No Henderson in the provisional squad 

1 hour ago, Pablo said:

The issue with only bringing Palmer in for Saka, is we would then be playing 3 natural number 10's, and would have zero width....ALSO with Kane who likes to drop deep. Balance would be way off.

I would be starting Palmer, Mainoo and Gordon, drop Saka AND Bellingham. Lets balance that front 4 up by adding width AND letting players play on natural positions.

True but Palmer did not look out of place on the right in the same way that Foden does on the left for whatever reason.

I wouldn’t hate it if the only change for the next starting 11 is Mainoo for Gallagher. As long as we bring on Palmer / Watkins / Gordon for a decent length of time second half. Let them grow into it and earn their starting place, by becoming match winners.

Funny how Bellingham and Kane are the only ones to score for us but so far have both been the most disappointing. Kane just doesn’t seem to fit the system and Bellingham looks knackered and frustrated.

Watkins and Palmer have had equally good individual seasons to both Kane and Bellingham, they should both be being heavily considered to start but I’ll understand if they are preferred as subs with a view to starting in the QF - performance pending. Just have to hope our attack is not so blunt that we fall behind and end up going out.

9 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

Two somewhat extreme sides of the argument there.

I don't think we qualified at a canter, and we've been horrible to watch. If we win 4-0 next game then great- we will have played a lot better in achieving that.

And if we win each game 1-0 then of course folk will be happy: once again though we will have had to have played top teams which would have necessitated better performance levels.

We've barely had any shots on target in the games, and we can't expect better teams to be any more welcoming, so that has to be improved. 

I've defended Southgate- his record stands up- but for me the football is worse now than it was in Russia, despite supposedly having better players.

They look shorn of confidence of themselves and in each other. Frightened of expressing themselves and far too negative.

Body language off too. 

At least some of that has to come from the management team.

All correct.

Most rational people and all of the pundits are only responding with what they are seeing with their eyes.

He's not a plucky underdog manager anymore with a collection of young lads. He's 4 tournaments in and should have won one of them. To annoy @L/H White...he's got no more credit in the bank.

We've just got to hope and pray this all a game plan to play at 60% and rise during the tournament. Because so far we look pedestrian at best.

Slow, ponderous, riddled with loose balls and mistakes and playing way too deep.

Starting each game with 3 number 10s, 2 defensive minded midfield players and 4 right footed defenders hasn't been thrown upon us. He could have had this all figured out ages ago.

I like Saka but don't think he's good enough for England Also Belliingham isn't Bryan Robson let alone Gazza.Maybe a slightly better version of Frank Lampard.Mainoo and Palmer will improve the team but not to tournament winning standard.

6 minutes ago, Roger_Dubuis said:

 Belliingham isn't Bryan Robson 

Every cloud and all that.😊

Just now, BobyBrno said:

Every cloud and all that.😊

Aye.

Not popped a shoulder neither.

There are positives about everything but the performances and selections.

Qualified, expended very little energy doing it (hence the criticism) avoided Spain, Portugal, France and Germany who will have to fight each other for one place in the final) and enough seen of Palmer, Mainoo, Gordon (and previously Bowen and Watkins) to give hope that they'll be used to change games whilst there is still time.

Current odds on our next round opponents are:

 

• 61% Netherlands

• 16% Slovakia

• 11% Ukraine

• 8% Romania

• 4% Belgium

Sure we have somehow fallen into the "easier" half of the draw, but none of the other teams in it are walkovers.

That said, could we possibly be in a better position than we currently are at this stage of the competition?

If we beat Holland or whoever, it's likely to be the winner of Italy v Switzerland in the semis.

Win that and Austria or Turkey could be the opponents along with whoever comes out on top of the undecided Group E - which could even be Belgium - we'll know more later.

We're not beating Holland

22 minutes ago, Traf said:

We're not beating Holland

You'd certainly imagine we'd need to sharpen up.

Fortunately, they haven't been great neither, also with pundits being critical.

23 minutes ago, Traf said:

We're not beating Holland

Think they are the ones that we could beat, they’re a bit shite. Like us but with fewer quality players.

