Guest harv Posted December 4, 2004 Posted December 4, 2004 Since becoming a season ticket holder 13 years ago I have seen Bolton play 4-4-2 to 4-5-1 and now to a 4-3-3. Obviously we are playing to our strengths with the players we have and the players are used to the system. Does anyone think we should try and change the way we play to surprise teams from time to time or should we stick to our tried and tested system 4-3-3 for the rest of the season ? 8-[
Mounts Kipper Posted December 4, 2004 Posted December 4, 2004 Since becoming a season ticket holder 13 years ago I have seen Bolton play 4-4-2 to 4-5-1 and now to a 4-3-3. Obviously we are playing to our strengths with the players we have and the players are used to the system. Does anyone think we should try and change the way we play to surprise teams from time to time or should we stick to our tried and tested system 4-3-3 for the rest of the season ? 8-[ would love to see us play 2 upfront at home especially against middle to bottom clubs.
Happy Wanderer Posted December 5, 2004 Posted December 5, 2004 Remember the days of 3-5-2 with flying wingers? Bring back Mendy. If we had a 'fast' right back I think it would work and surprise a few teams. Trouble is we have Nicky Hunt, who will get better, but he lacks speed to get up and down the wing all day. Gardner can and has proved it.
jolly-olly Posted December 5, 2004 Posted December 5, 2004 Our full backs this season are no longer a threat going forward. I would like to see Ricky(when fit) and Hunt going on the overlap a lot more and getting to the bye line or into the opposition penalty area.
monkfish Posted December 5, 2004 Posted December 5, 2004 4-3-3.. this is actually 4-5-1.. saying 4-3-3 means we ALWAYS play with 3 upfront. I'm a purest, I love 4-4-2.. I'm sick to the ragging bakc teeth of us playing 4-5-1 against the likes of Pompey and Palace at home. The only reason we don't play 4-4-2 is because we're managed/coached by a couple of lower division defenders who are naive to attacking football. Can't knock what Sam has acheived, but he's done it in the most boring way ever possible. Bring back 4-4-2. especially againmst the plonkers of the premier league. Rant Over..
Garrp Posted December 5, 2004 Posted December 5, 2004 4-3-3.. this is actually 4-5-1.. saying 4-3-3 means we ALWAYS play with 3 upfront. I'm a purest, I love 4-4-2.. I'm sick to the ragging bakc teeth of us playing 4-5-1 against the likes of Pompey and Palace at home. The only reason we don't play 4-4-2 is because we're managed/coached by a couple of lower division defenders who are naive to attacking football. Can't knock what Sam has acheived, but he's done it in the most boring way ever possible. Bring back 4-4-2. especially againmst the plonkers of the premier league. Rant Over.. Erm actually it has nothing whatsoever to do with that. 4-4-2 means we have 2 central midfielders. 2 from Okocha, Nolan, Speed & Campo dont play. Stelios would be right mid (most Wanderers fans, including me think he is horse shit) Garnder would be left mid, which would mean Bruno playing left back.
Darwen Posted December 5, 2004 Posted December 5, 2004 speed left wing nolan right wing okocha and campo in the center?
