Casino Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 Without him I don't think the current available squad can muster a team to get points off Sunderland 9 times out of 10. we're fcuked then
onefinfrandsen Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 Why? When the best we have at that role is currently not in the matchday squad? Traf, preferring round pegs in round holes. The best we have in that role might not be available for a while, it could be to late by the time he comes back.
L/H White Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 The solution is to sell Cahill, and add to the squad accordingly. Keeping him doesnt appear to of helped us.
magic legs Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 It's just rearranging the deckchairs on the Titanic for me.I would still expect Sunderland to beat that Bolton team home and away. The massive problem we have is the loss of Stuart Holden and to a lesser extent Lee.Bolton's success last season was almost all down to Holden.Without him I don't think the current available squad can muster a team to get points off Sunderland 9 times out of 10. Reo-Coker, Muamba and a.n.other is a poor central midfield by Prem standards and not in the same class as Bolton's with Holden plus we don't have a good striker.There is no cutting edge in that team. Dont agree with that at all. With Muamba playing in a 451 we may not have been any better creatively, but we'd have been a damned sight more tighter going through the middle and we woudlnt have got outmuscled (like we did against Norwich as well).
tylswhite Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 The solution is for Owen Coyle to change his formation and his phillosophy until LCY and Holden are back, Robinson needs to be dropped, we should look at the best players to play in a 4-3-3 4-5-1 formation, the 2 centre halfs pick themselves Cahill and Wheater, the only fit left back other than Robbo is Gardner so thats left back sorted, Boyatta at right back , onto midfield, we should go Reo Coker and Muamba to give us a solid central 2 we then need a creative option inbetween the 2 central midfielders and the lone striker that could be Mark Davies/Tuncay/Pratley we should rotate these 3 to see who looks the business in that role, that leaves 2 wide players and hopefully the 2 centre mids giving us the bit of solidity we might just get away with our lack of quality out wide so we have to play Petrov as he is decent going forward, on the right hand side we have a big problem because Eagles is inconsistent and lacks real quality, so I think we have to give kakuta the nod and hope that he steps up to the plate, with Ngog up top I think thats the best team and formation I can muster with the players available. Be intersting to see what other formations and team selections other fans think might improve the current situation. Bang on. Ngog actually holds the ball up better and keeps it much better than SKD. I think Kakuta playing off the front might be worth a try too, he looks like he will take people on for fun and would be a menace in that role inbetween the midfield and the opposition back line. SKD was so bad it was unreal, the guy couldnt even control the fucking ball. Another big problem with the team was no pace either imo. Two wingers who cant run and two slugs in centre midfield and Skd up front. Sunderland just squeezed up the space and they knew we didnt have the quality to pass it round or through them.
only1swanny Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 The solution is to sell Cahill, and add to the squad accordingly. Keeping him doesnt appear to of helped us. im actually pondering this myself
Mounts Kipper Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 (edited) It's just rearranging the deckchairs on the Titanic for me.I would still expect Sunderland to beat that Bolton team home and away. The massive problem we have is the loss of Stuart Holden and to a lesser extent Lee.Bolton's success last season was almost all down to Holden.Without him I don't think the current available squad can muster a team to get points off Sunderland 9 times out of 10. Reo-Coker, Muamba and a.n.other is a poor central midfield by Prem standards and not in the same class as Bolton's with Holden plus we don't have a good striker.There is no cutting edge in that team. Well you play with the band as the ship sinks, I will run for the lifeboats. Edited October 24, 2011 by Mounts Kipper
Carlos Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 The solutions as I see it: Fuck off this goalkeeping clown they got from Burnley, Jussi is a far worse keeper since his arrival and Bogdan is a joke. To not have already done that borders on incompetence or cluelessness already. Bring in someone with experience to do a top down analysis of the coaching staff and methods employed and act upon their recommendations ASAP. We should have done that during the recent international break. Send Coyle on a top class man management course and equip him with the skills he needs to succeed rather than just clapping and grinning inanely. Personally I think we need a strong assistant to help Owen through, this Sandy (?) person is anonymous. I've not heard anyone mention him in interviews or sing his praises. Which begs the question; what the fuck does he do?
