royal white Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 Where are they all? Since Clough and Kendall have we had any that regularly won trophies and why are so many failing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter RONNIE PHILLIPS Posted October 23, 2023 Site Supporter Share Posted October 23, 2023 I'll ask Sam Allardici 😁 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Lt. Aldo Raine Posted October 23, 2023 Members Share Posted October 23, 2023 It's because of the wealth of the PL and the reluctance of British coaches to accept offers from abroad The top six or seven can attract and afford to hire the best managers in the world and the best managers in the world tend to have experience of managing in the UCL The best of the British managers tend to manage in the bottom half of the PL at best because they won't move abroad and the big clubs won't often gamble on hiring them without experience of the kind of level they compete at Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Tonge moor green jacket Posted October 23, 2023 Site Supporter Share Posted October 23, 2023 Foreign managers often get top jobs. Maybe justifiably, but until an English chap gets one of the gigs, then we won't know. Maybe Newcastle might grab a cup this season? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Tonge moor green jacket Posted October 23, 2023 Site Supporter Share Posted October 23, 2023 Just now, Lt. Aldo Raine said: It's because of the wealth of the PL and the reluctance of British coaches to accept offers from abroad The top six or seven can attract and afford to hire the best managers in the world and the best managers in the world tend to have experience of managing in the UCL The best of the British managers tend to manage in the bottom half of the PL at best because they won't move abroad and the big clubs won't often gamble on hiring them without experience of the kind of level they compete at What makes you think they won't go abroad? Neville and Moyes did, and the experience hasn't necessarily boosted the latter's career. Palace manager been all over. For me, if they're managing in the PL, with all its money and top players, then there's an argument that they're in the best place already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DazBob Posted October 23, 2023 Members Share Posted October 23, 2023 36 minutes ago, royal white said: Where are they all? Since Clough and Kendall have we had any that regularly won trophies and why are so many failing? Eddie Howe is doing OK. Generally though, the 'big' clubs want to bring someone in who has CL experience and has won stuff, which tends to be managers from foreign leagues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Lt. Aldo Raine Posted October 23, 2023 Members Share Posted October 23, 2023 6 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said: What makes you think they won't go abroad? Neville and Moyes did, and the experience hasn't necessarily boosted the latter's career. Palace manager been all over. For me, if they're managing in the PL, with all its money and top players, then there's an argument that they're in the best place already. Because they don't The big clubs on the PL want to win the PL and the UCL - they aren't likely to hire a manager with no experience of competing in or competing to win those competitions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomski Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 3 minutes ago, DazBob said: Eddie Howe is doing OK. Generally though, the 'big' clubs want to bring someone in who has CL experience and has won stuff, which tends to be managers from farmers leagues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Lt. Aldo Raine Posted October 23, 2023 Members Share Posted October 23, 2023 British managers should try getting jobs at gateway clubs like Bayer Leverkusen or SC Braga and the like Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
royal white Posted October 23, 2023 Author Share Posted October 23, 2023 20 minutes ago, Lt. Aldo Raine said: It's because of the wealth of the PL and the reluctance of British coaches to accept offers from abroad The top six or seven can attract and afford to hire the best managers in the world and the best managers in the world tend to have experience of managing in the UCL The best of the British managers tend to manage in the bottom half of the PL at best because they won't move abroad and the big clubs won't often gamble on hiring them without experience of the kind of level they compete at We’ve had a few Jock ones. It’s English ones I’m on about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomski Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 5 minutes ago, royal white said: We’ve had a few Jock ones. It’s English ones I’m on about. Reckon a lot of it was wanking fergusons protégés off and they’ve all been a bit shit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Tonge moor green jacket Posted October 23, 2023 Site Supporter Share Posted October 23, 2023 5 minutes ago, Lt. Aldo Raine said: Because they don't The big clubs on the PL want to win the PL and the UCL - they aren't likely to hire a manager with no experience of competing in or competing to win those competitions They may well apply for jobs, we don't know. Might just not get them. As I said before though, why move if you're already in the best league? Pros and cons of being the best league as the money will attract the best playing and coaching talent from all over. Hodgson got the Liverpool job, but it didn't work out. Would be good if one or two more were given a chance maybe, but the PL especially is a multi national place now, and I'm not sure fans are really bothered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomski Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 (edited) Also I think this probably now is seeing the first generation who don’t need a second job and can’t be arsed with management. Who have played majority in the PL. I imagine some that have will manage but will be interesting if they’ve always earned top wedge since 16/17. Edited October 23, 2023 by tomski Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L/H White Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 1 minute ago, tomski said: Also I think this probably now is seeing the first generation who don’t need a second job and can’t be arsed with management Most seem to want to transfer into punditry now, will be top coin and not a full-time job like management. