(That long since we've had any, couldn't find the thread)

Alan Nixon: "Top Liverpool starlet Cameron Branagan will Ben allowed out on loan in Jan.

Bolton lead the race for the 20 year old midfielder"

Edited December 11, 20169 yr by Ratwhite

4 hours ago, Sluffy said:

Yes you could.

I don't know if there is some form of view that I'm a Evatt fan, I'm not, as far as I'm concerned he reached his ceiling as a manager with us leading up to the Oxford final, iirc results were beginning to slip and it seemed to me other clubs (Not  Oxford at the time we beat them 5-0) had sussed out Evatt ball and Evatt hadn't the wit to vary his game plan and no plan B to fall back to.

My view of Schumacher is quite the opposite, I reckon he's by far the best manager we've had since Allardyce and he's quick to adapt and change shape and tactics, mid stream in games.

The point I was making to my old friend Masi, which he refuses to hear, is that Evatt signings were the core of the team last season particularly when for whatever reason the the club (Harkin?) chose to deliberately go into the second half of the season with a parcity of defenders after letting Cogley and Forrester to leave without replacing them.

Masi is fixated on his hatred of all things Evatt, stemming from I presume, when all the players under him were playing to a system that had been rumbled and which Evatt refused to (could not?) fix or move away from.

A good example of which is look at the transformation of united from Amorim to Carrick, same players, different system, vastly different results.  Conclusion being there was nothing wrong with the players, if you played to their strengths rather than they be forced into a system they are not suited too.

Harkin cut Johnston, Tutu and Dempsey not because they were Evatt signings but because he didn't believe they could do it in the Championship (He may well have kept all three if we remained in the second tier - but we will never know now).

If Harkin believes Forino, Toal, Sheehan and McAtee can do a job for him in the Championship he will retain them (and Schumacher will continue to select them), if he doesn't he will try to move them out - nothing at all to do with being Evatt signings.

It's business as the saying goes, it isn't anything personal - half of the team that just got promoted were Evatt signings now playing under a new (Harkin/Schumacher) system - I don't understand why anyone would want to deny something that is there for everyone to see for themselves?

One player from the Evatt days has had a new contract......Sheehan and rightly so

The others that are left may or may not get a new contract when their present one runs out....Forino i would be looking to extend it now

Evatt was great the first three seasons he was with us....Trafford in goal and Bradley season he should of got us up but was more interested in improving his % win games in the EFL cup. The following season football giants Carlisle and Wigan came to our place and played a high press and i knew he  had been worked out. That was when he should have changed but no same thing week in week out even down to the same substitutions at the same point in the game.

At that point i had no disliking for Evatt but how did he re-act he threw his coaching staff under a bus....Their fault then the players. Then the stories on here started of players not training etc,etc. Yet he still would not own it after the oxford game blaming the players mentality. Oxford got lucky that day with the Maghoma injury but like Carlisle and Wigan six months previously they knew a high press would do us........And it did. That summer the board wrongly give Evatt £3m plus to in fact make us worse. Schon, Mcatee and Randall came in and none have set the world on fire

Schon we got a get out of jail Randall we will take a big hit this summer and Mcatee is a tryer and Sunday he paid a little of his fee back with that header.

One piece of SS being a astute coach has yet to be picked up on this forum and that was getting a fee for Cogley and not replacing him in the January window. He knew Desmond would do a equally good job at right back as Cogley but it would only be until the Summer.....SS i have no doubt is thinking a little in front and that is what makes a person stand out in life they think ahead.

24 minutes ago, masi 51 said:

One player from the Evatt days has had a new contract......Sheehan and rightly so

The others that are left may or may not get a new contract when their present one runs out....Forino i would be looking to extend it now

Evatt was great the first three seasons he was with us....Trafford in goal and Bradley season he should of got us up but was more interested in improving his % win games in the EFL cup. The following season football giants Carlisle and Wigan came to our place and played a high press and i knew he  had been worked out. That was when he should have changed but no same thing week in week out even down to the same substitutions at the same point in the game.

At that point i had no disliking for Evatt but how did he re-act he threw his coaching staff under a bus....Their fault then the players. Then the stories on here started of players not training etc,etc. Yet he still would not own it after the oxford game blaming the players mentality. Oxford got lucky that day with the Maghoma injury but like Carlisle and Wigan six months previously they knew a high press would do us........And it did. That summer the board wrongly give Evatt £3m plus to in fact make us worse. Schon, Mcatee and Randall came in and none have set the world on fire

Schon we got a get out of jail Randall we will take a big hit this summer and Mcatee is a tryer and Sunday he paid a little of his fee back with that header.

