Conversation today about this but none of us really could name any 1 player. 

5 hours ago, Johnnyrotten said:

There is a perception that we are "weak" defensively (clearly true) and that we are OK up front.  In 10 games against the only promotion challengers in this league (everyone from Orient down are also rans), we've scored in 2.  8 games, never really looked like troubling the keeper in most of them, did we get any near misses never mind goals?  Whether its the midfield's fault or the strikers, we are woefully short in the games that matter, we couldn't go into a play off expecting to even score never mind win.

It's been our Achilles heel for a long while, and my niggle about Collins and McAtee, their returns look ok but a chunk of their goals are of limited importance, in the Vertu cup, consolations when we're three down or filling their boots when we're three up and opponents are on the floor. 

Top strikers find the net when it's needed to save a point or win a game, in tight games with few chances.

The really big, crucial goals our two have scored this season have been few and far between. Between August and Xmas they scored only one winning goal between them (Collins v Blackpool). Collins scored a couple of key goals in Jan and Feb (equaliser at Exeter, winner at Huddersfield), then McAtee had his little purple patch from half time at Shrewsbury (winner + 1 there, opener v Orient, equaliser v Brum), since then, a real fade out, only one goal of any consequence, Collins winner v Bristol R. 

There have, to be fair, been a few opening goals in games we've gone onto win but the winners and match savers don't run into double figures. 

Edited April 20, 20251 yr by ianofcleveleys

Who is/was the biggest wind up...

Madine or McAtee

1 minute ago, gonzo said:

Who is/was the biggest wind up...

Madine or McAtee

Not had a proper wum since Verlinden

43 minutes ago, Johnnyrotten said:

I certainly did.  But I had overestimated IE's ability to sign the right type of players.  We lost JDB and Jerome so anyone with half a brain would surely say the priority was someone with a little bit of strength and/or heading ability and/or someone that would be described as a centre forward on their CV. 

But no, IE knew better and we got Collins mark 2; then in Jan when he had the opportunity to right the wrong, he chose to sign a midfield version of the pair of them for another huge fee (despite knowing Morley was coming back) and one of the worst players any of us have seen from Cardiff.  It beggars belief.  And some on here reacted to any criticism of IE with "show us your coaching badges" type comments.

Even professional managers get it wrong occasionally, and in IEs case very wrong for a prolonged period of time.

As well as losing JDB and Jerome without adequate replacement, he also compounded it by shipping off our main striker in January without getting a proper striker.

22 minutes ago, gonzo said:

Who is/was the biggest wind up...

Madine or McAtee

Never thought I'd say it, but I'd rather have that fucking mingebag Madine playing up front than McAtee.

1 hour ago, DazBob said:

Never thought I'd say it, but I'd rather have that fucking mingebag Madine playing up front than McAtee.

I fucking hated Madine. But I think you're right.

Given the wimmins performances this season they deserve it over any of the stumps playing for the blokes side 

3 hours ago, DazBob said:

We'd score a hell of a lot more if we had any cunt at the top of the pitch who could keep hold of the ball.

Plagiarised, word for word, from the Premier League coaching manual, Chapter 4.

👏👏👏😵

4 hours ago, DazBob said:

We'd score a hell of a lot more if we had any cunt at the top of the pitch who could keep hold of the ball.

I think we tried it on Friday with Lolos 😩

Scoring them hasn't been a problem till recently, it's letting them in tears been the problem..

 

People harping on about Charles and JDB

 

Charles hadn't scored in last 20 games he's played..

JDB has been injured half the season

Hence why they went. 

Julian Darby

26 minutes ago, only1swanny said:

Scoring them hasn't been a problem till recently, it's letting them in tears been the problem..

 

People harping on about Charles and JDB

 

Charles hadn't scored in last 20 games he's played..

JDB has been injured half the season

Hence why they went. 

Agreed on Charles, he should have been replaced (and not be Etete or Randall) but we in isolation selling him for good money was the right decision IMO, not exactly prolific this season.

JDB appeared in 36 league games last season, and of the 10 he missed he was probably an unused sub for a few (ie not injured).  If you mean he's been injured half this season, that would just put him in the same bracket as much of our squad, and we kept all of them.  The point being, we had a centre forward last season who appeared in most games, and now we have no CF.  If he's injured this season, that's irrelevant.

8 hours ago, only1swanny said:

Scoring them hasn't been a problem till recently, it's letting them in tears been the problem..

 

People harping on about Charles and JDB

 

Charles hadn't scored in last 20 games he's played..

JDB has been injured half the season

Hence why they went. 

Surely you can understand that people aren't mentioning Charles and Bod because we should have kept them, more that if we were going to get rid of them we needed out and out replacements for them.

We now have no striker who can hold up the ball, win headers, link up play like Bod, and no striker who will play off the shoulder of the defenders to stretch them and stay in the box like Charles.

Instead we have a collection of the same type of airy fairy support striker who wants to find space in midfield or on the wing, and poses very few problems for teams if they make us go long.

A major part in the reason we are conceding so many goals is because we have absolutely fuck all up top.

Wank, ineffective pressing and zero ball retention. 

At least Dion harried the fuck out of defences and Bod could hold it up and find a man.

1 hour ago, gonzo said:

A major part in the reason we are conceding so many goals is because we have absolutely fuck all up top.

Wank, ineffective pressing and zero ball retention. 

At least Dion harried the fuck out of defences and Bod could hold it up and find a man.