Garrp Posted December 5, 2004 Posted December 5, 2004 speed left wing nolan right wing okocha and campo in the center? ::::::::::::
monkfish Posted December 5, 2004 Posted December 5, 2004 Garp, what the fcuk are you talking about you spaz.. I'll go back to basics here. right 4-4-2. There's 4 at the back. there's 4 in midfield. 2 up front, right 4-5-1 There's 4 at the back. there's 5 in midfield. 1 up front, right 4-3-3 There's 4 at the back. there's 3 in midfield. 3 up front, Right then.. What we play is 4-5-1. Simple as, the formation is flexible in that it allows 2 players from midfield to drift forward whilst still maintaining cover for the back 4. But we ALWAYS operate with a lone striker 'Davies' who holds the ball up waiting for midfield to get forward. Right, then. 4-4-2, is more or less having 2 players roaming the 'offensive' areas of the field moving channels, switching places, confusing defenders. Like England used to play. e.g. Owen & Rooney The midfield can then get forward, when needed, to apply more firepower, ie. Gerrad & Lampard.. You'll probably argue that this is actually a secret 4-1-5 formation as we could at some point in the game have 5 attackers. If this hasn't helped, there's always Subuteo for Xmas from Father Christmas! I think you've been reading far to many spin-tails form Gordon Shorrocks BEN report on our marvellous formation. Monkers
Garrp Posted December 5, 2004 Posted December 5, 2004 Garp, what the fcuk are you talking about you spaz.. I'll go back to basics here. right 4-4-2. There's 4 at the back. there's 4 in midfield. 2 up front, right 4-5-1 There's 4 at the back. there's 5 in midfield. 1 up front, right 4-3-3 There's 4 at the back. there's 3 in midfield. 3 up front, Right then.. What we play is 4-5-1. Simple as, the formation is flexible in that it allows 2 players from midfield to drift forward whilst still maintaining cover for the back 4. But we ALWAYS operate with a lone striker 'Davies' who holds the ball up waiting for midfield to get forward. Right, then. 4-4-2, is more or less having 2 players roaming the 'offensive' areas of the field moving channels, switching places, confusing defenders. Like England used to play. e.g. Owen & Rooney The midfield can then get forward, when needed, to apply more firepower, ie. Gerrad & Lampard.. You'll probably argue that this is actually a secret 4-1-5 formation as we could at some point in the game have 5 attackers. If this hasn't helped, there's always Subuteo for Xmas from Father Christmas! I think you've been reading far to many spin-tails form Gordon Shorrocks BEN report on our marvellous formation. Monkers I wasn't arguing which formation was the best. I was arguing wich was the best formation for the players we have. Tell me the team you would play using the 4-4-2 formation
jolly-olly Posted December 5, 2004 Posted December 5, 2004 Jussi Ben Haim Jaidi N'Gotty Gardner Nolan Campo Okocha Speed Davies Diouf/Pederson This team is more than capable of playing 4-4-2. Speed actually started out as a left winger so he will be no stranger to playing in a left midfield role. I have put Ben Haim in until Hunt pulls his socks up. Diouf and Pederson can compete for the privilege of partnering Super Kev.
Zico Posted December 5, 2004 Posted December 5, 2004 Hunt delivered a pinpoint cross for Davies goal, not a bad days work if Haim was any better he'd be in the side
monkfish Posted December 5, 2004 Posted December 5, 2004 my 4-4-2 for what it's worth. with current players fit. Jussi Ben Haim, Ngotty, Jedi, Ceasar Stelios, Nolan, J-J, Speed Dioff, Davies. If I could select my ideal formation with all players fit and to form and to give the option of changing it around to give us 'alternatives' Jussi, Ngotty, Laville, Jedi, Ben Haim, Nolan, JJ, Speed, Ceasar Dioff, Davies bench, campo, pederson, gardner, hunt, Vaz tez. I'd go 3-5-2 using Ceasar and Taliban Haim to help us get behind defences with the bench giving us the 4-4-2 option if required. I'd use Ceasar, as for me, one poor performance against Fulham doesn't warrant being dropped for 13 games. Far better defender/left back than gardner, far more solid and commanding. After the Charlton game, he deserved a bit more of a run.
Garrp Posted December 5, 2004 Posted December 5, 2004 my 4-4-2 for what it's worth. with current players fit. Jussi Ben Haim, Ngotty, Jedi, Ceasar Stelios, Nolan, J-J, Speed Dioff, Davies. If I could select my ideal formation with all players fit and to form and to give the option of changing it around to give us 'alternatives' Jussi, Ngotty, Laville, Jedi, Ben Haim, Nolan, JJ, Speed, Ceasar Dioff, Davies bench, campo, pederson, gardner, hunt, Vaz tez. I'd go 3-5-2 using Ceasar and Taliban Haim to help us get behind defences with the bench giving us the 4-4-2 option if required. I'd use Ceasar, as for me, one poor performance against Fulham doesn't warrant being dropped for 13 games. Far better defender/left back than gardner, far more solid and commanding. After the Charlton game, he deserved a bit more of a run. I don't think I need to go on after that.
