Politics

[Salford Trotter]

7 hours ago, Mounts Kipper said:

Your doomsday scenario ain’t happening. So the answer is no. 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-news-boris-johnson-plan-2000-worse-off-a9154536.html

You'll be telling us next your detailed analysis has us being better off in a No Deal/managed deal scenario and that those thick academics from King's College have got it so wrong 😂

[Mounts Kipper]

8 hours ago, Salford Trotter said:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-news-boris-johnson-plan-2000-worse-off-a9154536.html

You'll be telling us next your detailed analysis has us being better off in a No Deal/managed deal scenario and that those thick academics from King's College have got it so wrong 😂

Experts of EU law and EU regulations what a surprise they set a pro EU agenda.  Not even experts can predict the future costs that the EU might have to cover, failing states, ever increasing contributions for those who actually contribute, EU army, it seems remainers think all is rosy in the EU garden whereas realists know it is anything but.

It’s best that we move on, get a deal and exit as soon as possible. 

Edited October 14, 2019 by Mounts Kipper

[Salford Trotter]

7 minutes ago, Mounts Kipper said:

Experts of EU law and EU regulations what a surprise they set a pro EU agenda.  Not even experts can predict the future costs that the EU might have to cover, failing states, ever increasing contributions for those who actually contribute, EU army, etc.  It’s best that we move on, get a deal and exit as soon as possible. 

On what basis does an expert on a particular topic all of a sudden make you a supporter of it? They are experts for a reason as they know what they are talking about. They will have spent months studying reams and reams of data and will have arrived at conclusions that have some academic value. But of course your 'finger in the wind' economic analysis holds more weight, you are full of BS mate

[Mounts Kipper]

16 minutes ago, Salford Trotter said:

On what basis does an expert on a particular topic all of a sudden make you a supporter of it? They are experts for a reason as they know what they are talking about. They will have spent months studying reams and reams of data and will have arrived at conclusions that have some academic value. But of course your 'finger in the wind' economic analysis holds more weight, you are full of BS mate

It’s quite alarming that these experts don’t or cannot quantify future negatives of remaining in the European Union, perhaps they are not as clever as they think or perhaps there is an element of putting their finger in the wind in their analysis. 

[Spider]

7 minutes ago, Mounts Kipper said:

It’s quite alarming that these experts don’t or cannot quantify future negatives of remaining in the European Union, perhaps they are not as clever as they think or perhaps there is an element of putting their finger in the wind in their analysis. 

As opposed to your reams of data proving a nirvana awaits?

Brexit is going to hit us hard. 

I don't need to eat a dog shit sandwich to tell you it will taste like dog shit. Sometimes, it's just fairly obvious.

[Salford Trotter]

14 minutes ago, Mounts Kipper said:

It’s quite alarming that these experts don’t or cannot quantify future negatives of remaining in the European Union, perhaps they are not as clever as they think or perhaps there is an element of putting their finger in the wind in their analysis. 

Because the fact is the overwhelming number of studies show we will be worse off outside of the EU and much more worse off if we left without a deal. Of course Prof. Mounts knows better so  please share the data that backs your conclusions 

[Mounts Kipper]

7 minutes ago, Spider said:

As opposed to your reams of data proving a nirvana awaits?

Brexit is going to hit us hard. 

I don't need to eat a dog shit sandwich to tell you it will taste like dog shit. Sometimes, it's just fairly obvious.

I don’t think it’ll be anywhere near as bad as you think, if we get a deal and for folk like you who’s territory covers Ireland this is vitally important, if the border issues get sorted (which I’m sure they will) get a free trade deal (which was already part of the original WA)  then this will mitigate many of the problems we face,  then I doubt that anyone will notice a difference in their standard of living. 

[Salford Trotter]

Just now, Mounts Kipper said:

I don’t think it’ll be anywhere near as bad as you think, if we get a deal and for folk like you who’s territory covers Ireland this is vitally important, if the border issues get sorted (which I’m sure they will) get a free trade deal (which was already part of the original WA)  then this will mitigate many of the problems we face,  then I doubt that anyone will notice a difference in their standard of living. 

Show us the analysis instead of "I don't think it will be as bad as you think". On what basis do you come to that conclusion? As usual you base your comments of what you hope will happen and not the reality. So again where are the plethora of studies that show we will be better off? 

