Politics

[Spider]

Paul wanted no deal so is, in effect, celebrating a draw at home.

[Casino]

So, what youre saying, is that paul is the biggest loser?

[Spider]

2 minutes ago, Casino said:

So, what youre saying, is that paul is the biggest loser?

There’ll be an article in the Telegraph coming your way again soon.

Get your big readers ready.

[paulhanley]

8 minutes ago, Ani said:

Paul - The Telegraph is hardly neutral on the subject. Expecting opponents of Leaving to jump in the air cheering is like telling your birds ex boyfriend they can sniff your fingers for old times sake so you know she is happy. 
 

The general consensus from economists before Brexit was that there would be a negative impact on the economy in the short/medium/long term (depending on their personal slant). How they knew that without knowing what a deal might look like is questionable. 
 

So far there has not been a massive amount of negative comment on the deal other than fishermen and seed potato growers which I am sure we can all live with. Although the devil is in the detail the fact we have a workable trade deal is a step in the right direction. The fact that the only other negative comment on the deal is Farage saying not gone far enough. Makes me think the balance could be about right. 
 

The deal is done and we now have to play our cards the best we can in this new world. The reality is that the success or otherwise of the country will rest on a whole range of factors and on a purely economic basis we will never know in our life times if we are ‘winners’ out of this. 

Well that's a very composed analysis. I do think we will see the benefits fairly soon.. certainly over the next five years. Not just from our own success but from watching the EU decline. Let's see....

I appreciate the Telegraph is not neutral. However remainers live in a lefty echo chamber and the Telegraph presents a point of view to which they would not usually be exposed. 

I hope we can agree however that the Project Fear nonsense that predicted we'd be on the breadline weeks after a Brexit vote in 2016 with further indignities to follow one by one before we became a virtual third world state were and are just a little wrong. When you compare the horse-shit spoken by Osborne/Adonis/Swinson et al as part of Project Fear with the reality you really can see why we should ignore the nonsense they continue to spout. 

[paulhanley]

7 minutes ago, Spider said:

Paul wanted no deal so is, in effect, celebrating a draw at home.

No he didn't.

Which makes you wrong. Again.

[Spider]

1 minute ago, paulhanley said:

No he didn't.

Which makes you wrong. Again.

🧐

of course.

 

[Ani]

2 minutes ago, paulhanley said:

Well that's a very composed analysis. I do think we will see the benefits fairly soon.. certainly over the next five years. Not just from our own success but from watching the EU decline. Let's see....

I appreciate the Telegraph is not neutral. However remainers live in a lefty echo chamber and the Telegraph presents a point of view to which they would not usually be exposed. 

I hope we can agree however that the Project Fear nonsense that predicted we'd be on the breadline weeks after a Brexit vote in 2016 with further indignities to follow one by one before we became a virtual third world state were and are just a little wrong. When you compare the horse-shit spoken by Osborne/Adonis/Swinson et al as part of Project Fear with the reality you really can see why we should ignore the nonsense they continue to spout. 

But this generalisation that Remainers live in lefty echo chamber is simply not true. Millions more vote to remain than vote for the Labour Party. It is a lazy as the ‘old thick racist’ comments. 
 

I voted to Remain because am doing ok and the idea of risking that for an unknown undefined deal was not worth it. As you can imagine with my pension tied into investments I am desperate to be proved wrong. 

[Spider]

On 24/10/2020 at 12:47, paulhanley said:

It's not me doing the negotiation. I'll have an opinion on the deal when it is signed and detail is available. 

Do please stop asking questions as if I am conducting the negotiation with David Frost and co.

You’re up.

[paulhanley]

2 minutes ago, Ani said:

But this generalisation that Remainers live in lefty echo chamber is simply not true. Millions more vote to remain than vote for the Labour Party. It is a lazy as the ‘old thick racist’ comments. 
 

I voted to Remain because am doing ok and the idea of risking that for an unknown undefined deal was not worth it. As you can imagine with my pension tied into investments I am desperate to be proved wrong. 

I know it is a generalisation and I know plenty of remain voters who aren't like that. Two close family members of mine represent a big number of those who voted remain in 2016 and became very turned off by the disgrace of what happened between 2017 and 2019 with the attempt to undermine the referendum result. Or in other words they are democrats. My words are never aimed at those middle ground people. Its the difference between a remainer and a remoaner.

I'm sure you understand that millions of people voted to leave because they were/are not doing OK and saw a better future for this country free of the EU. It's as clear as day that the EU is associated with elites. Sooner or later this dynamic is going to come back to haunt them with further departures or at the very least real trouble.

[paulhanley]

2 minutes ago, Spider said:

You’re up.

Where does that say I wanted no deal? Is that the best you can dredge up?

[Spider]

2 minutes ago, paulhanley said:

Where does that say I wanted no deal? Is that the best you can dredge up?

It doesn’t but this was top of the search.

If you wanted a deal then I will gladly accept I was wrong.

so how’s the deal kidda?

[Cheese]

3 minutes ago, paulhanley said:

It's as clear as day that the EU is associated with elites.

Like Jacob Rees-Mogg and Boris Johnson?

[Ani]

4 minutes ago, paulhanley said:

I know it is a generalisation and I know plenty of remain voters who aren't like that. Two close family members of mine represent a big number of those who voted remain in 2016 and became very turned off by the disgrace of what happened between 2017 and 2019 with the attempt to undermine the referendum result. Or in other words they are democrats. My words are never aimed at those middle ground people. Its the difference between a remainer and a remoaner.

