6 coppers to take him down or 1 member of the public with his bike? 
 

 

 

46 minutes ago, gonzo said:

I keep stuff like whipped up narrative, algorithms and social media brainwashing folk in to thinking certain ways and vote for people.

It's as if these incidents aren't actually happening. It's as if there hasn't actually been Aslyum seekers trying to behead folk in the street or rafts of sexual assault and rape cases by men and boys from Afghanistan all over the country.

It's as if what the seems old news of Pakistani Muslim grooming gangs across the county haven't happened and this Nowark kid wasn't left to die in handcuffs after being stabbed by a man that was allowed to wander round with a ceremonial machete.

It's as if there isn't boats upon boat load of migrants being housed all over the country in HMOs, Hotels and housing schemes putting yet more strain on services.

You don't need algorithms and Tommy Robinson twitter accounts or GB News to see that these problems are happening in every day life.

Of course your Reforms and Restores will jump all over anything but that's how politicians work.

They wouldn't exist if the problems weren't allowed to sprial out of control by our two main parties over decades anyway.

Not sure anyone is saying these things are not happening but the anger and reaction is whipped and multiplied by social media.

Take Southport as the prime example, everyone knows it was horrific. But the riots that followed were driven by rhetoric and lies on social media. The vast majority of people do not get involved but those that do see reminders every few seconds about how angry they should be and how the infamous MSM are covering everything up. There are some people who still think he was a recently arrived immigrant.

More recently the Southampton case, yesterday lads were sent to prison for rioting. The responses initially from bots but then from actual people tell us all that it is two tier policing. When the two brothers from Manchester Airport got off totally free. One bloke put a link to an article that proved they were released. The article actually said one of them gave evidence in the second trial from prison FFS !

I left Twitter because it is horrible, it gives people with nothing to say somewhere to shout about stuff. At first I tried to use it to understand other people’s views, but a couple of clicks later and my feed became a torrent of hate and conspiracy theories.

People like Tommy are making a fortune from it, Farage uses it to light the blue touch paper , keeps his words just the right side of legal and lets the bots and his followers do the rest. Those of us who grew up in the 70s will remember National Front marches and everything that came with them. But now you have 000s of accounts supporting similar views with zero control.

It not just politics, look at Andrew Tate and the Manosphere.

You are right the problems exist but does the fact net migration is down significantly and small boat numbers are down get the same coverage ? Especially if news is being fed by social media since you have ‘realised’ that MSM is so unreliable ? The fact all other media is controlled by billionaires pushing their own agenda is just ignored. People are being controlled like never before and it ain’t Governments that are doing it.

I don’t get this thing about X and the algorithms. I read the posts by people and organisations I choose to follow. Mainly, news, politicians and sport. I’m sure if people go looking for it they will find all sorts of shite.

I do know how algorithms work by the way and I know how to avoid the influence they can provide.

I read on here someone complaining about a site I quoted from and said they advertise porn on that site. Funnily enough, the only advertising I got was cruises for seniors.😉

16 hours ago, Sluffy said:

Ha ha ha!

I bow to your first-hand knowledge of his postings on here, and I'm aware that I myself am somewhat of an acquired taste and feature on several members "ignore" lists already but I'd like to think Bolty has a bit more about him in terms of having patience with me.

Maybe I'm completely wrong of course - well him telling me to "fuck off" certainly suggests that I am!

I certainly don't share his vatnlk devotion to Trump and MAGA ideology (a "vatnik" being an excellent description of Bolty I would suggest), I just feel that Bolty simply is unable to understand why we are not 'vatniks' ourselves, so is left to deride and scorn those of who are not because his vantiknism is not grounded in either the truth or reality.

My dear friend W63 ("sincey" seems to be his nickname on here but I know not why?) is similarly vatnik-ised (if there is such a word?) in respect of Trumpism and all it entails but although we clash often over on Nuts, he is delightful and salt of the earth person, away from the subject.

I feel that neither Bolty nor W63 are able to articulate anything like enough to put forward a convincing defence of Trump/Trumpism, so revert to 'sniping' in Bolty's case, unable to accept indisputable scientific facts (such as man made global warming) with W63 and the need for deflections, leading to bottomless arguments with RW until people, such as myself simply don't see the point carrying on anymore, "filibustering" it is known as - which is not winning the argument, merely stopping any further sensible discussion on it.

(Just to be clear I do not see RW as being a vatnik per se but rather that he often stands besides Bolty on the threads I've seen).

I believe all three of these gentlemen are decent fellas and worth a bit of effort to engage in social intercourse with (although one or more may not wish to reciprocate?)

