Politics

[Tonge moor green jacket]

4 minutes ago, Escobarp said:

If that’s the case then he should be hung out to dry. We are paying god knows how much for our reciprocal use of EU healthcare so we should claim every penny. It’s a travesty that we don’t have a system for it. 
 

it’s ok for someone lying in a Spanish hospital to be asked how they are paying for cover and to fill in forms for recharge but if we do this it’s wrong?

im sure it would outrage some snowflakes group somewhere and all be the fault of the Tories to claim back money we are legally owed and a protest would commence about it 

In the words one Mr Bowen; iiiiiiiiiiiiiin one.

Quite happy for Kent to get a rise on the back of it. When I popped in a few days ago to see the old chap, the nurses were all lovely.

Edited January 6, 2020 by Tonge moor green jacket

[kent_white]

1 minute ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

Therein is the problem- no id checks- why the fuck not?

These folk must have a passport or some such. Would it be beyond the realms of possibility for all health insurance policies to be accessible on a database?

When visitors arrive through customs- no insurance- no entry. Take a government one out there and then or turn round and back home.

 

That's a different issue. By the time someone gets to hospital - you can't refuse them treatment because they haven't got their wallet with them. And you'd have to do it with everybody - every drunk who turns up on a Saturday night, everyone who breaks their leg playing football, every old dear who's had a fall and is confused and can't remember her name. It's just not practical in the real world.

You could make a case for it in primary care in GP land - where you've a bit more time. 

[Tonge moor green jacket]

5 minutes ago, kent_white said:

That's a different issue. By the time someone gets to hospital - you can't refuse them treatment because they haven't got their wallet with them. And you'd have to do it with everybody - every drunk who turns up on a Saturday night, everyone who breaks their leg playing football, every old dear who's had a fall and is confused and can't remember her name. It's just not practical in the real world.

You could make a case for it in primary care in GP land - where you've a bit more time. 

How is it managed abroad?

Are they just less caring?

Is Kent a bit knackered from being brow beaten by us all? 😁

 

Edited January 6, 2020 by Tonge moor green jacket

[kent_white]

3 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

How is it managed abroad?

Are they just less caring?

 

I've no idea. Maybe they're having the same conversation on Bayern Munich ways

[Mounts Kipper]

10 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

How is it managed abroad?

Are they just less caring?

Is Kent a bit knackered from being brow beaten by us all? 😁

 

Quite right it’s utter bollocks that we don’t get the correct details and don’t charge overseas patients, no wonder were a target for health tourism, the rest of Europe insists on insurance details or payment up front, no wonder the nhs is a mess when our non collection of monies for treatment makes it much more likely that folk travel to use our services for free, and who suffers, our own folk who’ve paid in all their life’s. We’ve some weird thinking folk on here.

Edited January 6, 2020 by Mounts Kipper

[Casino]

When folk talk about being proud to be British, I'd have thought that us not asking mumbo jumbo from the Congo his name and bank details before we decide whether to save his kids life would be high on the list of things to be proud about

 

How much does using ambulances as taxis cost the NHS, I wonder

Now that does need stopping and would be much more easily done

[Casino]

1 minute ago, Mounts Kipper said:

We’ve some weird thinking folk on here.

Finally

He's got something right

[Tonge moor green jacket]

1 minute ago, Casino said:

When folk talk about being proud to be British, I'd have thought that us not asking mumbo jumbo from the Congo his name and bank details before we decide whether to save his kids life would be high on the list of things to be proud about

 

How much does using ambulances as taxis cost the NHS, I wonder

Now that does need stopping and would be much more easily done

See where you're coming from, but it's the national health service, not the international health service.

Not a case of being selective on life and death situations, but doing what's right for taxpayers.

[Mounts Kipper]

7 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

See where you're coming from, but it's the national health service, not the international health service.

Not a case of being selective on life and death situations, but doing what's right for taxpayers.

Don’t waste your breath he is one of those weird thinking folks, then try’s to justify his argument by using the most outlandish example to justifying collecting no money in every single case that occurs. 

Edited January 6, 2020 by Mounts Kipper

[Casino]

My knowledge of the NHS is at the GP end

A GP who has regular customers

Same faces, little if owt ailing them but in receipt of free prescriptions

I know there's no reason not to target professional health tourists, ambulance taxi types and prescription abusers all at once but I'd suggest some are easier to root out and more easily defended

Seriously, how many health professionals would want to work for a service where folk are turned away cos they can't afford care

[Escobarp]

1 minute ago, Casino said:

My knowledge of the NHS is at the GP end

A GP who has regular customers

Same faces, little if owt ailing them but in receipt of free prescriptions

I know there's no reason not to target professional health tourists, ambulance taxi types and prescription abusers all at once but I'd suggest some are easier to root out and more easily defended

Seriously, how many health professionals would want to work for a service where folk are turned away cos they can't afford care

Same sort of person who pays for holiday insurance because if we don’t they WILL get turned away or held in a hospital overseas until they pay what they owe maybe?

[Casino]

1 minute ago, Mounts Kipper said:

Don’t waste your breath he is one of those weird thinking folks, then try’s to justify his argument by using althe most outlandish example to justifying collecting no money in every single case that occurs. 