[Mounts Kipper]

7 minutes ago, Salford Trotter said:

Because the fact is the overwhelming number of studies show we will be worse off outside of the EU and much more worse off if we left without a deal. Of course Prof. Mounts knows better so  please share the data that backs your conclusions 

I’m sure it’ll be better outcome for all concerned if there is a deal, that’s why I’ve consistently said there will be a deal as it is in the interest of both parties, you said we wouldn’t get a deal, you said the WA was closed, you’ve backed the EU against the U.K. from day 1 and you’ll be gutted when your domesday and no deal scenario is proven to be bollocks. 

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Mounts Kipper said:

I’m sure it’ll be better outcome for all concerned if there is a deal, that’s why I’ve consistently said there will be a deal as it is in the interest of both parties, you said we wouldn’t get a deal, you said the WA was closed, you’ve backed the EU against the U.K. from day 1 and you’ll be gutted when your domesday and no deal scenario is proven to be bollocks. 

No he hasn't. Because he lives in reality where this isn't a war. All he's done is repeat the facts as they are rather than the Brexit propaganda that you and others can't see beyond. The possible deal now is simply because we, the UK, have given in to the EU demand for managing customs in NI. The thing we've been telling you would need to happen to have a chance at a deal. Yet you seem oblivious to this. 

[Salford Trotter]

2 minutes ago, Mounts Kipper said:

I’m sure it’ll be better outcome for all concerned if there is a deal, that’s why I’ve consistently said there will be a deal as it is in the interest of both parties, you said we wouldn’t get a deal, you said the WA was closed, you’ve backed the EU against the U.K. from day 1 and you’ll be gutted when your domesday and no deal scenario is proven to be bollocks. 

You are making stuff up again. I said we won't get a deal that you wanted and that the EU will have the controlling hand in those negotiations and I have proved to be right. If we get a deal it will be on the EU terms, not the UK terms. 

I want a sensible and managed exit from the EU and if we get that I will be content. 

[Mounts Kipper]

https://capx.co/the-unseen-benefits-of-leaving-the-european-union/

 

Edited October 14, 2019 by Mounts Kipper

[Mounts Kipper]

Also an interesting read given the experts you keep quoting.

 

https://capx.co/eu-inducements-have-created-a-cadre-of-loyal-academics/

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, Mounts Kipper said:

Also an interesting read given the experts you keep quoting.

 

https://capx.co/eu-inducements-have-created-a-cadre-of-loyal-academics/

So you're expert analysis retort is an article written by someone with the twitter handle @DrBrexit and a piece from a right wing think tank - written by an editor of the Daily Telegraph. This is the problem. You're simply going back into the hivemind. Ignoring established and hugely respected institutions like the IFS, BoE and deciding those are "biased" because they're telling you what you don't want to hear and instead citing Brexit propaganda written by people who aren't doing a proper and robust analysis and who don't have any serious track record. 

[Salford Trotter]

13 minutes ago, Mounts Kipper said:

Also an interesting read given the experts you keep quoting.

 

https://capx.co/eu-inducements-have-created-a-cadre-of-loyal-academics/

And that's the best you can do? Show me the respected economic analysis that supports your case? 

[bolty58]

20 hours ago, Mounts Kipper said:

I prefer facts rather than projections, it’s a fact that for every 38p we receive from the EU we pay them £1. 

He seems to overlook the fact the he is a bloke on a football forum who thinks he knows better. FFS!

[Mounts Kipper]

3 minutes ago, bwfcfan5 said:

So you're expert analysis retort is an article written by someone with the twitter handle @DrBrexit and a piece from a right wing think tank - written by an editor of the Daily Telegraph. This is the problem. You're simply going back into the hivemind. Ignoring established and hugely respected institutions like the IFS, BoE and deciding those are "biased" because they're telling you what you don't want to hear and instead citing Brexit propaganda written by people who aren't doing a proper and robust analysis and who don't have any serious track record. 

I’m not ignoring the pro EU reports I accept that there will be a better outcome with a deal, I also have an open mind and can see that there is a pro EU agenda from many supposed experts who seem to have close links to the European Union, I take in both sides of the argument and my considered view is that it’ll be nothing like the domesday scenario painted by some. 