We shall see.

A couple of definitions if you permit me.

Social intercourse: refers to the day-to-day communication, exchange of ideas, and interactions between individuals. It is the fundamental human activity of spending time together, socialising, and building relationships.

Filibuster: a filibuster is a political or parliamentary tactic used by a minority in a legislative body to delay or completely block a vote on a bill. This is most commonly achieved by delivering an exceptionally long speech, though simply threatening to do so is often enough to halt proceedings - in other words Talking a Bill to Death.

Vatnik: is a political pejorative used in Russia and post-Soviet states to describe a person who is a staunch, uncritical follower of Russian government propaganda. The term likens individuals to the stereotype of a brainwashed, ultranationalist jingoist.

I would like to take the opportunity of stating Bertie that I've been a great admirer of your posts on here, I view most of what you say in the same way fwiw.

The usual typed form of verbal diarrhoea as expected. Not interested in entering in depth political discussions with the likes of you and the other big woke activist leftie bore on here whom you seem to admire.

'Able to articulate' Life's too fucking short.

13 hours ago, Sweep said:

No shock there, but their supporters really don't seem to care, it seems

In the light of what has been served up by the 'big two' over the last few decades it really is no shock as you say. Those two need decimating defeat.

15 minutes ago, BobyBrno said:

I don’t get this thing about X and the algorithms. I read the posts by people and organisations I choose to follow. Mainly, news, politicians and sport. I’m sure if people go looking for it they will find all sorts of shite.

I do know how algorithms work by the way and I know how to avoid the influence they can provide.

I read on here someone complaining about a site I quoted from and said they advertise porn on that site. Funnily enough, the only advertising I got was cruises for seniors.😉

I only watch YouTube and just get videos of blokes fixing stuff and dogs.

If I ever glance on twitter it's just big lasses in nylon.

10 hours ago, RONNIE PHILLIPS said:

Come on where?

He really is a fucking idiot. He'll be screaming 'racist' any time now and contributing more in his own little way to tragedies like the death of Henry Nowak.

2 hours ago, Bertie said:

Exactly. It was, is and will be up to the main political parties to stop or ideally prevent these real problems which are affecting the country and its law abiding citizens (of all backgrounds). If not then history tells us less salubrious individuals and parties will emerge to exploit the problems and create divisions all in the name of personal gain. Time is running out for Labour or the Tories to convince people that they can make their lives better, so they don’t have to resort to the lies of Reform/Restore who ironically will only make their lives worse.

2 hours ago, Bertie said:

Time is running out for Labour or the Tories to convince people that they can make their lives better

Precisely... the speed of technology and communications is very quickly overtaking the traditional parties... Starmer is very slow and ponderous and is particularly vulnerable to being unable to cope with the accelerating world we currently live in

33 minutes ago, bolty58 said:

In the light of what has been served up by the 'big two' over the last few decades it really is no shock as you say. Those two need decimating defeat.

Be careful what you wish for is all I can say mate

45 minutes ago, bolty58 said:

The usual typed form of verbal diarrhoea as expected. Not interested in entering in depth political discussions with the likes of you and the other big woke activist leftie bore on here whom you seem to admire.

'Able to articulate' Life's too fucking short.

Is this me?! I’m flattered 😘.

As usual when you’re rattled you resort to pseudo-intellectual gobbledygook and (inaccurate) name calling. Sad!

18 minutes ago, Dimron said:

Be careful what you wish for is all I can say mate

Let there be no doubt about what I wish for my friend. The obliteration of socialism and a melding of the centre right would be most agreeable.

8 minutes ago, bolty58 said:

Let there be no doubt about what I wish for my friend. The obliteration of socialism and a melding of the centre right would be most agreeable.

I’m 100% with you there……but your choice of words rules out Reform/Restore though?

Takes us back therefore to having a strong, credible Tory party with policies to support individual freedoms, enable social mobility and promote business growth whilst punishing criminals without fear or favour, and providing safety nets for those who need.

38 minutes ago, bolty58 said:

Let there be no doubt about what I wish for my friend. The obliteration of socialism and a melding of the centre right would be most agreeable.

Right of centre is most probably where I sit also but I have a pathological streak of suspicion in my psyche especially when it comes to politicians

12 hours ago, Sluffy said:

Well good for you, I'm pleased that you found a way that works for you.

