce of Rioch was at the helm and everything was rosey.

 

No one actually believed that this was going to happen as we all remember the plans for the shopping/sports complex with a pitch on the roof, exec boxes etc. We got the Normid  

 

I think that the ground could have been built round where Atlantis was built but the Warbies were never going to go along with that.

 

Lastly, lets not forget all the building trade folk on our board at the time! Orbit Development and such like were companies owned by BWFC directors, awarded contracts by BWFC and run using insider information.

 

People, Chairman Gordon Hargreaves in particular, made millions out of the move to Horwich. This fact should never be forgotten. I believe Gartside knew what was going on, although that's just my opinion!

 

From my memory there was a fair bit of excitement about the move, quite a lot of people down there all the time watching it beinig constructed etc.

 

But none of us had any idea what the match day experience would be...i.e. not good for travel and drinking

But something can be done about both of these , a supports bar would help and with the traffic it just need the police to gat of there arses and do something to get help get the traffic away , one way to help would make people use the bridge and not the crossing that would help the flow of traffic away

aerospace club shutting was a sad day

 

was probably the biggest match day gathering outside the ground itself

The traffic was always going to be a problem, that is why there was a capcity of 25000 in the early days although there were very few empty seats.

 

I agree that the atmosphere isn't a patch on Burnden, even the Burnden of the dark days, but I console myself by saying that the other side of the coin is that the likes of Djorkaeff, Okocha, Campo, etc. wouldn't have touched the club with a bargepole if they had to put up with the working conditions at Burnden. If we were still there we may be a mid-table Championship side.

 

I think Arsenal have been fortunate to be able to acquire land near to their old stadium, whether there was ever a hope of Wanderers buying land near Atlantis - who can say?

Is it just me or am I living in fantasy land.

This is the tale that I`ve heard many times and from varying sources.

Wanderers were giving the option to purchase the land which is now the Middlebrook complex on the cheap, Bolton council sold Wanderers the land for ??1.5 million, Orbit development were brought in to develope the site. This is the deal that I heard, Wanderers asked them to build us our stadium and in return they got the rest of the land to build the shopping complex, cinema supermarkets etc etc.

 

This could be total lies but if it is true it makes damn good business sense to me. Now before anyone starts sayin we paid all of the ??35 million for the Reebok and thats were the debt has come from, thats just not true.

The debts were caused by the club not being able to sell Burnden park as quickly as they had hoped. How long was it dereclict before Big W was built, it had to be at least 4 years?

 

I agree that the Reebok is a terrible place to watch football but look at Massives new ground, thats even worse. Out of town grounds unfortunately are the way forward, I would assume police authorities and local councils have the main say in the locations of grounds these days.

 

Dont take the above as gospel but it would be interesting to find out if anybody else has heard the same.

We'll be back in Bolton soon when the Sh??tbok sinks as it was built on waste marshland.

We'll be back in Bolton soon when the Sh??tbok sinks as it was built on waste marshland.

 

I strongly suspect the Reebok is on piles.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'll rack em up......

Looking back the strangest thing about the move to th'reebok was the idea that Burnden was built on a prime retail site that would generate millions for the club.

It would have done but at the time the secretary of state put a block on large out off town shopping centres and that put the knives into us, when we came to sell it the arse had fallen out of the market.

burden park was our home were we learned n loved the whites truth is we were asked as supporters bout movin but in reality they the board had already made the move Ball one of the directors sold the land for undisclosed sum hargraves another director build ground hence blake 4m jenson 2m? to pay them 30,000 week back WE BEEN SEWN UP STICHED n playin in a bog since by the way hargraves brought brinsop arms 5yr b4 we moved strange huh

One or two points for the record....

A sizeable area of land, roughly half of the original development, that became Middlebrook was owned privately(and not related to BWFC directors, etc) and also by British Rail Property Board.

The waste(ex Horwich tip)area remains undeveloped, it's the land beyond the Hitachi plant.

As far as I can remember the land where the stadium is built used to be part of Sefton Fold Farm. The land across there wasn't the most solid I've ever farmed, but the true moss and bog land is a mile or two west of the stadium.

The original plans, and I saw them, had more parking and more access roads as well!

Having been thinking about my assignment for uni, of which I'd decided to look into football hooliganism and the the use of modern technology, i've decided that it may not be ethical, will betime consuming and costly. So I was thinking that now I will do it on the move to The Reebok and the effects it has had on both Bolton and Horwich, and how this has affected the fans. I have read quite a few views on here on how dissatisfied the fans are with this move.

 

What d'ya reckon anyone? More achievable?

 

I did somthing similar a few years ago, really I just wanted to learn more about the club back when we were still at Burnden interviewed Mr Lofthouse and loads of other club officialls, it was during the planing for the move so that came in to it and the reasons why, I cant remember but the study went in another direction completly when I started looking in to ground safety and the effects on the taylor report hillsbrough and other stadia disasters. My views on the Hillsbrough disaster changed from blaming the police to blaming the fans and and poor ground design, but thats somthing else painting the parts of the terraces yellow to show the exits It was really interesting I even spoke to the police and ground saftey officer at the time.

 

Contact the club they will point you in the right direction, Im not sure who or which department

Fort Sterling owned some of the land that the Reebok was built on, I was told that by a director when I used to work there.

 

PB

Was that not where tesco was built ?

One or two points for the record....

A sizeable area of land, roughly half of the original development, that became Middlebrook was owned privately(and not related to BWFC directors, etc) and also by British Rail Property Board.

The waste(ex Horwich tip)area remains undeveloped, it's the land beyond the Hitachi plant.

As far as I can remember the land where the stadium is built used to be part of Sefton Fold Farm. The land across there wasn't the most solid I've ever farmed, but the true moss and bog land is a mile or two west of the stadium.

The original plans, and I saw them, had more parking and more access roads as well!

 

And wasn't there some old b0ll0cks about some kind of rare newt or other which had to be re-located? Should have left it there and stayed at Burnden and pis*ed off that Normid monstrosity.

Was that not where tesco was built ?

 

Fort sterling/fort james/georgia pacific or whater the feck they are called now made a tidy sum from that deal they gave tescos the land they owned in exchange for the old tescos land and a large wad of cash!

I go along with theory that the ground was located at Middlebrook as a centre piece for the development. At the time I heard that Hargreaves Construction formed part of the Orbit/Emerson Group.

 

No doubt about it that Gordon Hargreaves did well for himself as his firm carried out the internal building work untendered.

 

Also, who took us to a plc, received his allocation of free shares then resigned?

 

With regards to the ??35M debt being caused by the failure to sell the land at Burnden, I doubt it.

hello,

 

when i did my dissertation at uni i researched sports stadia. and one of my chapters was old stadia vs new stadia, also new hi-technology ect...

 

also Hargreaves construction built the de vere whites hotel, that didnt go to tender either! how much money did hargreaves make out of wanderes?!!