Mounts Kipper Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 The solutions as I see it: Fuck off this goalkeeping clown they got from Burnley, Jussi is a far worse keeper since his arrival and Bogdan is a joke. To not have already done that borders on incompetence or cluelessness already. Bring in someone with experience to do a top down analysis of the coaching staff and methods employed and act upon their recommendations ASAP. We should have done that during the recent international break. Send Coyle on a top class man management course and equip him with the skills he needs to succeed rather than just clapping and grinning inanely. Personally I think we need a strong assistant to help Owen through, this Sandy (?) person is anonymous. I've not heard anyone mention him in interviews or sing his praises. Which begs the question; what the fuck does he do? Good points, the big concern is O.C. has had 7 years experience the majority in mickey mouse leagues, as we all know even ferguson after yesterday if your formation or certain players are weak you can be mercilessly punished as we have this season on countless occasions, you cannnot get away with playing 2 in the centre of midfield unless they get some help going backewards from the wide men.
DazBob Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 (edited) I know this is an obvious-as-fuck post, but we need to learn how to defend as a team. Our centre-back pairing is excellent IMO, but that's where our defensice capability ends. None of our current full-backs can defend. Eagles and Petrov offer them no protection and cannot defend. Pratley is looking like a fish out of water and cannot defend. Reo Coker, for all his fist pumping and speaking a good game cannot defend. Teams are cutting through us far, far too easily. I've never been Muamba's biggest fan due to his ability on the ball, but by Christ, we don't half look fragile without him in there. Playing him alongside NRC would make us more industrious than creative, but it'd make us a hell of a lot more solid. Petrov has come in for a lot of undeserved flak this season, but I think the time has now come to use him only as a sub at least until we've got some points on the table and the team is looking more confident. Davies HAS to be dropped too. I'd give his place to Tuncay and have him playing a little bit deeper as he's got the work ethic to drop back and help out in midfield. If we beat Swansea then we go level with them and things don't look quite as bad. I'd certainly not put any money on that though, the Taffs are looking a far better team than us at the moment. I can see the likes of Sinclair and Dyer raping us down the wings. Worrying times. If Coyle wasn't Coyle, then the bedsheets would already be out. Edited October 24, 2011 by DazBobParr
Carlos Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 In some ways, MU are in the same position as us, the difference is that Fergie will do something about it. You just need to compare the noises coming out of OT to those coming from the Reebok. The last thing I saw, Owen was putting it onto the players "You want real men standing up to show what they're made of". Tell you what Owen, give them a fucking sporting chance eh?
DazBob Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 In some ways, MU are in the same position as us Really? One team has just lost their first game at home for well over a year, to the richest team in the world with an embarrassment of attacking talent ... the other has just lost/surrendered their seventh game at home on the trot.
Mounts Kipper Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 I think Pratley getting a lot of undeserved flak he has come into a losing team being played in centre midfield with not a lot of support from out wide, players behind him making lots of mistakes so it has been difficult to say the least, as I have said before he covers every blade of grass and is not bad on the ball gets into goal scoring positions. I do not think there is a lot wrong with him, for me it is a close call whether to team Muamba up with Coker or Pratley, for sure there is more mobility in Pratley and Muamba. If we dont improve with Muamba and Coker I would definitely give Pratley amd muamba a whirl maybe in the carling cup before blooding them in the league.
Carlos Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 Really? One team has just lost their first game at home for well over a year, to the richest team in the world with an embarrassment of attacking talent ... the other has just lost/surrendered their seventh game at home on the trot. All the same, we are in the bottom three and going down, they are 2nd place and winning fuck all. Neither are acceptable to their supporters. Obviously not the same if you word it your way, which is underpinned by the assumption that they are two equal entities you are comparing.
Casino Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 who wouldn't swap stewart and davies and hughes for ray wilkins?
Flannel Truscott Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 The solutions as I see it: Fuck off this goalkeeping clown they got from Burnley, Jussi is a far worse keeper since his arrival and Bogdan is a joke. To not have already done that borders on incompetence or cluelessness already. Bring in someone with experience to do a top down analysis of the coaching staff and methods employed and act upon their recommendations ASAP. We should have done that during the recent international break. Send Coyle on a top class man management course and equip him with the skills he needs to succeed rather than just clapping and grinning inanely. Personally I think we need a strong assistant to help Owen through, this Sandy (?) person is anonymous. I've not heard anyone mention him in interviews or sing his praises. Which begs the question; what the fuck does he do? I agree with the sentiment of this, but not the reality. The reality OC is the manager - he brings in the staff, he's respnsible for coaching - the buck stops with the ?m salary. If he can't bring in a good enough team or get the coaching right that's as bad as getting the tactics wrong. He's either upto it or he isn't - the board shouldn't have to (and don't have the time to) hold his hand and help him along.
