We're better. We will piss it.

5-1

Its up there with Megson and Lisbon away for me

Argentina do not have a better sqaud than us.

Someone was very quiet today in Sandbach.

That last half hour we could have done with some footballers.

I dunno who, like Palmer, Foden maybe?

We really did shit the bed didn’t we? If you click on it will translate. Basically 2 successful passes between 66 and 84 minute. And that was Pickford to Stones and back to Pickford. Fuck me

4 hours ago, Cheese said:

His dad died a couple of hours before kick off apparently.

He did indeed, I found out overnight. Not my favourite pundit but hands up for going in hard on him unfairly, he did extremely well in the circumstances

3 hours ago, Zico said:

imagine being the a bloke who devotes their time to supporting Ronaldo and attacking Messi on twitter, or vice versa

this one was a cunts trick though

Ifs, buts and maybes ……. But thought at the time that was a clear straight red for Fernandes for violent conduct. Can’t believe ref didn’t see it or VAR didn’t intervene. Not surprised though.

The surrender last night was a case of once too often to the well with a tactic that scrambled us past lesser sides but in a way that was physically exhausting.

It's a whole lot less fatiguing to remain in control of a match than give it up, as Spain have shown. Their substitutions have been more like for like in forward areas, enabling the same structure and principles to carry on, just with fresher legs and minds. The result has been late winners and the killing off of the French the other night.

Our players had started to struggle and retreat within a couple of minutes of us scoring and them bringing on a sub who had an immediate impact. The water break was the chance to re-establish us on the front foot, push back up the pitch and get about them in their half. What happened was the polar opposite.

We got as far as I anticipated, looking at the squad before a ball was kicked, its all the more galling this time though as so many of the bigger sides fell by the wayside, making the prospect of at least being in the final a more tantalising one.

Still can't get that out of my head, we weren't playing great but was doing completely fine up until the goal and then Tuchel changed the game by being a coward and showed he was on that night afraid of taking the lead. It worked vs Mexico as that was necessary, but that game did not require it, yes with 10 mins to go fine, it's natural anyway for players to try and protect the lead they have

But it was him who brought on those subs and set them to play like that, it was already nerve wracking but it's was also frustrating, and quite embarrassing this is a team with Bellingham and Kane and you would rather put on Dan Burn etc to protect a 1-0 lead than give those 2 some attacking subs to help them, not asking to go full out for a second, but don't just hand it them on a plate, Argentina would have came at us regardless, if we had out balls, we could have picked them off like Egypt did.

You basically said here Messi and co, have the ball, come at us and see what you can do, what do you think Messi is gonna do, the best player ever is going to finally do something if you give him the ball, Mac Allister hitting the post twice, Pickford's save on the line from the header should have triggered a thought at least, to say yes this isn't working, it's inevitable what's coming, yet even at 1-1 you carried on and it wasn't until 2-1 down did you bring on Rashford and Toney, why does having a lead, why does losing trigger a reaction, why not try and play like we were doing, with slight tweaks for tired players, that was a semi final of a World Cup, which now almost cancels out the positivity of Mexico, that game was still be remembered for years to come, but this tournament, England were denied a place in the final because of a cowardly decision to go mega defensive against the World Champions and Messi and now we must wait 2 years to put this right in a 'home' tournament, but can he be trusted, what are we gonna do if we have say France in a final at Wembley and go 1-0 up again.

Edited Thursday at 12:585 days by Didledee

Belgian pal of mine summed up his neutral opinion of England a few days before the semi.

In his view we have very good players but no style of play.

Couldn't disagree. My lame response was "but I think we've more to come in this tournament, we'll be better when we face decent opposition".

I'm currently avoiding him for a few days.

3 hours ago, deeane Koontz said:

Yup. There's this gem here lol

This is what pisses me off the most in all honesty.

Like to usually think I have a lot of sympathy for managers & a fair bit of patience.

But last night was everything he promised he wouldn’t do. Everything he promised the FA he wouldn’t do.

Got no problem hounding the players to be better but takes absolutely no responsibility for his own mistakes.

I’ve ended up thoroughly disliking the chap. Would feel differently if he held his hands up.

Embarrassing that he’ll be taking us to the Euros. The FA have to call him out on him doing the opposite of what he said.

7 minutes ago, wakey said:

Belgian pal of mine summed up his neutral opinion of England a few days before the semi.

In his view we have very good players but no style of play.

Couldn't disagree. My lame response was "but I think we've more to come in this tournament, we'll be better when we face decent opposition".

I'm currently avoiding him for a few days.

Our style of play with fast wingers and Bellingham surging forward would've been just fine.

It was working. We were 1-0 up and their full backs were shit scared of our attacks.

Both Center Backs were on cards and they'd just spent 45 mins trying to kick lumps off us they were that worried.

All we had to do was batten down the hatches for 20 minutes while they inevitably piled on the pressure.