Evatt used to pride himself on our pressing from the front, our policy of keep the ball to knacker the opponents out was based on also getting it back quickly. Charles and Kachunga were key to that.

Back in 21/22 there were also the options of Bod and Bakayoko if we were struggling to play through them and needed to build pressure by just slinging some crosses in. 

Our defenders had a lot less to do because the ball spent more time far away from them

We are still having large amounts of possession in many games though.

It's those that we are arguably not doing as well in, which was also an Evatt trait.

We seem to have reverted back to it.

Because of our loss to Oxford, Evatt decided to change how we were playing and the formation, in so doing he essentially doubled down on the style he had already developed by removing our versatility and flexibility to make room in the squad for players with the range of passing etc he wanted.

By removing the likes of JDB, CJ and DN he removed all our strength up front, not signing like for like replacements, that was the final nail in the coffin. He did the same thing the year before with Kieran Lee and MJ Williams we didn't sign like for like replacements then either. 

The longer we've been in league 1, the more we've hollowed out strength, versatility and flexibility, all to better fit the way Evatt has wanted to play.

So is it any wonder that all they can do is play Evatt ball?

If we currently had better versions of MJ Williams and JDB right now to sit alongside Morley and Collins, no way we're losing those last few games with SS. Half the players that look so terrible now, will look the league above next year.

 

 

8 minutes ago, Zog1 said:

Because of our loss to Oxford, Evatt decided to change how we were playing and the formation, in so doing he essentially doubled down on the style he had already developed by removing our versatility and flexibility to make room in the squad for players with the range of passing etc he wanted.

By removing the likes of JDB, CJ and DN he removed all our strength up front, not signing like for like replacements, that was the final nail in the coffin. He did the same thing the year before with Kieran Lee and MJ Williams we didn't sign like for like replacements then either. 

The longer we've been in league 1, the more we've hollowed out strength, versatility and flexibility, all to better fit the way Evatt has wanted to play.

So is it any wonder that all they can do is play Evatt ball?

If we currently had better versions of MJ Williams and JDB right now to sit alongside Morley and Collins, no way we're losing those last few games with SS. Half the players that look so terrible now, will look the league above next year.

Yep. He absolutely lost the plot after the Oxford no-show, and made changes that didn't need making. We just needed to strengthen a bit, not a complete re-think.

1 hour ago, Zog1 said:

Because of our loss to Oxford, Evatt decided to change how we were playing and the formation, in so doing he essentially doubled down on the style he had already developed by removing our versatility and flexibility to make room in the squad for players with the range of passing etc he wanted.

By removing the likes of JDB, CJ and DN he removed all our strength up front, not signing like for like replacements, that was the final nail in the coffin. He did the same thing the year before with Kieran Lee and MJ Williams we didn't sign like for like replacements then either. 

The longer we've been in league 1, the more we've hollowed out strength, versatility and flexibility, all to better fit the way Evatt has wanted to play.

So is it any wonder that all they can do is play Evatt ball?

If we currently had better versions of MJ Williams and JDB right now to sit alongside Morley and Collins, no way we're losing those last few games with SS. Half the players that look so terrible now, will look the league above next year.

 

 

Great post, all spot on. Post-Oxford we had the 'plan A2.0' thing, doubling down on belief and approach. The irony, in a way, has been that as Pep decided he needed someone like Haaland to upgrade City's approach, his disciple decided we didn't need someone like that, leaving us to go through a season in L1 like a City without Haaland, with a load of enforced false 9s.

Additional to those you've mentioned above as not being replaced, he didn't look to replace Maghoma's ability to swiftly turn recovery of the ball into a dangerous situation, and to be able to pull a rabbit out of a hat with a piece of quality. In fairness, he probably thought CMG would do some of that and hadn't bargained on him being so horrendously injury prone.

It's been a season-on-season issue as you've said, and, as SS has indicated in his piece in the BN today, left us with a squad that lacks physicality, the vigour and freedom of youth but also experience, guile and a win at all costs mentality. 

Edited April 21, 20251 yr by ianofcleveleys

59 minutes ago, Zog1 said:

Because of our loss to Oxford, Evatt decided to change how we were playing and the formation, in so doing he essentially doubled down on the style he had already developed by removing our versatility and flexibility to make room in the squad for players with the range of passing etc he wanted.

By removing the likes of JDB, CJ and DN he removed all our strength up front, not signing like for like replacements, that was the final nail in the coffin. He did the same thing the year before with Kieran Lee and MJ Williams we didn't sign like for like replacements then either. 

The longer we've been in league 1, the more we've hollowed out strength, versatility and flexibility, all to better fit the way Evatt has wanted to play.

So is it any wonder that all they can do is play Evatt ball?

If we currently had better versions of MJ Williams and JDB right now to sit alongside Morley and Collins, no way we're losing those last few games with SS. Half the players that look so terrible now, will look the league above next year.

 

 

I said before the Oxford game (and i wasn't the only one), that this could make or break the club for a few years.

I don't want to be proven right but...

Not going up was a disaster and almost every decision made since has compounded it.

Seriously hope SS can work things out and get us flying again.

 

Well, its not Aaron fckg Baxter !!

Edited April 21, 20251 yr by Dr. Feelgood

Who's he?

27 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

Who's he?

Reckon I'd take him over Nathan after today 😁

39 minutes ago, Dr. Feelgood said:

Well, its not Aaron fckg Baxter !!

You editted it and still got it wrong, you muppet.

Stanley Baxter would have been more convincing today