bwfc2003 Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 Just now, SilentBob said: It is, why would advertising boards need Internet? Or the big screen that would be able to be changed manually? Manually?? Its not the scoreboard off the bloody Railway Embankment!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benny The Ball Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 11 minutes ago, white noise said: Just had a read back of Howard’s posts and unless the situation has changed. He was adamant that they would take the shares today and register tomorrow. He also stated that once the deadline is reached and the shares reclaimed, KA can refuse to sign the shares over but cannot then liquidate, or sell the club on. The impasse would need to be dealt with by lawyers. However, KA is KA and we are vulnerable until shares are reclaimed. Tick Tock. Not quite sure what is meant by "Sign the Shares Over " my understanding is that the share transfer form in respect of Burnden Leisure together with KA's resignation letter as a director of Burnden Leisure are already signed but just not dated The signing of them was a condition of ED lending the £5 million The documents will be with ED trustees Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hughmungus Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 14 minutes ago, SilentBob said: It is, why would advertising boards need Internet? Or the big screen that would be able to be changed manually? Screens and Ad boards are from a different source, its all run by ADI from their main office, there was some generic screensaver stuff on the concourses that anyone can run off a usb stick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
white noise Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 Sorry Benny, just mean sanction the transfer or block it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Tonge moor green jacket Posted April 9, 2019 Site Supporter Share Posted April 9, 2019 I've been wondering: if nothing happens today or tomorrow, which wouldn't be a surprise, how does the club function to the season end (may8)? Assuming ken isnt paying money out, are the efl going to, particularly as there may be doubt as to whether they'd get it back. Surely, staff/players won't all stick it out putting games at risk? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentBob Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 2 minutes ago, hughmungus said: Screens and Ad boards are from a different source, its all run by ADI from their main office, there was some generic screensaver stuff on the concourses that anyone can run off a usb stick. Exactly, so why would Internet make them unusable like is being claimed? They don't need Internet connection to run the same few adds or for the score to be updated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwfcfan5 Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 Just now, Tonge moor green jacket said: I've been wondering: if nothing happens today or tomorrow, which wouldn't be a surprise, how does the club function to the season end (may8)? Assuming ken isnt paying money out, are the efl going to, particularly as there may be doubt as to whether they'd get it back. Surely, staff/players won't all stick it out putting games at risk? I suspect the EFL will do everything it can to let us limp on fulfill our fixtures and then leave us to rot..... The fact is that until the next court date there is nothing absolute stopping us from functioning. Which is a shame. Because this all needs drawing to a head somehow. If there are people out there biding their time they need flushing out. Otherwise we could be in this state for a long time. With players leaving an embargo in place, staff not being paid etc etc.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Tonge moor green jacket Posted April 9, 2019 Site Supporter Share Posted April 9, 2019 That's all well and good, but staff have already refused to work putting Millwall in doubt. Presumably they'll do the same again. At which point, do the efl say get fucked we're not doing it again. Will the players/coaching staff have fucked it off too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DLH Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 14 minutes ago, Chris Custodiet said: I'm not doubting what you've heard. But you don't need to be a big boy to see what Ken's trying to sell ain't worth a lot and if he has been trying to talk serious people into being stupid he's a lousy salesman and a damned fool. Has he driven serious people away because of that? I'm sorry but I'd take that with a pinch of salt. Anyone serious would, as you have acknowledged, know that he was running out of time and be ready to step in when all his options had evaporated. Maybe they will. We shall see. What I can see, much of it on the basis of Howard's evidence, is someone whose taken significant risk to his family's financial wellbeing to try to keep BWFC in business and turn a profit for himself. If the unspecified allegations of financial irregularities are true, he's taken an even bigger risk with his personal liberty with thousands on his case. When KA presided over the AGM last year, I wasn't at all convinced that all relevant questions had been asked but he dealt with those that were very competently. Does he behave differently with a different audience? Those that you know say he does. If I had been present I might know. As I wasn't I cannot really comment. Why would they not walk away? Let me give you a real life example, 5 weeks ago I went to a meeting with a business to discuss acquiring them, we (Me, the CEO and COO of the business I work for) had a figure in our heads of £2m max. 10 times EBITDA, well above average for the industry and not something they'd get close to unless they were dealing with one of our competitors, although our main competitors have stuff in the area so its unlikely they'd get close. The owners opening gambit was wanting £5m no less. we had a chat, pointed out a few home truths about the lack of certain information, unrealistic purchase price etc...etc... we proposed a decent bonus for them under certain conditions, would probably have put another £0.5m in his back pocket... The owner wouldn't move. We walked away, we move onto the next business opportunity in the area... We could have made £20-30 million in the next 18-24 months out of the business, but we can make £23-33m paying the right price... That's 10-15% difference in profit, so you walk away... We'll possibly buy one of the other local companies, probably make there owners millionaires, he loses out. As for the rest, feck me... he's put his family's financial wellbeing at risk? Didn't you say you worked for a private accountancy firm for 46 years?? I'm assuming you're on reception or something then? Everything in the public domain points to one thing, KA's mitigated all the risk from himself, and he's made a nice slice off the top in consultancy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwfcfan5 Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 1 minute ago, Tonge moor green jacket said: That's all well and good, but staff have already refused to work putting Millwall in doubt. Presumably they'll do the same again. At which point, do the efl say get fucked we're not doing it again. Will the players/coaching staff have fucked it off too? They've had their wages now - end of this month - that might rear its head again. But I think its only matchday staff who refused to work (the stewards etc) without pay. The staff/players could just strike to try and bring this to a head, but no doubt Ken and a few on here will be calling them all names under the sun in that scenario. I'm not sure how this situation can resolve itself whilst Ken has weeks ahead of himself and the time pressure isn't there.