Peterborough (H)

[ZiggyStardust]

Not sure how anyone can watch the replay (evatt included) and think its not a red.

Initial thoughts (ESL) was yellow, but replays pretty conclusive.

If they appeal, it wouldnt be surprising if its treated as frivolous, and a extra game added on.

New scoreboards may be the most underwhelming thing since Sean Davis's Bolton career.

And since when where we allowed to show the game 'live' on the scoreboards whilst play was going on ?

 

 

 

[Casino]

1 hour ago, embankment said:

Absolute muppet,  are we convinced he is a Bolton fan ? Those stewards who completely failed to take him out on the pitch need binning off .

 

 

He was sat west upper apparently

Prob left and came back in

Proper dickhead behaviour that

[Cheese]

2 minutes ago, ZiggyStardust said:

Not sure how anyone can watch the replay (evatt included) and think its not a red.

Initial thoughts (ESL) was yellow, but replays pretty conclusive.

If they appeal, it wouldnt be surprising if its treated as frivolous, and a extra game added on.

New scoreboards may be the most underwhelming thing since Sean Davis's Bolton career.

And since when where we allowed to show the game 'live' on the scoreboards whilst play was going on ?

The more I watch the replay, the more it looks like Jones pulls out after the tiniest contact and their lad makes a massive meal of it, rolling round likes he's been snapped. But I'd be screaming for a red if it was the other way round. It is what it is.

[Casino]

I think evatt was wound up by the reaction of one of theirs to the 4th useless twat

[Tonge moor green jacket]

3 minutes ago, Casino said:

I think evatt was wound up by the reaction of one of theirs to the 4th useless twat

He had said pretty much this in his post match interview. 

Whilst he may have a point, he cannot keep reacting as he does though.

[tomski]

Just now, Tonge moor green jacket said:

He had said pretty much this in his post match interview. 

Whilst he may have a point, he cannot keep reacting as he does though.

Agreed.

[desperado]

34 minutes ago, Eddie said:

We played Lincoln, Cheltenham and Fleetwood - 3 teams that will be battling for relegation come the end of the season. The fact they did well against those and then looked shite against the likes of Wigan and Peterborough suggest their level is mid table L1 - not pushing for promotion.

I’ll admit, I thought Iredale would be perfect in that position as he’s a natural LB and so can support Williams going forward (and he did in the first few games) but my god they’ve been found out as soon as we’ve played anyone half decent. How the fuck we’ve gone into this season with that left hand side is criminal! Partially stubbornness in backing his signing of Williams - who everyone else can see is bang average at best, and partially due to injury.

Apologies for putting a positive slant on the fact that Iredale and Jones (even though I stated they wouldn’t be my first choice and highlighted the first teams we played were of weaker opposition) demonstrate that we have decent back up and depth to get points in this league. And, I repeat, they were/are very much part of the strong squad character that got a point yesterday and I believe will help get us more this season. 

[Johnnyrotten]

13 hours ago, Mantra said:

We still look a shadow of the team that was on a hot streak pre-wigan, that really damaged the confidence of the players and supporters - plus the current injury situation isn't ideal.

Feels like we're not really getting the best out of the team. Dempsey, Santos, Charles and Dacres Cogley are all vital at the moment and undroppable. 

The hot streak has to be taken in context, yes the Lincoln win was great and I wouldn't take anything away from that.  Its hard to say we had a hot streak against the next 2 opponents who, after 17 games between them, have got a total of 3 points and Cheltenham are yet to score.  If we'd started the season v Wigan, Posh,  Reading then played Lincoln, Cheltenham, Fleetwood maybe we'd now be saying we'd made a good recovery after a sticky start? 

On Dempsey, I've thought him undroppable at times too, but I'd qualify it as "undroppable when on form".  If every player is at their best, he's in the starting X1, with Charles and Santos.  But Dempsey is either carrying that back injury or he's in poor form, either way he's far from undroppable, he's not doing many of the things that made him 1st or 2nd on the teamsheet.  Last year we seemed to have more options to rotate, but the midfield is looking like its relying on Dempsey and Sheehan hardly missing a game and  being on top of their game, it feels a bit unsustainable, like they need a break sometimes. 

[Johnnyrotten]

11 hours ago, ianofcleveleys said:

Williams is piss weak as a defender but stuck at a difficult task pretty well second half. 

I didn't see that he stuck to the task other than by staying on the pitch, not saying it was easy against their wide players but they put a million crosses in from the right, in both halves, he just seems to stand off them and say pick your spot.  I find it laughable that he's our "left back", he doesn't have a defensive bone in his body except occasionally running back at pace to make an interception.  Then he's out of breath for 2 minutes and can't get up the pitch.  His lack of nous was summed up when Baxter made a good save 2nd half, pushed it out wide and Williams was there to boot it up the pitch, but instead let it roll out for a corner for some reason, I swear he doesn't watch the game sometimes never mind join in 😀

[Wanderlust]

20 minutes ago, Johnnyrotten said:

I didn't see that he stuck to the task other than by staying on the pitch, not saying it was easy against their wide players but they put a million crosses in from the right, in both halves, he just seems to stand off them and say pick your spot.  I find it laughable that he's our "left back", he doesn't have a defensive bone in his body except occasionally running back at pace to make an interception.  Then he's out of breath for 2 minutes and can't get up the pitch.  His lack of nous was summed up when Baxter made a good save 2nd half, pushed it out wide and Williams was there to boot it up the pitch, but instead let it roll out for a corner for some reason, I swear he doesn't watch the game sometimes never mind join in 😀

He usually has enough pace to be an attacking threat, but when up against someone equally quick and has to defend he does look susceptible. He won't be faced with direct opposition as quick as that every week though so you'd expect him to only be selected when he can make full use of his best qualities i.e. in attack. Presumably all this is researched in advance?