Italy or Austria would worry me more. Italian passion and nouse or Austria’s relentless press.

2 hours ago, L/H White said:

pickford mot clean sheets in major tournaments (11)

there is positives

"Are".  Fucking "are". 

Holland also look very meh, very dodgy at the back.

1 hour ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

Two somewhat extreme sides of the argument there.

I don't think we qualified at a canter, and we've been horrible to watch. If we win 4-0 next game then great- we will have played a lot better in achieving that.

And if we win each game 1-0 then of course folk will be happy: once again though we will have had to have played top teams which would have necessitated better performance levels.

We've barely had any shots on target in the games, and we can't expect better teams to be any more welcoming, so that has to be improved. 

I've defended Southgate- his record stands up- but for me the football is worse now than it was in Russia, despite supposedly having better players.

They look shorn of confidence of themselves and in each other. Frightened of expressing themselves and far too negative.

Body language off too. 

At least some of that has to come from the management team.

The Dutchman in the bordering property (Remco, Ajax fan) shouted to me this morning in passing on his palomino "We (Netherlands) were shit last night but I hope it is England we play next. We don't want any good team to come up against".

If it is to be the Netherlands it's a win-win for me. Win and I'll be helping to correct my current neighbours attitude. Lose and it will be "bye, bye waistcoat".

24 minutes ago, Pablo said:

Holland also look very meh, very dodgy at the back.

VVD was all over the place yesterday. They could live with Austrias energy and press. Fuck me I'm glad we've avoided Austria. They'd all over us like a rash with our ponderous passing.

Xavi Simons on Hollands right will have a bloody field day mind. He's looking rapid.

what's the scenario tonight then, how do we avoid the dutch?

18 minutes ago, gonzo said:

VVD was all over the place yesterday. They could live with Austrias energy and press. Fuck me I'm glad we've avoided Austria. They'd all over us like a rash with our ponderous passing.

Xavi Simons on Hollands right will have a bloody field day mind. He's looking rapid.

Holland will score against us. We might never score.

Why is it always the Euros where we start badly?

It's not just our passing that has gone backwards since that France semi final. 

38 minutes ago, L/H White said:

what's the scenario tonight then, how do we avoid the dutch?

I don't fully understand it as it will come down to some obscure interpretation of the draw and the table criteria. My mate says that within a table they use head to head rather than GD - but how they decide between teams from different groups I have no idea. Currently the Dutch are the best of the sides finishing 3rd with 4 points and a GD of 0  in groups D, E and F -  does that mean we're necessarily drawn against the BEST of the three that finish 3rd? If so, how are "the best" decided if points are level?

Impossible to say who it will be because group E has four teams on 3 points after 2 games so at any draw today will mean at least 1 team on 4 pts and Slovakia also have a GD of 0 - how to decide between the two?

In group F it's also complex because of GD - it could even be the Belgians.

Maybe when the third place teams are decided they have another draw?

In summary, not a fucking clue

Edited June 26, 20242 yr by Wanderlust

Just read this:

Southgate's men will face the Dutch, who finished third in Group D, unless the Czech Republic beat Turkey or Georgia are victorious against Portugal in Group F.

That is because Turkey, Czech Republic and Georgia can all finish third in Group F - and, if they do so while ending up with three points or more, they would take Hungary's place in the third-placed standings.

The knock-on affect of that will leave England with a tie against someone in Group E.

Meanwhiler Foden has flown home "due to an urgent family matter".

Hopefully to return.

Mainoo starts the next game.

]Kane, Jude and Saka can go on the bench too 🙂

1 hour ago, Dr. Feelgood said:

Meanwhiler Foden has flown home "due to an urgent family matter".

Hopefully to return looking like Jack Grealish

 

If Foden can't return, do we just have to do without or can we call up someone else?

1 hour ago, Dr. Feelgood said:

Meanwhiler Foden has flown home "due to an urgent family matter".

Hopefully to return.

Another child being born. 3rd one, and he's 24.

Given the amount of football and training he's involved with, he's got some energy!

2 minutes ago, Lt. Aldo Raine said:

If Foden can't return, do we just have to do without or can we call up someone else?

He's fine.