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Tonge moor green jacket Posted October 23, 2023 Site Supporter Share Posted October 23, 2023 2 minutes ago, tomski said: Also I think this probably now is seeing the first generation who don’t need a second job and can’t be arsed with management. Who have played majority in the PL. I imagine some that have will manage but will be interesting if they’ve always earned top wedge since 16/17. True. Few gone into sports management too- probably a lot less stressful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomski Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 1 minute ago, L/H White said: Most seem to want to transfer into punditry now, will be top coin and not a full-time job like management. Yep. Miles less hours, pays well etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Lt. Aldo Raine Posted October 23, 2023 Members Share Posted October 23, 2023 4 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said: They may well apply for jobs, we don't know. Might just not get them. As I said before though, why move if you're already in the best league? Pros and cons of being the best league as the money will attract the best playing and coaching talent from all over. Hodgson got the Liverpool job, but it didn't work out. Would be good if one or two more were given a chance maybe, but the PL especially is a multi national place now, and I'm not sure fans are really bothered. I don't believe they do, not least because it'd usually involve accepting a pay cut The reason for moving abroad is because in the PL, more than any other league, there are leagues within the league In Germany, Italy, Spain, France, Portugal, etc. there's at least one qualification spot for the UCL available to a fairly wide range of clubs In the PL, there are the big six (now seven) and the rest are also rans To get a job at a big club in England, a manager typically has to prove they can manage in the UCL or at the very least the Europa League Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frank_spencer Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 21 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said: Hodgson got the Liverpool job, but it didn't work out. Graham Potter had the same problem at Chelsea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deeane Koontz Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 Eddie Howe will win the treble at Newcastle this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Zico Posted October 23, 2023 Moderators Share Posted October 23, 2023 55 minutes ago, Lt. Aldo Raine said: British managers should try getting jobs at gateway clubs like Bayer Leverkusen or SC Braga and the like Didn't realise till the other day Xabi Alonso is in charge of Leverkusen and doing a great job (I knew they were doing well just not that he was manager) Anyway Arsenal are doing alright with a manager on his first gig And Spurs too with an Australian who's only ever managed in pub leagues Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Lt. Aldo Raine Posted October 23, 2023 Members Share Posted October 23, 2023 3 minutes ago, Zico said: Didn't realise till the other day Xabi Alonso is in charge of Leverkusen and doing a great job (I knew they were doing well just not that he was manager) Anyway Arsenal are doing alright with a manager on his first gig And Spurs too with an Australian who's only ever managed in pub leagues He's still managed in the UCL though 🙂 And to be fair, Celtic are one of the gateway clubs Arteta has previously played in the UCL and was part of the back room staff at City and that kind of thing matters Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc505 Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 4 minutes ago, Zico said: And Spurs too with an Australian who's only ever managed in pub leagues Still find it crazy that he was in charge of Melbourne when they played United in that world club championship in 2000. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Zico Posted October 23, 2023 Moderators Share Posted October 23, 2023 1 minute ago, Lt. Aldo Raine said: He's still managed in the UCL though 🙂 And to be fair, Celtic are one of the gateway clubs Arteta has previously played in the UCL and was part of the back room staff at City and that kind of thing matters Absolutely but his first season was shite and many clubs would've sacked him, Arsenal right to stick with him You're right about Celtic though, turned Brendan Rodgers into a winner and his record at Leicester subsequently was very good On the other hand, Steven Gerrard went a season unbeaten with Rangers but didn't really get him anywhere long term, maybe he will come back from SA with a point to prove that English guy is doing at alright at Reims and he doesn't even have a uefa licence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Casino Posted October 23, 2023 Moderators Share Posted October 23, 2023 As far as english managers go, theres only really clough, paisley and to a lesser degree, venables. Go on, you cN all tell me some obvious onez, ive missed, maybe robson? None of em had great careers, clough was obv unlucky - so i dont think its to do with players not going in to management Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
royal white Posted October 23, 2023 Author Share Posted October 23, 2023 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Casino said: As far as english managers go, theres only really clough, paisley and to a lesser degree, venables. Go on, you cN all tell me some obvious onez, ive missed, maybe robson? None of em had great careers, clough was obv unlucky - so i dont think its to do with players not going in to management Kendall during his decent Everton spell. Edited October 23, 2023 by royal white Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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