Casino Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 He's either upto it or he isn't - the board shouldn't have to (and don't have the time to) hold his hand and help him along. lads reet but don't forget, we have to keep the bedsheets happy and since sir owen is happy clappy, him as the front man keeps em quiet while somebody in the background does the real work
onefinfrandsen Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 I think Pratley getting a lot of undeserved flak he has come into a losing team being played in centre midfield with not a lot of support from out wide, players behind him making lots of mistakes so it has been difficult to say the least, as I have said before he covers every blade of grass and is not bad on the ball gets into goal scoring positions. I do not think there is a lot wrong with him, for me it is a close call whether to team Muamba up with Coker or Pratley, for sure there is more mobility in Pratley and Muamba. If we dont improve with Muamba and Coker I would definitely give Pratley amd muamba a whirl maybe in the carling cup before blooding them in the league. Think pratley just needs a run of games to get use to the pace of the premier league, hes been dropped in at the deep end into a team thats low in confidence and on a long losing run.on saturday 2 of his runs almost produced goals, dont forget he hardly played the second half of last season after a fall out at swansea.bet hes bursting a gut to score on saturday.
Carlos Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 You can say that, that Garty's only option is to leave OC to it and eventually sack him. Or we get try and get through this using techniques used throughout other businesses. OC is the first team manager not director of football, the buck stops with the chairman in my opinion.
DazBob Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 Think pratley just needs a run of games to get use to the pace of the premier league, hes been dropped in at the deep end into a team thats low in confidence and on a long losing run.on saturday 2 of his runs almost produced goals, dont forget he hardly played the second half of last season after a fall out at swansea.bet hes bursting a gut to score on saturday. How long do we give him to find his feet? At present I'd rather have Muamba in there hitting row Z with his shots, but at least making us harder to break down in the meantime.
onefinfrandsen Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 How long do we give him to find his feet? At present I'd rather have Muamba in there hitting row Z with his shots, but at least making us harder to break down in the meantime. As long as it takes, it wont be easy if we continue to struggle and the history of some of our fans have of getting on the back of certain players.think we can fit pratley and muamba in the same team.
tylswhite Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 I think Pratley getting a lot of undeserved flak he has come into a losing team being played in centre midfield with not a lot of support from out wide, players behind him making lots of mistakes so it has been difficult to say the least, as I have said before he covers every blade of grass and is not bad on the ball gets into goal scoring positions. I do not think there is a lot wrong with him, for me it is a close call whether to team Muamba up with Coker or Pratley, for sure there is more mobility in Pratley and Muamba. If we dont improve with Muamba and Coker I would definitely give Pratley amd muamba a whirl maybe in the carling cup before blooding them in the league. The trouble is with Pratley is he seems average at everything. A decent all rounder but i cant see that being enough in the long run.
Happy Wanderer Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 Can someone print this thread off please and send it to OC, thanks.
only1swanny Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 The trouble is with Pratley is he seems average at everything. A decent all rounder but i cant see that being enough in the long run. aka Squad player... we have a team full of them.. and no starters..
tylswhite Posted October 24, 2011 Posted October 24, 2011 aka Squad player... we have a team full of them.. and no starters.. To be fair i have to agree. The only 3 players in our team at the moment that stand out as decent quality to me are Ngog, Wheater & Cahill. The rest either have their best days behind them or are just very average. Weve done well with average players before though when we get the best out of them but at the moment nobody is really standing up. Whether or not thats the managers fault i dont know. Weve got two quality players out injured which isnt helping matters. Eagles seemed confident on Saturday but he shoots like a pussy and he makes the wrong decision with the ball far too often. Robinson regularly gets skinned and all teams aim down his side now theyve clicked on. Pratley worked hard but seemed to be chasing shadows most of the game and missed our best chance without even hitting the target. Davies looks like he has gone, cant even control the football nevermind hold it up/lay it off. We can live with a few average players but the four above are way below the standard we need imo and these need to be replaced ASAP.
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