I was fuming when he let that ball roll out for a corner BTW.

[Johnnyrotten]

4 hours ago, Stig said:

Reading through other posts on here:

-Agree completely we need to switch to a back 4. Forester and Toal centre backs, Cogley and probably Iredale (just edges Williams defensively, but it's not a great choice) full backs. Difficult question then is 433 or 442, and with Bodvarsson back I'd be tempted 442 with a narrow midfield 4, just to get him up top with Dion. Bit of a 50/50 though, just anything other than 532!

-Disagree with the Thomason criticism. We lose that game comfortably without him. Only player who can put a tackle in and the amount of tracking of their number 10, even when we had 3 centre backs. He was practically last man at times. Yes I agree he looks ungainly at times (last min when he couldn't sort his feet out and passed it straight out) but I'm struggling to see what people have been watching if their immediate response is to criticise Thomason. He was our best player yesterday 

Good comments re formation, with the 4 you mention as the back 4, although it will never happen under IE assuming 3 players capable of playing CB are available.   And it will be a long time before Vic is dropped, its not happened yet since he came and with a half decent scoring return this season its not going to change any time soon.

Can't agree on Tomo though, for the life of me I don't see him being a player who can "put a tackle in", technically its beyond him, hence his bookings. Too many errors to be near MOM, although not as many as most other starting players its fair to say. Forrester and Cogley best outfield players, plus Baxter, for me, by virtue of defending well and not being sloppy in possession.

[Mounts Kipper]

55 minutes ago, Johnnyrotten said:

I didn't see that he stuck to the task other than by staying on the pitch, not saying it was easy against their wide players but they put a million crosses in from the right, in both halves, he just seems to stand off them and say pick your spot.  I find it laughable that he's our "left back", he doesn't have a defensive bone in his body except occasionally running back at pace to make an interception.  Then he's out of breath for 2 minutes and can't get up the pitch.  His lack of nous was summed up when Baxter made a good save 2nd half, pushed it out wide and Williams was there to boot it up the pitch, but instead let it roll out for a corner for some reason, I swear he doesn't watch the game sometimes never mind join in 😀

Williams is a bad un defensively we basically used Dempsey as back up left back meaning he wasnt a threat in the final 3rd. Williams cut nothing out all day, he’s a gash defender and unless we can get him more often in the final 3rd and he can start delivering then he’s a waste of time. Another dud signing. 

[Tonge moor green jacket]

2 minutes ago, Mounts Kipper said:

Williams is a bad un defensively we basically used Dempsey as back up left back meaning he wasnt a threat in the final 3rd. Williams cut nothing out all day, he’s a gash defender and unless we can get him more often in the final 3rd and he can start delivering then he’s a waste of time. Another dud signing. 

Sometimes wonder if he would be better wide in an attacking role.

Ie in a 442 in front of a left back, or in a 4-5-1

[Johnnyrotten]

4 hours ago, only1swanny said:

I do think that our 5 3 2 is covering some cracks with defence, i don't think we would cope with a back 4 as we don't have proper full backs anymore. 

I know we've signed JDC and Williams to play as wingbacks not full backs, but if we chose to play 4-4-2, we've got Iredale for left back, and on the right JDC showed yesterday he can easily play with that defensive mindset.  And Jones is a full back, should JDC be used as a winger.  Toal and Forrester are more than capable of playing right back as well, they would be no more out of position than Jones or Iredale are at CB.  We currently do square pegs in round holes, I think 4 at the back would be an improvement in that respect defensively.  

[Johnnyrotten]

3 hours ago, gonzo said:

Aye its definitely a concern that left hand side. Iredale is a real worry, out-fought and out-jumped continually, so slow as well. He had a torrid time in that first half.

Williams was having a right battle with that Kioso, if he had any pace hed have rinsed  the big goon, instead it was scrapping for throw-ins and corners.

Weve no pace in the team.

Yes, it was like watching 2 non league players, who could give the ball away the least, no guile or intelligence or pace shown by either, possession was kept by the least bad. 

[gonzo]

2 hours ago, RUREADY2ROLL said:

Thought both Vic and Dion were poor yesterday up top and even worst when they came back with losing possession in dangerous areas. Both put a massive shift in thought and Dion absolutely run his socks off. 

Were you there yesterday?