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DLH Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 (edited) 15 minutes ago, Benny The Ball said: Not quite sure what is meant by "Sign the Shares Over " my understanding is that the share transfer form in respect of Burnden Leisure together with KA's resignation letter as a director of Burnden Leisure are already signed but just not dated The signing of them was a condition of ED lending the £5 million The documents will be with ED trustees All on companies house website... there is a link about 20 pages back... its just getting him to date it which may create issues... Edited April 9, 2019 by DLH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Tonge moor green jacket Posted April 9, 2019 Site Supporter Share Posted April 9, 2019 I suppose the other consideration would be what if all staff just downed tools? If liquidation happens next month they're gone anyhow. In that event, the club doesn't fulfill its fixtures. In which case the efl wouldn't get their wish. Just looking for a way by which other authorities may have to look to pressure ken, even if it's by unofficial means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwfc2003 Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 2 minutes ago, DLH said: ll on companies house website... there is a link about 20 pages back... its just getting him to date it which may create issues... isnt it ED trustees that dates it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Tonge moor green jacket Posted April 9, 2019 Site Supporter Share Posted April 9, 2019 3 minutes ago, DLH said: All on companies house website... there is a link about 20 pages back... its just getting him to date it which may create issues... Won't moonshift be dating it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGBW Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 12 minutes ago, bwfcfan5 said: I suspect the EFL will do everything it can to let us limp on fulfill our fixtures and then leave us to rot..... The fact is that until the next court date there is nothing absolute stopping us from functioning. Which is a shame. Because this all needs drawing to a head somehow. If there are people out there biding their time they need flushing out. Otherwise we could be in this state for a long time. With players leaving an embargo in place, staff not being paid etc etc.... Actually, if he doesn't pay the players by the 14th they can walk -- so technically this could stop us from functioning before the end of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benny The Ball Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 Just now, DLH said: ll on companies house website... there is a link about 20 pages back... its just getting him to date it which may create issues... I dont see it that way - He - KA doesnt date it - Im sure its undated because in the event of a default ie non repayment , its then for ED trustees to date to effectively call in their security ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter RONNIE PHILLIPS Posted April 9, 2019 Site Supporter Share Posted April 9, 2019 Just now, BIGBW said: Actually, if he doesn't pay the players by the 14th they can walk -- so technically this could stop us from functioning before the end of the season. They can walk but they sure as hell can't run! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benny The Ball Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 Just now, BIGBW said: Actually, if he doesn't pay the players by the 14th they can walk -- so technically this could stop us from functioning before the end of the season. There is also a winding up petition against the Hotel due to be heard before end of April Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mounts Kipper Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 (edited) 8 minutes ago, bwfcfan5 said: They've had their wages now - end of this month - that might rear its head again. But I think its only matchday staff who refused to work (the stewards etc) without pay. The staff/players could just strike to try and bring this to a head, but no doubt Ken and a few on here will be calling them all names under the sun in that scenario. I'm not sure how this situation can resolve itself whilst Ken has weeks ahead of himself and the time pressure isn't there.... I don’t think players have had their wages which means they can walk from their contracts on the 14th April. If I was a Bolton player and my wages had not been paid I’d not play again and take up the option of signing elsewhere, also is it possible that once contract is broken by the club then they are also not insured. Edited April 9, 2019 by Mounts Kipper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Tonge moor green jacket Posted April 9, 2019 Site Supporter Share Posted April 9, 2019 Whether Howard was a wum or not, the shares will pass to moonshift soon, if no bidder. Unless there's something else you g on that we don't know about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwfcfan5 Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 1 minute ago, Mounts Kipper said: I don’t think players have had their wages which means they can walk from their contracts on the 14th April. If I was a Bolton player and my wages had not been paid I’d not play again and take up the option of signing elsewhere, also is it possible that once contract is broken by the club then they are also not insured. The players can walk - but I think they cannot sign anywhere else now till summer. So whilst some might walk - they'd all have to go to actually stop games going ahead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Tonge moor green jacket Posted April 9, 2019 Site Supporter Share Posted April 9, 2019 Just now, bwfcfan5 said: The players can walk - but I think they cannot sign anywhere else now till summer. So whilst some might walk - they'd all have to go to actually stop games going ahead. Which isn't inconceivable. They're very unlikely to be paid again, and most are out of contract anyhow soon. Depends just how pissed off they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantra Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 5 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said: Whether Howard was a wum or not, the shares will pass to moonshift soon, if no bidder. Unless there's something else you g on that we don't know about. Will they though? I thought H’s group bought the debt so that they could recall them. Davies family has little desire to call in the shares themselves and run the club until it can be sold, so I thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DLH Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 9 minutes ago, Benny The Ball said: I dont see it that way - He - KA doesnt date it - Im sure its undated because in the event of a default ie non repayment , its then for ED trustees to date to effectively call in their security ? Sorry I was thinking more the resignation letter... Surely KA needs to date that? I'd hazard a guess you're right in terms of the share recall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Steejay Posted April 9, 2019 Site Supporter Share Posted April 9, 2019 8 minutes ago, Mounts Kipper said: I don’t think players have had their wages which means they can walk from their contracts on the 14th April. If I was a Bolton player and my wages had not been paid I’d not play again and take up the option of signing elsewhere, also is it possible that once contract is broken by the club then they are also not insured. Mmmm, I wonder if the PFA might insure them though??? Also, not sure how the PFA paying the players works - maybe the PFA pay the players then the PFA become a creditor of the club? If that's the case, the players are guaranteed their wages & no reason not to play. I mean, the cheeky bastards, 'it's only three months they've been paid late'... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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