This Weather.....

[royal white]

4 minutes ago, gonzo said:

Hope theres no arsonists near there it looks parched.

I wouldn’t worry to much, it’s a couple of years old that picture 

[Spider]

3 minutes ago, royal white said:

I wouldn’t worry to much, it’s a couple of years old that picture 

There IS a climate crisis

It is NOT affecting anything.

[London Wanderer]

13 minutes ago, royal white said:

But yes arsonists are irrelevant when it comes to fires 🤦🏻

Bit of a misquote there mate. I said irrelevant to the bigger picture. The bigger picture being the climate crisis. We all know the need to be careful in dry places. Southern Europe is littered with the fire safety/ wildfire risk signs and you'd see them on holiday every year as a kid. Wildfires aren't worse now because of arsonists, government responses will be focused around reducing emissions and better preparation. Because they know, in reality, they can't prevent every fire starting. The majority of wildfires are actually caused by lightening. Should be be going after that now? 

"Many things can spark a wildfire: campfires, cigarettes, lightning, even sunlight. But how far it spreads depends on the weather. By burning fossil fuels and destroying nature, people have heated the planet by 1.2C – and Europe by 2C – above pre-industrial levels, making the hot, dry conditions in which wildfires thrive more common across the continent".

So what in your humble opinion should we do? Keep blaming arsonists, or tackle the bigger picture and reduce emissions? 

[royal white]

3 minutes ago, London Wanderer said:

Bit of a misquote there mate. I said irrelevant to the bigger picture. The bigger picture being the climate crisis. We all know the need to be careful in dry places. Southern Europe is littered with the fire safety/ wildfire risk signs and you'd see them on holiday every year as a kid. Wildfires aren't worse now because of arsonists, government responses will be focused around reducing emissions and better preparation. Because they know, in reality, they can't prevent every fire starting. The majority of wildfires are actually caused by lightening. Should be be going after that now? 

"Many things can spark a wildfire: campfires, cigarettes, lightning, even sunlight. But how far it spreads depends on the weather. By burning fossil fuels and destroying nature, people have heated the planet by 1.2C – and Europe by 2C – above pre-industrial levels, making the hot, dry conditions in which wildfires thrive more common across the continent".

So what in your humble opinion should we do? Keep blaming arsonists, or tackle the bigger picture and reduce emissions? 

All depends on who you listen to. 
 

BBC? 
However, most wildfires are caused by human carelessness. Arson, campfires, discarding lit cigarettes, not burning debris properly, and playing with matches or fireworks are often blamed.

 

Fire Chief Association? 
Humans cause nearly 90% of wildfires in the United states¹ via discarded cigarettes, unattended campfires, burning debris, or through equipment malfunctions. Although less common, wildfires can also occur though non-human phenomena, such as lightning strikes and volcanic eruptions.

 

Yes reduce emissions. But In your humble opinion will that make Greece in the middle of July less dry and less prone to fires? 

[Tonge moor green jacket]

https://www.sciencemediacentre.org/expert-reaction-to-wildfires-on-rhodes-and-corfu/#:~:text=A heat wave or an,or slowed down by airtankers.

An interesting explanation. 

Should be noted that the main cause of wildfires isn't lightning according to this study: 

https://www.nps.gov/articles/wildfire-causes-and-evaluation.htm#:~:text=Nearly 85 percent* of wildland,and intentional acts of arson.&text=Lightning is one of the two natural causes of fires.

I didn't think it would be in all honesty, but that isn't the point whatsoever. 

 

Edited July 25, 2023 by Tonge moor green jacket

[MickyD]

1 hour ago, Spider said:

Out of 64 fires the news say about 5 were arsonists.

Am I allowed to ask; If a fire started by an arsonist causes a spark or bit of dry grass to cause a second fire which is remote from the first, is the second caused by arson or by accident?

[Spider]

Just now, MickyD said:

Am I allowed to ask; If a fire started by an arsonist causes a spark or bit of dry grass to cause a second fire which is remote from the first, is the second caused by arson or by accident?

Arson.

We've established its all arson. Frankly, I'd gas every human who lives in hot climates asap and root the problem out at source.

 

[DirtySanchez]

Would have thought land use plays a big part 

[Tonge moor green jacket]

1 minute ago, DirtySanchez said:

Would have thought land use plays a big part 

Yes, or more accurately land management.