[ianofcleveleys]

1 hour ago, Johnnyrotten said:

I didn't see that he stuck to the task other than by staying on the pitch, not saying it was easy against their wide players but they put a million crosses in from the right, in both halves, he just seems to stand off them and say pick your spot.  I find it laughable that he's our "left back", he doesn't have a defensive bone in his body except occasionally running back at pace to make an interception.  Then he's out of breath for 2 minutes and can't get up the pitch.  His lack of nous was summed up when Baxter made a good save 2nd half, pushed it out wide and Williams was there to boot it up the pitch, but instead let it roll out for a corner for some reason, I swear he doesn't watch the game sometimes never mind join in 😀

I was trying to be a bit charitable I suppose. Had his hands full with that winger, did manage to make one or two tackles though you're right in that he kept showing him the side he wanted to cross it from and the moment near the end when he let it roll out was baffling. 

[Wanderlust]

6 minutes ago, Johnnyrotten said:

I know we've signed JDC and Williams to play as wingbacks not full backs, but if we chose to play 4-4-2, we've got Iredale for left back, and on the right JDC showed yesterday he can easily play with that defensive mindset.  And Jones is a full back, should JDC be used as a winger.  Toal and Forrester are more than capable of playing right back as well, they would be no more out of position than Jones or Iredale are at CB.  We currently do square pegs in round holes, I think 4 at the back would be an improvement in that respect defensively.  

It would but under the current system we're dependent on WBs getting forward to create chances and wide to control possession.

Compromises....

[ianofcleveleys]

52 minutes ago, Mounts Kipper said:

Williams is a bad un defensively we basically used Dempsey as back up left back meaning he wasnt a threat in the final 3rd. Williams cut nothing out all day, he’s a gash defender and unless we can get him more often in the final 3rd and he can start delivering then he’s a waste of time. Another dud signing. 

Evatt goes on about flexibility and interchangeability but that's only within one system and one only. We've not had an actual left back, who defends first but can still get forward, since he arrived. 

Jury very much out on a number of recent signings but in Williams case verdict reached, a bad one.

[RUREADY2ROLL]

39 minutes ago, gonzo said:

Were you there yesterday?

Not missed a league game this season

[gonzo]

6 minutes ago, RUREADY2ROLL said:

Not missed a league game this season

Was just checking.

Let me know when you miss one so I can act all sanctimonious and discount your opinions because you werent there.

I thought today was the day

[Wanderlust]

9 minutes ago, ianofcleveleys said:

Evatt goes on about flexibility and interchangeability but that's only within one system and one only. We've not had an actual left back, who defends first but can still get forward, since he arrived. 

Jury very much out on a number of recent signings but in Williams case verdict reached, a bad one.

If Evatt had half of the transfer budget and wage structure we spent in 2018-19 when we were relegated from the Championship or even 2019-2020 when we were relegated from League 1 it might be a different story. Those were desperate times and we were punished because we spent more than we had to spend, but the amounts were not massive compared to other clubs who were trying to survive.

Currently we are allegedly trying to live within our means and not be so dependent on loan players whilst developing our own so inevitably it's going to be difficult..

I honestly don't think Evatt would have made the signings he had if he had a bigger budget to work with - so it's a matter of making do with what is affordable and developing a plan to achieve success with that - and some of the signings are a gamble based on the hope they will play at their best.

In some respects it is understandable that he is dogmatic about the system he wants to play because if he pulls it off it can be a winning system, however it's a high risk strategy with players of this calibre and with a small senior squad and unfortunately it's dependent on keeping everyone fit, avoiding suspensions and everyone playing at the top of their game week in week out.

That rarely happens in football so it's no surprise that we struggle sometimes, but...if we avoid those pitfalls it could be the recipe for promotion. As you point out, having all your eggs in one basket is OK until you drop it. The flexibility thing is there to compensate for not being able to afford two baskets. I think the system is a product of our financial prudence.

Personally, I'm amazed we're even in with a shout (however flimsy) at this stage - I was thinking 3 or 4 years in this league when we got out of L2, but Evatt and Sharon keep saying too much in the media and to many we come across as cocky rather than humble. Ambition is good but we should be quietly building rather than publicly saying Prem in 5 - if we get there, that's the time to talk about it.

I agree with a lot of what's been said about the system and the signings, but I don't think we should lose sight of the fact that we are still in the process of rebuilding our club and don't have a gazillionaire to speed up the process.

[radcliffe white]

1 hour ago, Mounts Kipper said:

Williams is a bad un defensively we basically used Dempsey as back up left back meaning he wasnt a threat in the final 3rd. Williams cut nothing out all day, he’s a gash defender and unless we can get him more often in the final 3rd and he can start delivering then he’s a waste of time. Another dud signing. 

Correct, another example of IE poor recruitment in the past few windows 

[Wanderlust]

A lot of Evatt's signings are getting a right slagging off on here today, so who would you have signed instead who was available at the time for the same transfer fee and wages?

[Leyther_Matt]

4 hours ago, Zico said:

Pretty sure Iredale was LB at Cambridge and when he first came the plan was to use him as LWB when the plan was to defend as alternative to DJ

Then with absence of GJ and RW being full time LWB he's ended up in the back 3

I thought it was the other way round and he’d signed as a centre back but we ended up sticking him at LWB?