HomerJay Posted December 6, 2004 Posted December 6, 2004 cant believe i am actually gonna say this, but there is only garp who actually is talkin sense! speed as a 34 yr old winger??? [-X tug boat nolan as a winger?? our formation is fine because it works! plus have you not noticed nearly EVERY other team in the league adopting it???? 8th and loving it!!!!!! :D/
jolly-olly Posted December 6, 2004 Posted December 6, 2004 cant believe i am actually gonna say this, but there is only garp who actually is talkin sense! speed as a 34 yr old winger??? [-X tug boat nolan as a winger?? our formation is fine because it works! plus have you not noticed nearly EVERY other team in the league adopting it???? 8th and loving it!!!!!! :D/ What the fcuk has age got to do with it? Speed as a 34 year old centre midfielder could be used as the same argument for that matter.
Garrp Posted December 6, 2004 Posted December 6, 2004 cant believe i am actually gonna say this, but there is only garp who actually is talkin sense! speed as a 34 yr old winger??? [-X tug boat nolan as a winger?? our formation is fine because it works! plus have you not noticed nearly EVERY other team in the league adopting it???? 8th and loving it!!!!!! :D/ What the fcuk has age got to do with it? Speed as a 34 year old centre midfielder could be used as the same argument for that matter. Name me 5 ages 34+ decent wingers.
Zico Posted December 6, 2004 Posted December 6, 2004 cant believe i am actually gonna say this, but there is only garp who actually is talkin sense! speed as a 34 yr old winger??? [-X tug boat nolan as a winger?? our formation is fine because it works! plus have you not noticed nearly EVERY other team in the league adopting it???? 8th and loving it!!!!!! :D/ What the fcuk has age got to do with it? Speed as a 34 year old centre midfielder could be used as the same argument for that matter. wingers run up and down the wing alot, central midfielders tend to stay in the centre of the midfield Gary Speed has spent his career playing in the centre of the midfield, not running up and down wings as people get older, they tend not to be able to run around as much Gary Speed is exceptionally athletic, but running up and down the wing alot is probably asking a lot of him and why would you turn him into a winger at this point in his career, having spent several years playing cental midfield
jolly-olly Posted December 6, 2004 Posted December 6, 2004 Box to box central midfielders do a lot more running than your winger does believe me.
jolly-olly Posted December 6, 2004 Posted December 6, 2004 cant believe i am actually gonna say this, but there is only garp who actually is talkin sense! speed as a 34 yr old winger??? [-X tug boat nolan as a winger?? our formation is fine because it works! plus have you not noticed nearly EVERY other team in the league adopting it???? 8th and loving it!!!!!! :D/ There aren't many typical wingers about full stop these days. What the fcuk has age got to do with it? Speed as a 34 year old centre midfielder could be used as the same argument for that matter. Name me 5 ages 34+ decent wingers. There aren't many typical wingers around at any age these days
Casino Posted December 6, 2004 Posted December 6, 2004 we lost on saturday, i believe playing 4-3-3 with two attacking-ish wide midfielders who get forward when we've got it, and get back when we haven't in fact we've lost a few recently, so it couyld be argued we should change however it's just as likely we'd have lost playing 4-4-ragging 2 or 3-5-2 it's not about systems, it's about players doing their jobs right, and for me, one or two are struggling at the moment i know i labour it, but our centre backs aren't doing well enough, week in, week out, and yet its the full backs who get slated for what its worth, and even tho i'm not happy with central defence, i don't see many alternatives, since our dodgy centre half is also our main goal threat most weeks i guarantee if jaidi didn't score goals, folk would be on his back by now anyway, to the point - if there is one - yap about formations all day, but its taken us up to 8th in the league only reason for changing it is if we're confident theres something better i for one, am not in view of injuries and diouf, i'd play 4-3-3 as now jj - who is shit, doesn't command his area, can't kick hunt - big headed tosser cesar - not played enough to be slagged off just yet ngotty - seems to be immune from criticism jaidi - great striker, sadly he's a defender speed - could play left wing, just that nobody has realised before campo - campo okocha - he's shit too, doesn't wave his arms enough to be captain nolan - fat arsed scouser pedersen - couldn't hit a cows arse davies - pie boy, not mobile enough, does his best though that team, i'm sure you'll agree is poor yet somehow we're 8th must all be down to luck, as don't forget, sam is tactically inept
Casino Posted December 6, 2004 Posted December 6, 2004 olly, theres no wingers because theyre a liability unless theyre top class, and midfielders may do more running, but they don't do it fast
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