Politics

[bolty58]

11 hours ago, royal white said:

Debatable 

 

 

Noooooo! Who would ever have thought it 

[bolty58]

1 hour ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

Right, it seems the Chagos deal isn't going to cost three and a half billion after all.

Actually, it's 35 billion.

I thought they'd kicked Abbott out?

 

Wouldn't matter. There is little they ever touch which doesn't turn into economic disaster.

[Casino]

4 minutes ago, bolty58 said:

 

Hopefully the duopoly breaker will get in next time.

The biggest conman of the lot

You keep swallowing it

[bolty58]

1 minute ago, Casino said:

The biggest conman of the lot

You keep swallowing it

....and will continue to.

The only UK politician with a backbone.

[Tonge moor green jacket]

9 hours ago, bolty58 said:

....and will continue to.

The only UK politician with a backbone.

There is the rub.

Racist, conman (a new one)- call him what you want- at the moment he is the only party leader not beating around the bush over key issues.

He might turn out to be as limp as the others, but folk are fed up of those others, and are apparently willing to try something else.

Until then, the insults are meaningless; should they get in, it is then that they can judged and we can assess if NF is indeed a conman etc.

 

[Tonge moor green jacket]

On 09/08/2025 at 12:55, Spider said:

Aye back home. Was in Preston hospital because I live in Lancashire and I had to check the Muslim/non-muslim ratio first 😜

Cant fault the process. Spoke to some folk on the ward who’d had mixed experiences but the staff really are the jewels in the crown.

It's good that you had a positive experience. 

The experiences I've had recently- personally, via family and via friends has been very much the opposite (baring one visit I had, which took my GP to arrange on the back of a previous hospital fuck up).

Poor communication between staff, ignoring patients, rude and almost abusive at times, dismissive and disinterested. 

Dirty wards, atrocious food, and a generally terrible experience. 

In between, there are indeed a number of diamonds, sparkling through the mire.

This isn't what folk expect from the NHS.

[BobyBrno]

Drove up through the hospital last week and the reception for A&E was a portakabin with people queuing out in the rain. Is this permanent or temporary?

[Zico]

23 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

There is the rub.

Racist, conman (a new one)- call him what you want- at the moment he is the only party leader not beating around the bush over key issues.

He might turn out to be as limp as the others, but folk are fed up of those others, and are apparently willing to try something else.

Until then, the insults are meaningless; should they get in, it is then that they can judged and we can assess if NF is indeed a conman etc.

 

We have been here before though

With Brexit 

He got on board with the "let's spend the money on the NHS" rhetoric 

Then the day after the vote said you can't guarantee that's where the money will be spent and leave should never have made that claim 

He'll say anything to further his own cause, though since he came on to my radar I've not known him to do anything that has made a positive difference for this country 

I'm sure he has like, I've just not seen any evidence of it

[kent_white]

29 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

he is the only party leader not beating around the bush over key issues

I'd argue that he's beating about the bush on pretty much every issue apart from immigration as we don't really know any detail about any of his/their other policies. 

I might even vote for them myself if I knew what they were and had any sort of assurance that they might be able to implement them.

[Cheese]

1 minute ago, kent_white said:

I'd argue that he's beating about the bush on pretty much every issue apart from immigration as we don't really know any detail about any of his/their other policies. 

I might even vote for them myself if I knew what they were and had any sort of assurance that they might be able to implement them.

What has he said he'd do about immigration?

[Casino]

2 minutes ago, kent_white said:

I'd argue that he's beating about the bush on pretty much every issue apart from immigration

hes even backtracking on that

like any sane person would, tbf

 

but for anybody to suggest hes not a self serving conman shows a ridiculous level of ignorance

[Sweep]

36 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

There is the rub.

Racist, conman (a new one)- call him what you want- at the moment he is the only party leader not beating around the bush over key issues.

He might turn out to be as limp as the others, but folk are fed up of those others, and are apparently willing to try something else.