Messi in every game this tournament has spent the last 30 mins drifting right. He was always going to drift there last night.

All we had to do was get some legs on and cover that right side.

But the absolute fucking lunatic lost his fucking mind and chucked 13 center backs on and took any pace or legs we had out the team.

It was complete suicide and his head should roll.

I was hoping I'd feel less calm about it by now but just cannot understand what he was thinking.

Why did nobody tell him to stop?

5 hours ago, Johnnyrotten said:

We might not be good enough, fair enough. But it would be good to have a manager that would allow us to find out.

That team wasn't a representation of England, in the last half hour it was a representation of a (German) football manager.

And if "we just aren't good enough", why are we arsed who the manager is? As fans we just want to see the best version of ourselves. Comparing it to SS and Bolton, we don't want to see the version that SS put out at Port Vale, that just wasn't us, it was a false line up and tactics. We want to see the Bolton that absolutely played to its strengths and thrilled us with the 3 play off performances. And if we'd lost, we'd have gone down fighting playing with an identity.

Still talking through the pain as are most on here.

5 hours ago, gonzo said:

If a man in his position doesn't know by now that those decisions last night were absolute suicide then I doubt he's going to learn now.

We disagree.

5 hours ago, Dr. Feelgood said:

Well, honestly I never expected to win the tournament.

Last night's defeat though sums up so much that is wrong in the 'over-thinking it' community of sports coaches.

You dominate the first half, score a great goal, all by playing an attacking style. Then, having done that, you change style, go defensive & get thumped.

If we end up third, he will have exceeded all former managers except for Sir Alf. I don't think we will but this has now given me the interest to watch it. https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/articles/cly5we2lgq4o

I know, I know. BBC News. Cunts the lot of 'em.

Edited Thursday at 14:385 days by bolty58

4 hours ago, bwfc4ife said:

Correction, Tuchel shouldn't get the chance.

Has to go for that last night.

Absolutely bemused, we had them right were we wanted them, scored and shat the bed like everyone has already mentioned then spent 30 mins looking like a deer in the headlights. All the commentary quoting 20 mins + stoppage time, it was straight after the goal. Absolutely beggars belief.

They've talked a lot about mentality and pride, what the fuck was that last night. Looked scared and in awe of the argies. World champs yes but i thought they were average and there for the taking. Spain will wipe the floor with them, totally outclassed and controlled it against France and will comfortably do the same sunday.

Spain are sensational. All well recorded on here. Ball retention and recovery the best I have ever seen.

Even with this, writing off Argentina is simply stupid. Their passion, unswerving belief and ability to find a way is off the scale.

The WC Final is an absolute 50-50 proposition for me. I won't be surprised to see the little maestro lifting the trophy again nor will I be surprised if Spain starve them of the ball and wear them down.

Can't see anything other than TT staying and leading us into the Euros.

I must admit, I'll probably not even bother watching the final now, there's absolutely no chance I'm watching the "losers" final - both teams won't give a fuck, and will field reserve teams, which I suppose will give the likes of Trafford, Mainoo and Toney a bit of a runout

3 hours ago, Stig said:

Spot on. I don't buy the view they have a better team or squad than us.

They're aging and slow and if we'd attempted to play any football after the 55th minute we'd be looking forward to a final.

Reigning world champions and in the big dance again.

Bitter rivalry blinds folk.

1 minute ago, bolty58 said:

Can't see anything other than TT staying and leading us into the Euros.

I think that's pretty much a given, no way he resigns and the FA won't get rid, with them having given him a new contract just 4 months ago, until after the 2028 Euros

3 hours ago, gonzo said:

Argentina do not have a better sqaud than us.

Opinions. I know which one I would prefer to have.

Talking the talk is one thing. Walking the walk something else entirely. I'm afraid they have the runs of the board.

Seeing stars.

7 minutes ago, Sweep said:

I must admit, I'll probably not even bother watching the final now, there's absolutely no chance I'm watching the "losers" final - both teams won't give a fuck, and will field reserve teams, which I suppose will give the likes of Trafford, Mainoo and Toney a bit of a runout

Remoaner style 'toys out of the pram' behaviour.

No surprise.

5 minutes ago, Sweep said:

I think that's pretty much a given, no way he resigns and the FA won't get rid, with them having given him a new contract just 4 months ago, until after the 2028 Euros

Just call me Nostradamus 😜

2 minutes ago, bolty58 said:

Remoaner style 'toys out of the pram' behaviour.

No surprise.

Not really, the 3rd/4th place game will be shit, it always is, and I think I'd rather just go out on Saturday night instead.

The final doesn't have England in it, so I probably won't make the effort to sit down and watch it. I've barely watched any of the WC, if it doesn't involve England, then I'm generally not that fussed.

I do have an interest in the fact that I have Spain in a sweep, and I had a pre-tournament bet on Argentina, so I may well tune in at some point towards the end of the game, to see how financially well off I am