One of the links above covers it.

Over here, rewetting of peat moorlands by blocking drainage stops degradation of the peat, slows water down and helps reduced flooding, thus keeping the soil damper during dry months. 

Beavers doing a great job in various places.

Everything is interconnected and we're finally learning not to fuck with nature. 

[London Wanderer]

45 minutes ago, royal white said:

All depends on who you listen to. 
 

BBC? 
However, most wildfires are caused by human carelessness. Arson, campfires, discarding lit cigarettes, not burning debris properly, and playing with matches or fireworks are often blamed.

 

Fire Chief Association? 
Humans cause nearly 90% of wildfires in the United states¹ via discarded cigarettes, unattended campfires, burning debris, or through equipment malfunctions. Although less common, wildfires can also occur though non-human phenomena, such as lightning strikes and volcanic eruptions.

 

Yes reduce emissions. But In your humble opinion will that make Greece in the middle of July less dry and less prone to fires? 

Aye, you're right. I'd read it as the biggest overall cause, but it's the actually the biggest natural cause. It's how I read it, not who I listened to 😆 Interestingly, the lightening strikes tend to cause more damage though. 

In answer to your last question. Reducing global emissions and doing it fast. This is what I've been posting to you all afternoon ffs 🤣 Europe is warming and drying at a rapid rate which means wildfires are now more common and much more intense. That last sentence is a fact rather than an opinion.

If we limit global warming to 1.5 degrees and reduce it (not going to happen now) then Greece experiences less severe heatwaves, thus becoming less dry and less prone to severe wildfires. That's the number 1 priority, the second is better preparation and land management now we know how bad the fire seasons will be.

The reality of the direction we're heading now is where we land above 2 degrees and how many 'tipping points' we hit. It will be more about preventing Greece and Europe from becoming a lot more dry. 

Edited July 25, 2023 by London Wanderer

[DirtySanchez]

7 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

Yes, or more accurately land management.

One of the links above covers it.

Over here, rewetting of peat moorlands by blocking drainage stops degradation of the peat, slows water down and helps reduced flooding, thus keeping the soil damper during dry months. 

Beavers doing a great job in various places.

Everything is interconnected and we're finally learning not to fuck with nature. 

Aye, read years ago about all the things you can do to stop the spread of fires 

The argument seems to be arson v climate change when there are more factors at play 

[Spider]

4 minutes ago, DirtySanchez said:

Aye, read years ago about all the things you can do to stop the spread of fires 

The argument seems to be arson v climate change when there are more factors at play 

That’s just Royal arguing with himself

[Tonge moor green jacket]

4 minutes ago, DirtySanchez said:

Aye, read years ago about all the things you can do to stop the spread of fires 

The argument seems to be arson v climate change when there are more factors at play 

Absolutely. It's daft becasue climate change per se won't start many fires.

 

[London Wanderer]

5 minutes ago, DirtySanchez said:

Aye, read years ago about all the things you can do to stop the spread of fires 

The argument seems to be arson v climate change when there are more factors at play 

Aye, deliberate wildfires can even be used to help combat climate change. We've been grappling with wildfires for as long as we've been around. We know climate change makes them much worse and more common, so we need to be much more in tune with land management etc. 

Don't think anyone is denying there are more complex factors at play. RW just went off on one his classic 'what about this' tangents. 

[London Wanderer]

5 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

Absolutely. It's daft becasue climate change per se won't start many fires.

 

Ahh. So is this what RW thought we all believed ? 

I'm glad he's taught us otherwise. 

[MickyD]

3 hours ago, Spider said:

Wildfires have been around as long as humans have. The world heating up and climate/weather becoming more extreme is exacerbating the problem.

 

Pedantic, I know, but wildfires were never an issue until about 2000. They were known as moorland fires until then. 

As an aside, I fucking hated yomping about on the moors above Bolton. We’d get the station cooks to put some butties in a box, grab a few bottles of water or call at Asda on way and not see the station again for 10 hours. 

[royal white]

35 minutes ago, London Wanderer said:

Aye, you're right. I'd read it as the biggest overall cause, but it's the actually the biggest natural cause. It's how I read it, not who I listened to 😆 Interestingly, the lightening strikes tend to cause more damage though. 

