They seem to have got themselves into a bit of a pickle. The daft racist cunts.

1 minute ago, ErnestTurnip said:

In 2020 45% of the men being employed to play county cricket who were educated in this country come from a private school background but only 7% of the population go to independent schools.

So summat’s not right somewhere.

As a stat, it only reflects the fact that there's more opportunity to play at that school.

Those schools have facilities, but importantly, the kids play.

My lad finished secondary school this time, and PE was a 40 minute session per week, with changing time included in that. Utter shit. They did nowt generally. 

Nothing to do with money etc, just ridiculous timetabling etc. Wasn't like that when we went to school.

Private schools often achieve very good academic results too, but there are only the same number of hours in the day.

The point being made is that the game as a whole has a huge network available to folk from all backgrounds, and you can see that at clubs all over town.

Simply put, if someone can play, they'll get a chance. 

14 minutes ago, boltondiver said:

Not enough comprehensive schools play cricket.

Exaclty. Its a class issue. 

We never played cricket at my school, nor do either of my kids apart from the odd blast in PE.

Btw bobby, 9 out of the test 11 in 2020 went to public school according to a 0.2 second bit of research I just did.

To me its pretty comon knowledge. You just wont see it as you're involved with a club full of working class lads, I will know plenty of them. 

We arent talking participation here. We are talking making it at a higher level. If the professionals seem to think theres class barriers, Im certain there is.

 

Edited November 21, 20214 yr by gonzo

Wisden was the source.

https://wisden.com/stories/magazine/crickets-diversity-problem-the-class-ceiling

4 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

As a stat, it only reflects the fact that there's more opportunity to play at that school.

That’s not true because it doesn’t mention anything about opportunity to play at all. Your opinion on the stat might be correct or it might not be, the stat on its own just tells us that people who go to independent schools are represented disproportionately in the field of professional county cricketers.

1 minute ago, ErnestTurnip said:

Wisden was the source.

https://wisden.com/stories/magazine/crickets-diversity-problem-the-class-ceiling

That’s not true because it doesn’t mention anything about opportunity to play at all. Your opinion on the stat might be correct or it might not be, the stat on its own just tells us that people who go to independent schools are represented disproportionately in the field of professional county cricketers.

Bollocks.

It is not disproportionate, if very few others play.

Doesn't matter how deep your article is, the reality is that very few kids at secondary school get to play.

If they did, but we're still under represented then there might be something to discuss.

Other than that, your just utilising one stat to make a point that doesn't necessarily follow.

A point in reverse, as said above, is football. How many professionals went to a private school, and is it disproportionate?

Probably not, as few do overall.

And again, your not considering the game as a whole.

1 minute ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

Bollocks.

It is not disproportionate, if very few others play.

Doesn't matter how deep your article is, the reality is that very few kids at secondary school get to play.

If they did, but we're still under represented then there might be something to discuss.

Other than that, your just utilising one stat to make a point that doesn't necessarily follow.

A point in reverse, as said above, is football. How many professionals went to a private school, and is it disproportionate?

Probably not, as few do overall.

And again, your not considering the game as a whole.

Cricket isn't wisely played at normal comprehensive schools.

Cricket is widely played at public schools.

How hard is that to understand?

3 hours ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

My old gaffer played for Darcy Lever. He told me the following:

A while back they applied for lottery/sport England money, to improve ground/facilities etc.

Instead another club was created next door with an award that DL didn't get.

Bolton Indians sports club.

I've been and used their facilities and it seems a decent place. 

However, is this really the way to promote diversity and inclusivity?

DL an established club, alongside many others with a history of bringing players from all over the world to play alongside our own. Seems that got ignored.

I hope when cricket looks at itself such things are included, but I doubt it.

When it first opened, Bolton Indian Sports Club became the home sports venue for women’s rounders teams, hockey teams, kids football teams, etc. This lasted for two or three seasons whilst the lottery folk came inspecting and seeing all the diverse sports. Such was the diversity, the lottery folk couldn’t wait to get their “Funded by Lottery” plaque in place.