You really havent got a clue

Kent works day to day in the service as does my source and they could both tie you in knots with facts

Making shit up doesn't wash in the face of on the job experience

 

And if it's extreme, where do we draw the line

When does a scenario become extreme

 

[Tonge moor green jacket]

No one is saying turn folk away. One point that does arise, is, as I said above, if you want to come in, prove you have insurance or the requisite funds. If not, then bye bye.

How many that are here and treated can't actually afford to pay or have no cover?

[Mounts Kipper]

2 minutes ago, Casino said:

My knowledge of the NHS is at the GP end

A GP who has regular customers

Same faces, little if owt ailing them but in receipt of free prescriptions

I know there's no reason not to target professional health tourists, ambulance taxi types and prescription abusers all at once but I'd suggest some are easier to root out and more easily defended

Seriously, how many health professionals would want to work for a service where folk are turned away cos they can't afford care

They stop travelling if you use some common sense and turn non urgent cases away, every other nation in the world employs a system where money is collected, every European nation collects info so that money is claimed back from the patients home country, it’s not rocket science. 

[Casino]

Just now, Tonge moor green jacket said:

No one is saying turn folk away. One point that does arise, is, as I said above, if you want to come in, prove you have insurance or the requisite funds. If not, then bye bye.

How many that are here and treated can't actually afford to pay or have no cover?

Dunno

Say I have evidence of funds today, so I can come in

Then I'm admitted in 18 months, what's Kent supposed to do

Check for current insurance, refuse to treat, invoice as I leave. How do you get me to pay the invoice

Remember Kent doesn't mind the costs being chased up, he just says it's impractical

Granted, you don't tell him he's wrong, unlike some experts

[Mounts Kipper]

5 minutes ago, Casino said:

You really havent got a clue

Kent works day to day in the service as does my source and they could both tie you in knots with facts

Making shit up doesn't wash in the face of on the job experience

 

And if it's extreme, where do we draw the line

When does a scenario become extreme

 

I know what’s right and what’s wrong, encouraging health tourists at our expense is wrong, like I say some folk have a warped thought process. So we agree to disagree. 

Edited January 6, 2020 by Mounts Kipper

[Tonge moor green jacket]

1 minute ago, Casino said:

You really havent got a clue

Kent works day to day in the service as does my source and they could both tie you in knots with facts

Making shit up doesn't wash in the face of on the job experience

 

And if it's extreme, where do we draw the line

When does a scenario become extreme

 

Kent's view is from that of a medical professional. Presumably yours is too.

No one is arguing with that. It is a fact that we don't collect what we could when others do. That's an administrative issue and shouldn't affect the medical side of things if done well. Just run alongside.

It seems that much of this money wouldn't be difficult to collect (as in loads that have no means) but that it just isn't claimed.

Maybe start there first, and see where it gets us.

[Casino]

So we treat regardless, then invoice

I honestly don't see that working but I've no objection to it being tried

If I got a bill for 250k I'd be off to Spain with the other wasters 

[Tonge moor green jacket]

2 minutes ago, Casino said:

Dunno

Say I have evidence of funds today, so I can come in

Then I'm admitted in 18 months, what's Kent supposed to do

Check for current insurance, refuse to treat, invoice as I leave. How do you get me to pay the invoice

Remember Kent doesn't mind the costs being chased up, he just says it's impractical

Granted, you don't tell him he's wrong, unlike some experts

See previous post. Kent doesn't have to even think about it.

As for your 18 month thing. You're working presumably, so would be paying tax. No problems.

If you're not working, then maybe you've outstayed your time? Another problem there, but one for a different thread.

[Mounts Kipper]

Just now, Casino said:

So we treat regardless, then invoice

I honestly don't see that working but I've no objection to it being tried

If I got a bill for 250k I'd be off to Spain with the other wasters 

In Spain they make you take out insurance if your under retirement age and live there full time. 

[Guest]

42 minutes ago, kent_white said:

That 1p is on top of the money for the next 5 years. Don't forget it's been well underfunded for the best part of a decade so it's playing catch up. 

Like I said - if you can get the people from abroad to pay, in a way that doesn't cost more than they would recoup and doesn't interfere with patient care - then I'm all for it.

I'm sure the NHS has been looking at possibilities for years.

How can you tell it’s underfunded, when it can’t be funded to the possibility?

[Tonge moor green jacket]

2 minutes ago, Casino said:

So we treat regardless, then invoice

I honestly don't see that working but I've no objection to it being tried

If I got a bill for 250k I'd be off to Spain with the other wasters 

That's what is essentially should be happening now. Just not claiming it back in many cases according to reports. A lack of consistency in approach, and if its being left to medical staff to sort it, then that is truly bollocks.

[Escobarp]

Thing that folk are missing is yeah we will get some People who Give false details and we can’t claim back. But a lot won’t. But we choose not to claim back at all and one of the reasons given for this is how do we get details. 

just ask. Most will happily give them. It’s free why wouldn’t they unless they are criminals on the run or something (eu citizens I’m on about) 

[Not in Crawley]

1 hour ago, Mounts Kipper said:

Im not doing an extra day for no one. 😂

Do you try to go through life ill informed, or does it just come naturally? I’m genuinely interested. 

[Mounts Kipper]

Just now, Not in Crawley said:

Do you try to go through life ill informed, or does it just come naturally? I’m genuinely interested. 

It was a joke. 

Edited January 6, 2020 by Mounts Kipper