Unfortunately most people these days live on their phones and clearly those in power around the world wants to control all the media we view, such as social media, Main Stream Media, TV, streaming, cable and everything else we view on,

The state is the main actor in autocratic countries such as Russia, China, Iran, and in the west by the very, very wealthy - think Musk with Twitter, Vance threating us to stop legislating against social media in respect of AI child pornography and such like - why because it effect the billionaire owners bottom lines.

An American friend of mine recently sent me this in respect of Trumps virtual take over of the control of US network broadcasting, streaming and the The Federal Communications Agency (FCC) - the government regulator.

First, blame the American television network, ABC (Disney), for capitulating and paying him off on a frivolous lawsuit. Then, the cowardly network, CBS, paid off for an even more frivolous (and legally losing) lawsuit. Thereafter, the cowardly billionaires of Oracle, the Ellisons, finalized their purchase of Paramount and CBS... with the blessings of the mafia Don himself. Months later, the same Ellisons are attempting to purchase Discovery and CNN. Netflix who had a bid accepted, somehow dropped out after a meeting with Trump, who obviously put his thumb on the scale. Without his approval, the take-over would be nixed. Unsurprisingly, Netflix dropped out, and surprise, the Ellisons announced they were the winners of this prize. Allegedly, the billionaires still needed Middle East oil money to consummate the deal. A long and winding road, and Joseph Goebbels would be proud of these fascist take-overs of the media. Along with Musk taking over X, and the Ellisons running CBS and CNN, there is Sinclair, which has purchased a total of 295 local stations. Surprise, they are a right-wing group as well. The overseer of the airwaves, the FCC, continues to change the ownership rules to favor Trump's favorites... in this case, the Sinclair network. At the same time, the Trump-appointed FCC boss has decided to try and take away the licenses from ABC stations, because comedian Jimmy Kimmel upset the mob boss. We are living in a universe where the inmates are running the asylum.

Democracy is going through a hard time these days unfortunately.

12 hours ago, Sluffy said:

Democracy is going through a hard time these days unfortunately.

Is our current form of democracy suitable for the world we are now living in?

Would something like Deliberative Democracy be better suited?

How would we introduce this in the current climate?

Looking foward to see the studies in coming years to see the damage the current incarnation of Social media has actually done. Seen it with my own eyes what used to be sound folk turned into hate riddled crackpots.

10 minutes ago, deeane Koontz said:

Looking foward to see the studies in coming years to see the damage the current incarnation of Social media has actually done. Seen it with my own eyes what used to be sound folk turned into hate riddled crackpots.

We need to remember that we're all just very easily manipulated apes. And social media does a fantastic job of tapping into those primal, chimp instincts and getting us to switch off our reasoning skills.

We're in danger of regressing as a species.

2 hours ago, bolty58 said:

In the light of what has been served up by the 'big two' over the last few decades it really is no shock as you say. Those two need decimating defeat.

I agree to a point, but if the big 2 are decimated, then that leaves no viable opposition - and we know that's bad, we know that from when recently both Labour and Tory have had landslide victories

At least you're now able to admit, that those you used to champion were also pretty useless

16 minutes ago, kent_white said:

We need to remember that we're all just very easily manipulated apes. And social media does a fantastic job of tapping into those primal, chimp instincts and getting us to switch off our reasoning skills.

We're in danger of regressing as a species.

We are.

Read 'Digital Minimalism' a few years back which was a real eye opener with regards to social media.

This was before "short form media" was everywhere. Can only imagine the damage that muck does not only with the content your mindlessly scrolling just on your basic concentration

Edited Thursday at 10:483 days by deeane Koontz

47 minutes ago, deeane Koontz said:

Looking foward to see the studies in coming years to see the damage the current incarnation of Social media has actually done. Seen it with my own eyes what used to be sound folk turned into hate riddled crackpots.

I binned someone from Facebook a couple of weeks ago.

The stuff they were spouting made my shit itch, especially so as they emigrated years ago after an "allegedly" successful criminal career over here.

They can get right to fuck

5 minutes ago, deeane Koontz said:

We are.

Read 'Digital Minimalism' a few years back which was a real eye opener with regards to social media.

This was before "short form media" was everywhere. Can only imagine the damage that muck does not only with the content your mindlessly scrolling just on your basic concentration

Some of us have forgotten how to think about things with nuance. Or have absolutely no doubt that we're absolutely right about things and that everyone who doesn't agree with them is the 'enemy'. And worryingly most people don't even realise they've fallen victim to it. Or think that they're somehow 'immune' to it. And that's really dangerous.

Edited Thursday at 10:573 days by kent_white

3 hours ago, gonzo said:

I keep stuff like whipped up narrative, algorithms and social media brainwashing folk in to thinking certain ways and vote for people.