Until then, the insults are meaningless; should they get in, it is then that they can judged and we can assess if NF is indeed a conman etc.

 

I agree with all the above - of course, whilst he's hanging around in a disruptive capacity (which he currently is) he can say what he wants, and I'm sure he'll continue to rattle the big two parties. I'd even argue that's he's probably already killed one of them, as I see no way back for the Conservatives as things stand.

As pointed out by both @bolty58 and @gonzo who don't have the same political leanings, so it's not a partisan thing, the more that people try and discredit Reform/Farage (and let's be honest, they are one and the same) the more support they seem to garner. As is the way with politics these days. I think we can expect more of the same for the next 3 years or so.

The point of interest, for me, will be the run up to the next GE. Firstly, like it or not, it'll be won/lost on immigration and the NHS (unless something very dramatic happens in the meantime). Labour need to get a grip on those two things, or be seen to be doing something. The Conservatives will need to come up with something, and basically, just stop being who they are today. Reform, will have to put together a coherent manifesto, that is actually costed (unlike the ridiculous document they released last time), and also find some credible types to become MPs. Their recent track record in running local councils doesn't seem to be going too well at present, as they just don't have the right people.

I don't like Reform at all, and I believe if they did become our Government, then the UK would be in all sorts of shit, and not a nice place to be. I'm not sure they will win outright power, but I don't think either of the other two will either. Not based on where we are today anyway. Imagine, if Reform and Tory had to form a coalition, now that would be grim.

 

As for Farage, often labelled a grifter/conman, I've long held the belief, that like Johnson, he didn't want to win the Brexit vote, he'd be much happier sniping from the sidelines and being the plucky underdog. I wonder if he would feel the same about being PM, does he really want it? - being PM for him, would have been perfect (if he wants the gig) had it coincided with Trump, but that clearly won't happen now, thankfully. It's only my personal opinion, but whilst I appreciate he's possibly/probably been the most influential politician (Thatcher aside??!?!) in my lifetime, I'd really not want the likes of him and Lee Anderson running this country. 

[Sweep]

45 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

It's good that you had a positive experience. 

The experiences I've had recently- personally, via family and via friends has been very much the opposite (baring one visit I had, which took my GP to arrange on the back of a previous hospital fuck up).

Poor communication between staff, ignoring patients, rude and almost abusive at times, dismissive and disinterested. 

Dirty wards, atrocious food, and a generally terrible experience. 

In between, there are indeed a number of diamonds, sparkling through the mire.

This isn't what folk expect from the NHS.

I think we all have good/bad experiences with the NHS

Sadly, whilst my father was ill, he/we got to see both sides of it. From being held in a corridor for 24/36 hours which was grim, through to the final care, which was great. All through it, the staff to my mind were excellent, with one nurse/staff coming from the hospital to the nursing home, in her own time, just to see my father and chat with him (as said above, a diamond in the mire). Talk the other day of "fucking off the NHS" - if that happened a few years ago, then I'm sure we'd have been in for some traumatic times, especially financially, as you all know Nursing home costs are astronomical, fortunately they were all covered by the NHS (and rightly so, as he paid into for c50 years)

The NHS needs a root and branch overhaul, but fuck knows how you even start to unpick it

[Sweep]

1 hour ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

he is the only party leader not beating around the bush over key issues.

 

 

 

34 minutes ago, Zico said:

I've not known him to do anything that has made a positive difference for this country 

 

He doesn't beat around the bush, as he doesn't actually offer any solutions to anything, and to be fair to him, he doesn't need to, until closer to a GE. That will involve doing some actual work though..........sniping form the sidelines is what he's really, really good at, let's see how he changes over the next 3 years or so, because he will. 