In answer to your last question. Reducing global emissions and doing it fast. This is what I've been posting to you all afternoon ffs 🤣 Europe is warming and drying at a rapid rate which means wildfires are now more common and much more intense. That last sentence is a fact rather than an opinion.

If we limit global warming to 1.5 degrees and reduce it (not going to happen now) then Greece experiences less severe heatwaves, thus becoming less dry and less prone to severe wildfires. That's the number 1 priority, the second is better preparation and land management now we know how bad the fire seasons will be.

The reality of the direction we're heading now is where we land above 2 degrees and how many 'tipping points' we hit. It will be more about preventing Greece and Europe from becoming a lot more dry. 

No shit. 

 

16 minutes ago, London Wanderer said:

Aye, deliberate wildfires can even be used to help combat climate change. We've been grappling with wildfires for as long as we've been around. We know climate change makes them much worse and more common, so we need to be much more in tune with land management etc. 

Don't think anyone is denying there are more complex factors at play. RW just went off on one his classic 'what about this' tangents. 

I know, “what about this, arsonists and sparks being blamed for fires” who’d of thunk it

[London Wanderer]

Headline news across a fair few media sources just in. Really scary stuff, it's hard for scientists to predict the exact time, but this was more predicted for the end of the century if emissions didn't go down. That they're thinking it could begin in two years time is bonkers, we're fucked if the Gulf Stream goes. 

The real-life Day After Tomorrow: The Gulf Stream could COLLAPSE at 'any time' from 2025 thanks to climate change - plunging Europe into a deep freeze | Daily Mail Online

Atlantic Ocean circulation is heading for a collapse around mid-century, scientists report | CNN

Gulf stream could collapse as early as 2025, study suggests | Climate crisis | The Guardian

 

[London Wanderer]

2 minutes ago, royal white said:

I know, “what about this, arsonists and sparks being blamed for fires” who’d of thunk it

Scientists - climate change is making these wildfires much more common and severe.

Posters discuss said issue. 

You - BuT wHaT aBoUt aLL tHe ArSoNiSts ?! surely they're too blame for all this! 
 

We all know that human's can start them, indirectly or directly. You've been acting like we had no idea 😄Today has been one of your finest whatboutery sessions, fair play. Made even better when you started calling everyone else thick and giving out clown badges. Nice work 👏

[Spider]

He gets there in the end.

But we have to do the hard yards

[London Wanderer]

1 minute ago, Spider said:

He gets there in the end.

But we have to do the hard yards

part of me thinks he was just on a wind up and the jokes on us. 

I know he loves a good argument on here, but I never had him down as being as daft as some of his posts this afternoon. 

[royal white]

22 minutes ago, London Wanderer said:

Scientists - climate change is making these wildfires much more common and severe.

Posters discuss said issue. 

You - BuT wHaT aBoUt aLL tHe ArSoNiSts ?! surely they're too blame for all this! 
 

We all know that human's can start them, indirectly or directly. You've been acting like we had no idea 😄Today has been one of your finest whatboutery sessions, fair play. Made even better when you started calling everyone else thick and giving out clown badges. Nice work 👏

You appeared to have slavered on your caps lock key. 
 

Whataboutery 😂😂 Maybe go back to the beginning where I simply (you know the reason why) pointed out that the fires were started through arson. Not climate change. 
 

Your comments on here are closing in on your stupidity on the meanwhile in Wales thread……though they do have some way to go to reach those heights! 

[royal white]

43 minutes ago, MickyD said:

Pedantic, I know, but wildfires were never an issue until about 2000. They were known as moorland fires until then. 

As an aside, I fucking hated yomping about on the moors above Bolton. We’d get the station cooks to put some butties in a box, grab a few bottles of water or call at Asda on way and not see the station again for 10 hours. 

I thought they’d give you disposable BBQs 😜

 

 

[Sweep]

13 minutes ago, London Wanderer said:

part of me thinks he was just on a wind up and the jokes on us. 

I know he loves a good argument on here, but I never had him down as being as daft as some of his posts this afternoon. 

He is, both Spider and Cheese absolutely run rings around him, which is when he starts with the inane "whataboutery"

[Cheese]

3 minutes ago, Sweep said:

He is, both Spider and Cheese absolutely run rings around him, which is when he starts with the inane "whataboutery"

I have a feeling you're about to be awarded a clown badge. ☹️