It's as if these incidents aren't actually happening. It's as if there hasn't actually been Aslyum seekers trying to behead folk in the street or rafts of sexual assault and rape cases by men and boys from Afghanistan all over the country.

It's as if what the seems old news of Pakistani Muslim grooming gangs across the county haven't happened and this Nowark kid wasn't left to die in handcuffs after being stabbed by a man that was allowed to wander round with a ceremonial machete.

It's as if there isn't boats upon boat load of migrants being housed all over the country in HMOs, Hotels and housing schemes putting yet more strain on services.

You don't need algorithms and Tommy Robinson twitter accounts or GB News to see that these problems are happening in every day life.

Of course your Reforms and Restores will jump all over anything but that's how politicians work.

They wouldn't exist if the problems weren't allowed to sprial out of control by our two main parties over decades anyway.

Well you do really.

Good post mate, it must be to get the likes of Bolty and Bertie both to like it, that takes some doing, maybe even a first?

All that you say above is true.

But how did we happen to know about these things if someone doesn't tell us about them in the first place?

Ok beheadings and Muslim grooming gangs are headline news, the rest less so.

The last attempted beheading I heard about was that of Lee Rigby, that happened 12 years ago.

No beheadings should happen at all but one every 12 years tends to suggest it is more to do with people being fucked up in their head than because they were asylum seekers - (the killers of Lee Rigby were both British born citizens as was the Southport killer of the little girls).

Same with the Muslim grooming gangs - should never have happened but they did - not because the perpetrators were asylum seekers, they all were either British citizens or came to the UK legally, it seemed they happened because the authorities back then tended to see the girls as worthless slags.

Ms Rowbotham made hundreds of referrals detailing the abuse and sexual grooming while working for the NHS in Rochdale between 2005 and 2011.

She reported that girls as young as 13 were plied with drink and drugs, before men "passed them around" for sex.

She later told the Home Affairs Select Committee that her bosses had ignored repeated warnings about the girls being groomed.

Whistleblower who exposed Rochdale sex abuse ring gets MBE - BBC News

A landmark 2020 independent assurance review into Greater Manchester Police's (GMP) 2004 Operation Augusta—which investigated the sexual grooming of looked-after children—concluded that authorities "fell short" of protecting vulnerable youth

Institutional Failure: Many victims in the care of Manchester City Council were known to be subjected to abuse, but neither the police nor social services adequately protected them

Operation Augusta - House of Commons Library

I could go on but but what I am getting to is that although none of the stuff you highlight in your post should have happened, it did, not because the people who did them were immigrants (illegals or not), or Muslims, or ceremonial knife carrying Sikh's but because they are either mentally sick people or known about to the authorities and for whatever reasons, turned a blind eye towards.

Rapes, murders, violent assaults, crime in general happen daily in our society and are carried out by all sorts of ethnic and religious groupings which aren't highlighted and targeted but those of the rubber dingy visitors and our Muslim friends are signalled out and politically exploited to enrage a certain section of the electorate by right wing leading political groups looking to exploit the populist voters.

And to be fair they are doing an excellent job of doing so.

The problems aren't going to go away when they are in power - the Conservatives and Labour between them have tried for the last 16 years to deal with these issues and recycling failed Tory Ministers (indeed Farage's current political right hand man, Robert Jenrick was the Cabinet Minister of State for Immigration in the last Tory government) isn't the answer.

As always most people (including the illegals and/or Muslims) don't go around beheading, raping, child grooming etc, and even the small percentage that do (and yes, even those are far too many) the vast majority ARE NOT the illegals or Muslims - so ask yourself why the talk seems to be exclusively just about them?

Could it all just be about a means to an end perhaps?

5 hours ago, gonzo said:

I keep stuff like whipped up narrative, algorithms and social media brainwashing folk in to thinking certain ways and vote for people.

It's as if these incidents aren't actually happening. It's as if there hasn't actually been there hasn't actually been Aslyum seekers trying to behead folk in the street or rafts of sexual assault and rape cases by men and boys from Afghanistan all over the country.

It's as if what the seems old news of Pakistani Muslim grooming gangs across the county haven't happened and this Nowark kid wasn't left to die in handcuffs after being stabbed by a man that was allowed to wander round with a ceremonial machete.

It's as if there isn't boats upon boat load of migrants being housed all over the country in HMOs, Hotels and housing schemes putting yet more strain on services.

You don't need algorithms and Tommy Robinson twitter accounts or GB News to see that these problems are happening in every day life.