One piece of SS being a astute coach has yet to be picked up on this forum and that was getting a fee for Cogley and not replacing him in the January window. He knew Desmond would do a equally good job at right back as Cogley but it would only be until the Summer.....SS i have no doubt is thinking a little in front and that is what makes a person stand out in life they think ahead.

Couldn't be any better said.

34 minutes ago, Tombwfc said:

 

It's a bit trite, but getting promoted means all of those were successes in the end.

We needed a steady presence in goal and Bonham provided that, and pulled off great saves in the playoffs. We wouldn't have even made the playoffs if Cissoko hadn't scored against Huddersfield.

I wouldn't be desperate to see any of them here and starting next season, but they all contributed.

we would have made the play offs, on goal difference, but that's by the by, in any case, fine margins that's for sure, particulary with all those late rescued point

but I agree in general

those signings all contributed and the team was a success

I guess that also means TSL was a success, but I'm not having that

but Apter definitely wasn't, and not sure about Forss either

in a team table of sucesses though, Burstow is up at the top

30 minutes ago, masi 51 said:

 

Evatt was great the first three seasons he was with us....Trafford in goal and Bradley season he should of got us up but was more interested in improving his % win games in the EFL cup.

 

we were great in the EFL Cup final against the champions, but, in general, that team wasn't close to being a top 2 team, and came up well short in the play offs - that was nothing to do with the EFL Cup though

he definitely should have got us up the following season though

47 minutes ago, masi 51 said:

One piece of SS being a astute coach has yet to be picked up on this forum and that was getting a fee for Cogley and not replacing him in the January window. He knew Desmond would do a equally good job at right back as Cogley but it would only be until the Summer.....SS i have no doubt is thinking a little in front and that is what makes a person stand out in life they think ahead.

Vast majority of that post bang on, very good summary, just that, for  me, the decision with Tutu on the right was less of a gamble than the one on the left, that wasnt astute management for me and one we got away with.

With Tutu there was the back up of Christie, with Conway at LB there was Johnston or nothing having ruled Taylor out as an option.

Tutu's late season improvement also coincided with ACD's return, he was far less secure before that with a weakling like Apter in front of him.

I would think genuine, quality full backs will be high on SS's shopping list already.

29 minutes ago, Zico said:

we would have made the play offs, on goal difference, but that's by the by, in any case, fine margins that's for sure, particulary with all those late rescued point

but I agree in general

those signings all contributed and the team was a success

I guess that also means TSL was a success, but I'm not having that

but Apter definitely wasn't, and not sure about Forss either

in a team table of sucesses though, Burstow is up at the top

 

Fair point. Mentally I thought Huddersfield at home was a win when it actually just felt like one. Regardless, at a point where SS was publicly calling for another winger to step up, Cissoko played his best football of the season.

TSL was a net negative and got binned off half way through a season long loan. Apter 0 goals, 1 assist in 13 games and got totally bombed out for the playoffs.

I'm not saying it's overly scientific, but common sense would say who contributed to us getting promoted and who didn't.

14 hours ago, desperado said:

It really was.

What a contribution Rodrigues has made. Without him we may not have been promoted. 

He was the bestrabbit out of the hat! 😂

Quality player 

Got to say GJ and Demps have been great for our club and I wish them good luck in the future . 

3 minutes ago, Rizlar said:

Got to say GJ and Demps have been great for our club and I wish them good luck in the future . 

Both no nonsense type of players. Just what we needed at the time.

You would want them alongside you in the trenches. 

24 minutes ago, Rizlar said:

Quality player 

Takes the pressure off Sheehan as the only one that can see a pass Sheehan knits it together Rodrigues creates 

Taylor is not what we need and we need to get rid. 

CBT is to injury prone. the Championship is hard enough without lads in the medical room getting better each game.

Kenny wants celtic move on

31 minutes ago, ianofcleveleys said:

Vast majority of that post bang on, very good summary, just that, for  me, the decision with Tutu on the right was less of a gamble than the one on the left, that wasnt astute management for me and one we got away with.

With Tutu there was the back up of Christie, with Conway at LB there was Johnston or nothing having ruled Taylor out as an option.

Tutu's late season improvement also coincided with ACD's return, he was far less secure before that with a weakling like Apter in front of him.

I would think genuine, quality full backs will be high on SS's shopping list already.

I would be amazed if the right back spot is not done and dusted, hands shook and contract sorted.

9 minutes ago, Chrisj said:

Takes the pressure off Sheehan as the only one that can see a pass Sheehan knits it together Rodrigues creates 

Said this before - he’s also someone they trust to fire the ball into (and ACD) as an easy out ball. Before these two came into the team it was Sheehan or other centre back / full back, putting a lot of pressure on him, once they came in you had multiple options to have confidence in getting us up the pitch.