[Casino]

he has already 'changed'

hes changing his stance quicker than his supporters change their underkeks

[Tonge moor green jacket]

10 minutes ago, Sweep said:

 

He doesn't beat around the bush, as he doesn't actually offer any solutions to anything, and to be fair to him, he doesn't need to, until closer to a GE. That will involve doing some actual work though..........sniping form the sidelines is what he's really, really good at, let's see how he changes over the next 3 years or so, because he will. 

Standard fare for all those not in government. 

Fwiw, he has offered his solutions, in general terms, and has been heavily questioned over their affordability. 

Current lot certainly aren't in a position to do that though, which in turn will give the next incumbents a bit of an "out" when it comes to implementing their ideas.

Ultimately, it's all smoke and mirrors, lies and word salads.

 

[bolty58]

24 minutes ago, Sweep said:

As pointed out by both @bolty58 and @gonzo who don't have the same political leanings, so it's not a partisan thing, the more that people try and discredit Reform/Farage (and let's be honest, they are one and the same) the more support they seem to garner. As is the way with politics these days. I think we can expect more of the same for the next 3 years or so.

But they don't listen.

"but for anybody to suggest hes not a self serving conman shows a ridiculous level of ignorance"

We need more of these classics. Millions of them preferably. Grist to the mill.

They haven't learned from their painful Brexit and Trump experiences. Now that shows a ridiculous level of ignorance.

It also shows an increasing level of panic. With good reason.

[bolty58]

2 minutes ago, Casino said:

he has already 'changed'

hes changing his stance quicker than his supporters change their underkeks

Tactical genius. He's just feeling for the cracks and fissures to find the path of least resistance.

Coming down the road.

[little whitt]

1 hour ago, BobyBrno said:

Drove up through the hospital last week and the reception for A&E was a portakabin with people queuing out in the rain. Is this permanent or temporary?

Yes 

You go there First 

Then they Decide if you go A&E or Stright to a Doc  in the Main bit 

[Sweep]

1 hour ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

Standard fare for all those not in government. 

Fwiw, he has offered his solutions, in general terms, and has been heavily questioned over their affordability. 

Current lot certainly aren't in a position to do that though, which in turn will give the next incumbents a bit of an "out" when it comes to implementing their ideas.

Ultimately, it's all smoke and mirrors, lies and word salads.

 

Affordability/Costing is so far the big let down of the Reform manifesto. I'm sure they'll get their act together for any GE (you'd hope so anyway)

 

As for giving "incumbents" an out, doesn't seem that we're allowed to do that these days. Everything is always the fault of those in power, it's never anything to do with those in power previously. Probably.

[Sweep]

1 hour ago, Casino said:

he has already 'changed'

hes changing his stance quicker than his supporters change their underkeks

once a month?

[kent_white]

1 hour ago, Cheese said:

What has he said he'd do about immigration?

Freeze non-essential immigration 

Leave the ECHR

Not resettle anybody in the UK who arrives via a none legal route

Process illegal arrivals offshore

Create a Department for Immigration 

Take migrants out of boats and take them back to France

House all asylum seekers in secure detention centres while their application is processed

[Sweep]

1 hour ago, bolty58 said:

Tactical genius. He's just feeling for the path of least resistance and workload.

 

amended for accuracy 😃

[Tonge moor green jacket]

1 hour ago, Sweep said:

Affordability/Costing is so far the big let down of the Reform manifesto. I'm sure they'll get their act together for any GE (you'd hope so anyway)

 

As for giving "incumbents" an out, doesn't seem that we're allowed to do that these days. Everything is always the fault of those in power, it's never anything to do with those in power previously. Probably.

Responsibility lies with them all- but don't blest about one lot, say how you will change it, then make it worse.

Fwiw, unless there are big changes in approach to immigration, then it will continue to be the main issue of the day.

That's precisely why they're doing do well currently.

Of course economy etc will play a part, but folk aren't really trusting the main parties on that neither, so again, that will boost NF et al, as many will think "why not give them a chance".

[kent_white]

Are we all in agreement that this is a good idea. Apart from @Cheese obviously 😉