[Mounts Kipper]

3 minutes ago, bolty58 said:

He seems to overlook the fact the he is a bloke on a football forum who thinks he knows better. FFS!

And the fact that he said it wasn’t possible to get any deal, and wasn’t possible to reopen the WA. And now just quotes a no deal scenario when it’s pretty clear to me from day one that a no deal won’t happen. But he’s the expert.😂🤣😂

Edited October 14, 2019 by Mounts Kipper

[bolty58]

46 minutes ago, Spider said:

As opposed to your reams of data proving a nirvana awaits?

Brexit is going to hit us hard. 

I don't need to eat a dog shit sandwich to tell you it will taste like dog shit. Sometimes, it's just fairly obvious.

Does that imply that you know what dog shit tastes like?

[Salford Trotter]

2 minutes ago, Mounts Kipper said:

And the fact that he said it wasn’t possible to get any deal, and wasn’t possible to reopen the WA. And now just quotes a no deal scenario when it’s pretty clear to me from day one that a no deal won’t happen. But he’s the expert.😂🤣😂

You're making stuff up again Mounts. I have not once said I am an expert but in fact I am indeed just a poster on a football forum, as we all are. This difference between us is that I at least try and quote sources that have a great deal more knowledge and experience than either of us have. I will ask again but I doubt I will get an answer, where is the respected economic analysis that supports your conclusions that we are going to much better off outside of the EU on both a managed deal or No Deal? I won't hold my breath

[Mounts Kipper]

10 minutes ago, Salford Trotter said:

You're making stuff up again Mounts. I have not once said I am an expert but in fact I am indeed just a poster on a football forum, as we all are. This difference between us is that I at least try and quote sources that have a great deal more knowledge and experience than either of us have. I will ask again but I doubt I will get an answer, where is the respected economic analysis that supports your conclusions that we are going to much better off outside of the EU on both a managed deal or No Deal? I won't hold my breath

I won’t hazard a guess as that is all it is, same as the so called experts, funnily enough experts who usually have a vested interest and usually getting it wrong. Time will tell. 

Edited October 14, 2019 by Mounts Kipper

[Salford Trotter]

6 minutes ago, Mounts Kipper said:

I won’t hazard a guess as that is all it is, same as the so called experts, funnily enough experts who usually have a vested interest and usually getting it wrong. Time will tell. 

So you are just guessing we'll be better off, I thought as much

Edited October 14, 2019 by Salford Trotter

[Guest]

22 minutes ago, Mounts Kipper said:

I’m not ignoring the pro EU reports I accept that there will be a better outcome with a deal, I also have an open mind and can see that there is a pro EU agenda from many supposed experts who seem to have close links to the European Union, I take in both sides of the argument and my considered view is that it’ll be nothing like the domesday scenario painted by some. 

They aren't "Pro EU reports" they are simply the most respected analyses available. From institutions with history of being able to do such analysis.

The problem is you want to give equal weight to completely uninformed and relatively baseless opinions and dismiss the weight of actual informed view as being "biased" even when your only evidence for such bias is "they aren't saying what I want to hear". This is the actual Brexit conundrum on a plate. Once you lie and the convince everyone that all the experts are really working for an "establishment" that doesn't exist you can literally do and say anything. 

My worry is that seemingly sensible individuals now lie in a post-truth and post-fact bubble. It scares me because we're headed down a very dangerous path here - I hope following Brexit that it will be the end of such nonsense - I really do. 

[Mounts Kipper]

1 hour ago, Salford Trotter said:

So you are just guessing we'll be better off, I thought as much

Just like the experts, I’d like them to guess what is going to happen to the EU in future, what are the future costs, what happens if we have another Greece (Italy possibly next) how much are the U.K. going to have to pay in future and what new rules, regulations and the new EU army going to cost?  I guess they’ve not a clue. 

Edited October 14, 2019 by Mounts Kipper

[Sweep]

hopefully things are moving in the right direction, I do find it odd that Johnson resigned from Mays cabinet as he said that her "deal" was worse than remaining.....and now he's gone back with a similar deal, albeit it with the EU having forced us into making some concessions on the NI border issue.

Still, on the plus side, the markets must like what they're hearing, as the USD has shifted nearly $0.05 against GBP in the space of a day or two, which is good news for me