Just fook off Im trying to watch ssn and have a relaxing beer and no I don't want a sticker. Sorry rant over

Bolty, I'm not 'shit scared' of calling it as I see it. Those fans who arrived without tickets were definitely part of the problem. My point is that they're not anywhere near the main issue. Ticketless fans, rightly or wrongly, have been a feature of major games before and since (plenty United fans got in to Wembley against Barcelona apparently). It's to protect fans' safety from a minority of idiots that we have policing, stewarding, emergency planning etc. All of which failed spectacularly on the day - and all identified by every report done on Hillsborough as the factors which, had they worked properly, would have avoided this tragedy. Of course if everyone had turned up 2 hours early, with a ticket, sober and queued politely then we wouldn't need police, stewards etc... but that's not what happens on FA Cup semi final day, so we do.

 

You say I won't acknowledge the part ticketless fans played (and let's be honest, nobody has any idea how many actually fell into that category), well I do...I just don't see it as a major part of the disaster. You, on the other hand, seem unable or unwilling to get half as exercised by the clearly identified failings of the people who were responsible for crowd safety - let alone the massive cover-up and smear campaign which followed.

Those fans who arrived without tickets were definitely part of the problem.

 

You go onto a Scouse board and tell them that.

Hallejulah, you've finally said that the fans contributed.

 

No one said the events of that day were all their fault.  No one said the police did nothing wrong.  No one said fans of other clubs around that time didn't act in a similar fashion.

No, but lots of people made no mention of the main cause of this disaster (as identified by official reports and an apology from SYP which came 23 years too late) and instead placed all the blame on 'the murderers' ie Scousers generally.

"Murderers" is derived from Heysel.

No, but lots of people made no mention of the main cause of this disaster (as identified by official reports and an apology from SYP which came 23 years too late) and instead placed all the blame on 'the murderers' ie Scousers generally.

 

 

Can you find a quote on here where anybody has "placed all the blame" on them?

 

I'm beginning to think you were either amongst them on that day or you're a bin dipper such are your protestations.

I wasn't there and I'm not a scouser. As I said, my first response was prompted by some comments I found particularly offensive which showed no empathy for the suffering this has caused for a lot of people. Whoever it was basically was saying 'fuck em', they're all vermin, compo grabbing thieves who should shut the fuck up'. Thankfully that view isn't representative of most people on here. I've no problem with an honest discussion of what went wrong - which I think this thread has largely done - and accept people have different opinions about the rights and wrongs. The other stuff I can do without though. Each to their own.

So, we've another seven pages that come to the same rational and reasonable conclusion...

 

But, some moron(s) will probably take a cursory glance at, perhaps even not venturing beyond the synopsis on Google search, see the thread title and some terms like "murderers", "always the victim" or "bin-dipper" - then declare each and every one of us 'vile'.

 

Brilliant.

Edited August 20, 201312 yr by Youri McAnespie

Can you find a quote on here where anybody has "placed all the blame" on them?

 

Page1. Post #5. It's now listed as 'Popular' on account of the number of +1's it got, so presumably it's a popularly held view.

Alternatively, it could be voted as 'popular' due to the return to the poster (concerning his hijacking of The Burnden Park disaster to illustrate his point)? Just construe it the way that suits your argument though.

Edited August 20, 201312 yr by Youri McAnespie

anyway, 5 votes

 

out of 27000 views

6, just to piss him off.

As I said, my first response was prompted by some comments I found particularly offensive.

 

 

If thats the case I'm not sure this place is for you.

anyway, 5 votes

 

out of 27000 views

 

Maybe you should reconsider branding it as 'Popular' then.

As said poster, I wasn't 'hijacking' what happened in March 1946, but simply trying to make the person who reduced the whole issue down to "the compo's nailed on so just fuck off" to stop and think for a second.

Maybe you should reconsider branding it as 'Popular' then.

 

start your own board and knock yourself out

6, just to piss him off.

 

 

7, for the same reason

Thanks Ricky, no it doesn't. But just because you're offensive doesn't mean you're right, either.

- The fans didn't conspire to arrive late. Whoopy do. They didn't conspire to arrive late, but perhaps, just maybe, they DID arrive live, and en mass, and force entry. Just because it wasn't conspired doesn't mean it didn't happen.

- Furthermore, there is no evidence. Again, that doesn't mean it didn't happen. It just means that there was no evidence it happened.

 

Please never be on a jury.

 

is that a note to self at the bottom?

8. It's getting more and more popularer every minute.

SnoopJohnnyJohn, on 16 Aug 2013 - 4:18 PM, said:

- The fans didn't conspire to arrive late. Whoopy do. They didn't conspire to arrive late, but perhaps, just maybe, they DID arrive live, and en mass, and force entry. Just because it wasn't conspired doesn't mean it didn't happen.

- Furthermore, there is no evidence. Again, that doesn't mean it didn't happen. It just means that there was no evidence it happened.

 

Please never be on a jury.

 

 

is that a note to self at the bottom?

 

 

If it was, he almost certainly wrote it in crayon.

Oooh, cutting.

As said poster, I wasn't 'hijacking' what happened in March 1946, but simply trying to make the person who reduced the whole issue down to "the compo's nailed on so just fuck off" to stop and think for a second.

 

He did stop and think, as he pointed out - he had a relative personally involved in the (Burnden Park) disaster, this doesn't alter his, unpalatable to some (many? few?) viewpoint. Why should it?

 

People have differing opinions, whether rightly or wrongly. Maybe we should all follow the example set by the Twatterati/Facebook generation and divide all subjects into 'right' and 'wrong' and judge accordingly harshly those who stray into what the masses define is the 'wrong' opinion?

 

If this, as a corollary, helps anyone abdicate personally responsibility for anything detrimental that happens to them, all the better.

Edited August 20, 201312 yr by Youri McAnespie

So we are getting somewhere in that it is accepted that the ticketless fans had a part to play.

My next thought is with regard to the compensation, and let us not hide away from this issue. The reason for my cynicism was fuelled by that record in the charts a while ago. The government have released a statement haven't they, apologising for some of the lies?

Money doesn't recompense for losing a loved one.

Edited August 20, 201312 yr by no balls