As soon as it was up, all the other sports were fucked off; unneeded, surplus to requirements.

Cheating cunts!

8 minutes ago, gonzo said:

Exaclty. Its a class issue. 

We never played cricket at my school, nor do either of my kids apart from the odd blast in PE.

Btw bobby, 9 out of the test 11 in 2020 went to public school according to a 0.2 second bit of research I just did.

To me its pretty comon knowledge. You just wont see it as you're involved with a club full of working class lads, I will know plenty of them. 

We arent talking participation here. We are talking making it at a higher level. If the professionals seem to think theres class barriers, Im certain there is.

 

Participation is indeed an issue. But schools just don't seem to bother now.

I went to County Grammar, what little equipment there was, was a bit knackered to say the least. We still played and got the opportunity. 

Why they don't now is a mystery. But it's not just cricket neither- so little time spent on sporting activities as a whole.

As a consequence, its inevitable that a lot of players will have been to private school, but that doesn't prove bias. Can only prove that if all kids played, but few state kids got through. 

5 minutes ago, gonzo said:

Cricket isn't wisely played at normal comprehensive schools.

Cricket is widely played at public schools.

How hard is that to understand?

Read my posts again please. They're not hard to understand. 

You said yourself a lot of local clubs exist, and they represent their community.

If young players there come to the fore, they'll get the chance.

All this "class" talk is somewhat outdated. Someone makes a successful life for themselves, and sends a kid to Bolton School. Kid plays cricket and gets into lancs team.

Therefore kid is of a higher class. Nah.

Of course some examples will exist, but a coarse Yorkshireman who likes to lean on his background, sort of proves the point. If you're good enough, then you'll make it.

Edited November 21, 20214 yr by Tonge moor green jacket

25 minutes ago, gonzo said:

Exaclty. Its a class issue. 

We never played cricket at my school, nor do either of my kids apart from the odd blast in PE.

Btw bobby, 9 out of the test 11 in 2020 went to public school according to a 0.2 second bit of research I just did.

To me its pretty comon knowledge. You just wont see it as you're involved with a club full of working class lads, I will know plenty of them. 

We arent talking participation here. We are talking making it at a higher level. If the professionals seem to think theres class barriers, Im certain there is.

 

Whether kids go to public or comprehensive isn’t about class, it’s about money!

Edited November 21, 20214 yr by boltondiver

5 minutes ago, gonzo said:

Exaclty. Its a class issue. 

We never played cricket at my school, nor do either of my kids apart from the odd blast in PE.

Btw bobby, 9 out of the test 11 in 2020 went to public school according to a 0.2 second bit of research I just did.

To me its pretty comon knowledge. You just wont see it as you're involved with a club full of working class lads, I will know plenty of them. 

We arent talking participation here. We are talking making it at a higher level. If the professionals seem to think theres class barriers, Im certain there is.

 

I’m not sure what you mean by class. Are you saying Independent schools define your class? My niece went to Bolton School. She doesn’t play cricket but she’s been around the world watching it. That’s why I said ‘better’ schools. It’s not about class.

Cricket should be on the National curriculum for sport. 

14 minutes ago, MickyD said:

When it first opened, Bolton Indian Sports Club became the home sports venue for women’s rounders teams, hockey teams, kids football teams, etc. This lasted for two or three seasons whilst the lottery folk came inspecting and seeing all the diverse sports. Such was the diversity, the lottery folk couldn’t wait to get their “Funded by Lottery” plaque in place.

As soon as it was up, all the other sports were fucked off; unneeded, surplus to requirements.

Cheating cunts!

There you go.

Were Bradshaw in for some dosh too?

Fact remains though, that money could have gone to already existing clubs to develop and enhance their offering.

I used to play badminton at BI, we'd go with no one there it was great. Then out of the blue they cancelled our bookings with no explanation. Maybe makes sense now.

 

13 minutes ago, boltondiver said:

Whether kids go to public or comprehensive isn’t about class, it’s about money!