10 hours ago, Johnnyrotten said:

 If McAtee's season had ended with that sending off at Plymouth, as a few on here said it must do because he was a disgrace (maybe they can reveal themselves?), he would also have been considered a flop.  But if he'd been discarded, we might still be in L1. 

If CBT hadn't got injured, Cissoko was an undoubted flop.  If Bonham's season had ended v Luton (if we'd failed to get into the play offs) - an undoubted flop.  Along with SS, who'd absolutely failed to deliver with such a poor points total.

 

I’m with you on this.

It’s ridiculously fine margins.

The way our manager and some of our players have been written off this season has been extreme IMO.

And I don’t mean the game to game opinion and analysis which can understandably, after a defeat, be overly negative.

I’m on about the seismic dismissal of our players and manager not being good enough. 

I really do hope we remember what’s happened this season before folk write-off our next player or manager. 

10 hours ago, masi 51 said:

Perhaps when he reports back SS gives him a chance in the first few friendlies and perhaps tries Conway further forward

SS will see him everyday and he will know whether he will be in his plans next season.

Sometimes it takes a player 12 months to settle into a club

Maybe 51 and I really do hope so. I don’t know what went wrong after his PV cock up but clearly something did. Whether it was physical or mental we don’t know but surely the club must have seen something in him to have signed him and it’s unlikely he’s been that bad that he wasn’t worth at least a run out in another cup game? I think the consensus was that he was more suited to central defence rather than left back but then we didn’t really see enough of him to be sure. Whilst I sincerely hope he gets another chance to prove himself I just can’t see it now we’re a league higher but then you never know in football and he might turn out a real good un?

In a league where the majority of central midfielders can pass to about 80% of Sheehans ability without compromising on other midfield attributes is Sheehan a starting XI player? i'm not sure.

28 minutes ago, Big E said:

Taylor is not what we need and we need to get rid. 

CBT is to injury prone. the Championship is hard enough without lads in the medical room getting better each game.

Kenny wants celtic move on

Agree on Kenny, his hearts at Celtic and if it doesn’t work out then move on and maybe look at Sidibeh who looks to have all the tools including a bit of attitude?

6 minutes ago, Zog1 said:

In a league where the majority of central midfielders can pass to about 80% of Sheehans ability without compromising on other midfield attributes is Sheehan a starting XI player? i'm not sure.

Some made up assumption that Zog.

I think a less sensationalist way of saying your point would be - does Sheehan have the overall midfield attributes to compete in higher quality league, where he’s less likely to stand out for his passing ability?

It’s a fair point, but you could ask it of any of our players - can they make the step up? Based on the fact he’s played quite a lot of international football, Sheehan would probably be the one you’d say has the best chance, but it’s far from guaranteed.

If you can prove that the majority of midfielders in the Championship can pass to 80% (what does that even mean) of his ability without compromising other midfield attributes - then fair play because I wouldn’t know where to start.

Sam Nombe played well against us, and scored.

He’s probably one, though not the main one.  Reasonably cheap now considering Rotherham’s situation.

13 minutes ago, Zog1 said:

In a league where the majority of central midfielders can pass to about 80% of Sheehans ability without compromising on other midfield attributes is Sheehan a starting XI player? i'm not sure.

Yes.

See @Eddie above 👆 

I’d be surprised if Sheehan doesn’t start that first game in the championship in August. 

Just now, HenryPorter said:

Sam Nombe played well against us, and scored.

He’s probably one, though not the main one.  Reasonably cheap now considering Rotherham’s situation.

I’d definitely go with Sam. He’s another who has all the tools and will certainly be leaving the Millers this summer. They did want to recoup the £1.2m they paid Exeter but with only 12 months left on his contract and the lad himself wanting away I think they’d have to reduce that quite a bit. There’s still questions over ownership so that may also affect any sale.

I'd like to think we're aiming higher than Nombe

I was never a fan of Sheehan but he’s proved me wrong after watching him more in each game he does so much tracking back and helping the defence which he does well personally I think he will do well in the championship putting his skills against better players happy he signed a contract extension. 

1 minute ago, L/H White said:

I'd like to think we're aiming higher than Nombe

So would I.

i was comparing Nombe with Sidibeh. Better all- round player and useful as backup. He’s better than Burstow too in my view.

14 minutes ago, Whitesince63 said:

Agree on Kenny, his hearts at Celtic and if it doesn’t work out then move on and maybe look at Sidibeh who looks to have all the tools including a bit of attitude?

We want to aim higher than Sidibeh