I'm sure you understand that millions of people voted to leave because they were/are not doing OK and saw a better future for this country free of the EU. It's as clear as day that the EU is associated with elites. Sooner or later this dynamic is going to come back to haunt them with further departures or at the very least real trouble.

I think millions of people voted to Leave because they feel ignored by the political elite. I have posted before that if you are living in an old pit village in the north with double digit unemployment and little or no investment and you are given the ‘as is’ or ‘change’ which do you vote for. You vote ‘change’ not because you are old and thick but because of the options and explanations offered it is the best option. 
Plenty on both sides may have had deeper and more informed reasons but the ones that tipped the scales fall firmly in that catergory. 

[paulhanley]

Just now, Spider said:

It doesn’t but this was top of the search.

If you wanted a deal then I will gladly accept I was wrong.

so how’s the deal kidda?

I wanted a deal but was not frightened of no deal. 

Those whose opinions I trust have so far been positive about the deal. I suspect some ERG members will spot some things they are not keen on once they have been through the detail with a fine tooth comb. 

Are you going to stop rattling on about "oven ready" now you've been confounded that a deal has been done? You've been frothing with sarcasm for months. Here we are with a deal. Here we are 11 months out of the EU and five days from exiting the common market and all of the other paraphanalia. Project Fear was bollocks.

[Spider]

1 minute ago, paulhanley said:

I wanted a deal but was not frightened of no deal. 

Those whose opinions I trust have so far been positive about the deal. I suspect some ERG members will spot some things they are not keen on once they have been through the detail with a fine tooth comb. 

Are you going to stop rattling on about "oven ready" now you've been confounded that a deal has been done? You've been frothing with sarcasm for months. Here we are with a deal. Here we are 11 months out of the EU and five days from exiting the common market and all of the other paraphanalia. Project Fear was bollocks.

In summary, you don’t give a shit. You just want to bellow that a deal is done, even if the financial sector (80% of our GDP) looks like it’s been sold a dud?

I’ll be clear, if my business succeeds but loads of other don’t, I don’t give a shit. I’m with Mounts on this - every man for himself now. 

[paulhanley]

Just now, Ani said:

I think millions of people voted to Leave because they feel ignored by the political elite. I have posted before that if you are living in an old pit village in the north with double digit unemployment and little or no investment and you are given the ‘as is’ or ‘change’ which do you vote for. You vote ‘change’ not because you are old and thick but because of the options and explanations offered it is the best option. 
Plenty on both sides may have had deeper and more informed reasons but the ones that tipped the scales fall firmly in that catergory. 

Agreed.

But it wasn't just a blind kick at the status quo. There are well-documented reasons why the EU contributed towards the stagnancy experienced in some parts of this country. We are much more free to do something about this now. The manufacturing base of this country, the fortunes of its coastal communities etc took a dip at a remarkably similar time to us getting webbed up with the European project. This EU wasn't just an unfortunate victim of a visceral need to hit out. It deserved the rejection both in terms of its deeply undemocratic nature and its contribution to economic issues.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Spider said:

In summary, you don’t give a shit. You just want to bellow that a deal is done, even if the financial sector (80% of our GDP) looks like it’s been sold a dud?

I’ll be clear, if my business succeeds but loads of other don’t, I don’t give a shit. I’m with Mounts on this - every man for himself now. 

80% of our GDP!!!!!!!!!!

 

😄😄😄

[Spider]

1 minute ago, boltondiver said:

80% of our GDP!!!!!!!!!!

 

😄😄😄

Services sector is. Typo!

 

Edited December 26, 2020 by Spider

[paulhanley]

1 minute ago, Spider said:

In summary, you don’t give a shit. You just want to bellow that a deal is done, even if the financial sector (80% of our GDP) looks like it’s been sold a dud?

I’ll be clear, if my business succeeds but loads of other don’t, I don’t give a shit. I’m with Mounts on this - every man for himself now. 

I hope your business succeeds. I hope every business succeeds. I hope the nation succeeds. I think we all have a better chance from January 1, 2021 than we did before. 

Our financial sector will continue to prosper. But it will no longer be such a huge part of our GDP. Our capacity to diversify is now much broader. It's very exciting.

[paulhanley]

11 minutes ago, Cheese said:

Like Jacob Rees-Mogg and Boris Johnson?

Both democrats. Both key parts of what has been achieved this last four and a half years. Both have proved cynics like you wrong at every single juncture.

[Ani]

6 minutes ago, Spider said:

In summary, you don’t give a shit. You just want to bellow that a deal is done, even if the financial sector (80% of our GDP) looks like it’s been sold a dud?

I’ll be clear, if my business succeeds but loads of other don’t, I don’t give a shit. I’m with Mounts on this - every man for himself now. 

The financial services sector was never meant to be part of the deal. I have no idea why. 

[Cheese]

Just now, paulhanley said:

Both democrats. Both key parts of what has been achieved this last four and a half years. Both have proved cynics like you wrong at every single juncture.

Both "elites" who wouldn't piss on you if you were on fire.

[Spider]

1 minute ago, paulhanley said:

Both democrats. Both key parts of what has been achieved this last four and a half years. Both have proved cynics like you wrong at every single juncture.

Not part of the elite then?

[Guest]

Just now, Spider said:

Not part of the elite then?

Interesting about Boris, he received a scholarship to Eton.

[paulhanley]

Just now, Spider said:

Not part of the elite then?

They played a key part in getting that deal you were so giddy about us not getting. 

Oven ready.