 

12 minutes ago, BobyBrno said:

I’m not sure what you mean by class. Are you saying Independent schools define your class? My niece went to Bolton School. She doesn’t play cricket but she’s been around the world watching it. That’s why I said ‘better’ schools. It’s not about class.

Cricket should be on the National curriculum for sport. 

These.

Absolutely. 

Fucking hate the word "class"- it is completely classless. 

What actually is being middle or working class any road?

17 minutes ago, boltondiver said:

Whether kids go to public or comprehensive isn’t about class, it’s about money!

Indeed it is.

2 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

 

These.

Absolutely. 

Fucking hate the word "class"- it is completely classless. 

What actually is being middle or working class any road?

Indeed

2 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

 

These.

Absolutely. 

Fucking hate the word "class"- it is completely classless. 

What actually is being middle or working class any road?

Rectangular cut sandwiches = working class

Triangles = middle class 

On the subject of ‘ better ‘ schools, I’ve done a lot of work for Turton School. They seem to have a great record of pupils who have gone on to achieve great things in sport.

18 minutes ago, BobyBrno said:

On the subject of ‘ better ‘ schools, I’ve done a lot of work for Turton School. They seem to have a great record of pupils who have gone on to achieve great things in sport.

Posh intake area

Regarding the 2020 Test squad.

Jimmy Anderson - State school 

Jonny Bairstow - Independent 

Joe Root - State school 

Jos Buttler - Independent 

Moeen Ali - State school

Adil Rashid - State school

I could go on but does it really matter?

Does anyone look at those players and think anything differently of them because of where they were educated?

🤷‍♂️

 

 

3 minutes ago, boltondiver said:

Posh intake area

Britains greatest Olympian and a World Cup winner?

 

Farnworth. 😊

11 minutes ago, boltondiver said:

Posh intake area

If that is the same thing as having parents who are willing to make sacrifices for their kids, agreed.

14 minutes ago, BobyBrno said:

Regarding the 2020 Test squad.

Jimmy Anderson - State school 

Jonny Bairstow - Independent 

Joe Root - State school 

Jos Buttler - Independent 

Moeen Ali - State school

Adil Rashid - State school

I could go on but does it really matter?

Does anyone look at those players and think anything differently of them because of where they were educated?

🤷‍♂️

 

 

I think the question is whether there is undue bias in the development and selection processes. If there is and it means a failure to identify and appreciate talent from poorer areas then it will likely have an impact on the fortunes of the national team. That is worth caring about in my opinion.

One explanation for the disparity is that the scholarship system means some of the very best youngsters are offered places at private schools in order to aid their development and also to convince them to sign for county Academies. For example, Lancashire paid for Haseeb Hameed to attend Bolton School to ward of interest from Worcestershire, who were making a similar offer of private education.

I went to Bolton School and we played cricket twice a week in the final term of each year ie from Easter onwards.

Mind you, I am well posh, I was brought up in Highfield, Farnworth, behind the Flying Shuttle.

As far as I can see, mainstream schools have a PE Dept. staff and that’s who teach sport. Bolton School can afford to bring in specialist coaches. They’ll contact Lancs and ask for a schools coach.

My lads football team - Rivington & Blackrod - played Bolton School in a cup final just before lockdown.

On the Bolton School coaching staff were Keith Branagan, an FA coach, a former Man United coach and Ryan Giggs.

On the RBHS coaching staff was just the PE teacher.

The pressure was all on the Bolton lot because success is expected given the money involved.

Bolton School won 1-0 and frankly we all knew the penalty the ref gave was bollocks but he clearly knew which side his bread was buttered on.

Money usually wins.

Just now, Spider said:

My lads football team - Rivington & Blackrod - played Bolton School in a cup final just before lockdown.

On the Bolton School coaching staff were Keith Branagan, an FA coach, a former Man United coach and Ryan Giggs.

On the RBHS coaching staff was just the PE teacher.

The pressure was all on the Bolton lot because success is expected given the money involved.

Bolton School won 1-0 and frankly we all knew the penalty the ref gave was bollocks but he clearly knew which side his bread was buttered on.

Money usually wins.

So it imitated real life?