Of course your Reforms and Restores will jump all over anything but that's how politicians work.

They wouldn't exist if the problems weren't allowed to sprial out of control by our two main parties over decades anyway.

I get this, 100%, I do.
You know I do, but...

...there has been non-Aslyum seekers trying to behead folk in the street
...there has been rafts of sexual assault and rape cases by white men and boys all over the country.
...there has been white grooming gangs across the country
...there has been British men wandering around with machetes
...there are loads of Brits also being housed all over the country in HMOs, Hotels and housing schemes putting strain on services.

It's not solely down to migrants, but the cases involving migrants seem to attract far more publicity.

Why is that?

1 hour ago, Dimron said:

Is our current form of democracy suitable for the world we are now living in?

Would something like Deliberative Democracy be better suited?

How would we introduce this in the current climate?

Clearly not, just look at the US, in name it is a democracy, in practice it is not.

Democracy depends on three things that are all equal and all independent of each other an elected government, an elected parliament and an independent judiciary.

Trump as usurped the US parliament equivalent, and appointed the majority of the 'politicised' judges to US's ultimate court, (the Supreme Court) so in effect he can do what he likes - and that is dismantling democracy from within.

Can that happen here - yes it can and no doubt will if the right wing extremist political parties can manage to achieve an overwhelming mandate and enact legislation to keep them in power in perpetuity (that's basically what the likes of Putin and Erdogan have done in their respective country's).

I wouldn't imagine Deliberate Democracy would be able to work, most people these days tend to reject any type of authority and effectively disenfranchising millions of people on the basis they are too stupid to be trusted with a vote would not go down a treat with them, wouldn't you agree?

Fwiw I already believe we've gone past the tipping point, it's pretty clear to see that the majority of people reject Labour and Conservative and believe the right wing populist narrative - you know things like "vote for me and no tax on tips or overtime" (but I will take away your health care and social security benefits to give tax breaks to my billionaire mates) - type of thing.

Christ the leaders of Reform and Restore all have very iffy backgrounds, do people really believe they are going to make the country better for them, or rather as Trump is doing, better for themselves?

I just hope the corruption that will no doubt be coming our way will be too much for people to stomach and in time enough to vote them out (as they did with Orban in Hungry recently).

Not such a rosy picture really is it?

2 hours ago, Dimron said:

Is our current form of democracy suitable for the world we are now living in?

Would something like Deliberative Democracy be better suited?

How would we introduce this in the current climate?

Epistocracy is what we want, don't let thickos or poor people anywhere near any major decisions. Or we could, as the current system seems a bit shit, go for the Demarchy system, imagine, we could have @little whitt , @Spider or @gonzo running the place, what's the worst that could happen

5 minutes ago, Sluffy said:

Fwiw I already believe we've gone past the tipping point, it's pretty clear to see that the majority of people reject Labour and Conservative and believe the right wing populist narrative - you know things like "vote for me and no tax on tips or overtime" (but I will take away your health care and social security benefits to give tax breaks to my billionaire mates) - type of thing.

Christ the leaders of Reform and Restore all have very iffy backgrounds, do people really believe they are going to make the country better for them, or rather as Trump is doing, better for themselves?

I just hope the corruption that will no doubt be coming our way will be too much for people to stomach and in time enough to vote them out (as they did with Orban in Hungry recently).

as @Cheese has said, several times, if/when Reform get in, it's going to be most amusing watching them shit on the gullible thickos who will be responsible for voting them in. They're not even attempting to hide what they'll do, yet they'll still get votes.......in the hope it stops boat people coming in (which it won't)

35 minutes ago, Traf said:

I get this, 100%, I do.
You know I do, but...

...there has been non-Aslyum seekers trying to behead folk in the street
...there has been rafts of sexual assault and rape cases by white men and boys all over the country.
...there has been white grooming gangs across the country
...there has been British men wandering around with machetes
...there are loads of Brits also being housed all over the country in HMOs, Hotels and housing schemes putting strain on services.

It's not solely down to migrants, but the cases involving migrants seem to attract far more publicity.

Why is that?

Did the police and councils try and cover the white grooming gangs?

Was there video footage of the white folk trying to behead folk? (I personally believe footage of an event like that will always receive a different reaction)

The Brits being housed in hotels, HMOs etc, did they have to apply first? Maybe lived on the streets for a while before getting a place. Probably paid into the system as well.

I guess the majority of Brits expect people coming over here to be well behaved (as would most people from their respective countries) when you folk start coming in and start abusing the system and what they’ve been given it’s going to start pissing folk off.

That’s my opinion any road.