Moderators Casino Posted February 15, 2023 Moderators Share Posted February 15, 2023 7 minutes ago, London Wanderer said: Knife crime is rife… sad, sad times. Traumatised kids killing other kids. Often wonder how the parents exercise restraint 20 years later when the perpetrator is walking free. Not sure I could do it. What do you know? I just assumed they were wrong uns Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter MickyD Posted February 15, 2023 Site Supporter Share Posted February 15, 2023 2 minutes ago, Casino said: What do you know? I just assumed they were wrong uns @London Wanderer, you aren’t in Child Social Services are you? Making excuses for knife crime seems to fit their MO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Wanderer Posted February 15, 2023 Share Posted February 15, 2023 (edited) 12 hours ago, MickyD said: @London Wanderer, you aren’t in Child Social Services are you? Making excuses for knife crime seems to fit their MO. Not making excuses for anyone, read the rest of my post. I am working with child social services this year as it happens. Took a secondment from teaching to work with a charity and we’re in a multi agency team with social work and ed psyches. The vast, vast majority of murders are committed by people who are fucked up in their own turn. My guess is that those fuckers who stabbed her aren’t happily raised kids with a rational thinking brain. Or as @Casino puts it, wrong uns. If we can break the cycle then we’re onto a winner, seems we’re only going backwards though. Edited February 16, 2023 by London Wanderer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter MickyD Posted February 15, 2023 Site Supporter Share Posted February 15, 2023 46 minutes ago, London Wanderer said: Not making excuses for anyone, read the rest of my post. I am working with child social services this year as it happens. Took a secondment from teaching to work with Children1st and we’re in a multi agency team with social work and ed psyches. The vast, vast majority of murders are committed by people who are fucked up in their own turn. My guess is that those fuckers who stabbed her aren’t happily raised kids with a rational thinking brain. Or as @Casino puts it, wrong uns. If we can break the cycle then we’re onto a winner, seems we’re only going backwards though. So the answer was yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underpants Posted February 15, 2023 Share Posted February 15, 2023 52 minutes ago, London Wanderer said: Not making excuses for anyone, read the rest of my post. I am working with child social services this year as it happens. Took a secondment from teaching to work with Children1st and we’re in a multi agency team with social work and ed psyches. The vast, vast majority of murders are committed by people who are fucked up in their own turn. My guess is that those fuckers who stabbed her aren’t happily raised kids with a rational thinking brain. Or as @Casino puts it, wrong uns. If we can break the cycle then we’re onto a winner, seems we’re only going backwards though. I'm thinking the cycle is as almost impossible to break. There are layers and layers of issues that need addressing before a knife even gets into a hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Wanderer Posted February 15, 2023 Share Posted February 15, 2023 9 minutes ago, MickyD said: So the answer was yes. 😂 I’ve read some shite on here and I’m sure I’ve posted plenty myself… but social workers making excuses for knife crime is up there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Wanderer Posted February 15, 2023 Share Posted February 15, 2023 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Underpants said: I'm thinking the cycle is as almost impossible to break. There are layers and layers of issues that need addressing before a knife even gets into a hand. I’ve seen it broken, it can be done. For personal reasons I find it very difficult to sit back and accept that these sorts of crimes can’t be massively reduced with a more trauma-informed society and institutions. And yes I’m aware how hippy dippy that sounds. There will always be people that need to stay inside indefinitely. Id even go as far as to question why we waste money keeping them alive in prison once the utter devastation has been caused. If it’s proven beyond doubt, then in cases like this where there’s no going back, I’d rather see the money reinvested in youth services. Edited February 15, 2023 by London Wanderer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underpants Posted February 15, 2023 Share Posted February 15, 2023 (edited) 10 minutes ago, London Wanderer said: I’ve seen it broken, it can be done. For personal reasons I find it very difficult to sit back and accept that these sorts of crimes can’t be massively reduced with a more trauma-informed society and institutions. And yes I’m aware how hippy dippy that sounds. There will always be people that need to stay inside indefinitely. Id even go as far as to question why we waste money keeping them alive in prison once the utter devastation has been caused. If it’s proven beyond doubt, then in cases like this where there’s no going back, I’d rather see the money reinvested in other youth services. Do not get me going on proven beyond doubt claptrap. Every fucker in jail are there because it's been proven. Anyway, back to the point. You say the knife crime issue can be sorted. Why hasn't it been done? You said we seem to be going backwards. Edited February 15, 2023 by Underpants Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter MickyD Posted February 16, 2023 Site Supporter Share Posted February 16, 2023 7 hours ago, Underpants said: Do not get me going on proven beyond doubt claptrap. Every fucker in jail are there because it's been proven. Anyway, back to the point. You say the knife crime issue can be sorted. Why hasn't it been done? You said we seem to be going backwards. https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/i-served-17-years-jail-20476869 Proved incorrectly in some rare cases. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gonzo Posted February 16, 2023 Share Posted February 16, 2023 Boxing/Self Defence should be part of the school curriculum. A lot of Kids carry weapons through fear. Take the fear away, you may remove some of the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
royal white Posted February 16, 2023 Share Posted February 16, 2023 49 minutes ago, gonzo said: Boxing/Self Defence should be part of the school curriculum. A lot of Kids carry weapons through fear. Take the fear away, you may remove some of the problem. And sprinting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Wanderer Posted February 16, 2023 Share Posted February 16, 2023 10 hours ago, Underpants said: Do not get me going on proven beyond doubt claptrap. Every fucker in jail are there because it's been proven. Anyway, back to the point. You say the knife crime issue can be sorted. Why hasn't it been done? You said we seem to be going backwards. Fair enough It can be reduced, but we’re never going to live in a crime free eutopia. But it has been done in other countries and has been reduced here before. i think you need a mix of tougher sentencing and investment in early intervention. Huge problems in the care system that also need addressing. It’s no coincidence that schools have had big cuts to pastoral staff and knife crime has risen. Reality is you’ve got some people growing up in the wrong environment that won’t get the support they need to act rationally. Neglect and abuse changes the wiring in your brain. So not giving a shit about another life is actually a normal response from someone who has experienced abuse. We can decide as a society what we do with these people. Most can recover from adverse childhood if they’ve a supportive role model they can trust. Either we don’t invest, blame the parents and naively assume some people can’t be helped. Or we invest in early intervention. I know which one will reduce crime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underpants Posted February 16, 2023 Share Posted February 16, 2023 3 hours ago, MickyD said: https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/i-served-17-years-jail-20476869 Proved incorrectly in some rare cases. That's my point. The justice system will never be 100% correct. Anyone who thinks different is a fool Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underpants Posted February 16, 2023 Share Posted February 16, 2023 5 minutes ago, London Wanderer said: Fair enough It can be reduced, but we’re never going to live in a crime free eutopia. But it has been done in other countries and has been reduced here before. i think you need a mix of tougher sentencing and investment in early intervention. Huge problems in the care system that also need addressing. It’s no coincidence that schools have had big cuts to pastoral staff and knife crime has risen. Reality is you’ve got some people growing up in the wrong environment that won’t get the support they need to act rationally. Neglect and abuse changes the wiring in your brain. So not giving a shit about another life is actually a normal response from someone who has experienced abuse. We can decide as a society what we do with these people. Most can recover from adverse childhood if they’ve a supportive role model they can trust. Either we don’t invest, blame the parents and naively assume some people can’t be helped. Or we invest in early intervention. I know which one will reduce crime. It's a tough task. I remember a number of years ago Glasgow had major issues with knife crime. They managed to reduce their problem by quiet a bit by using a different approach. Maybe the world has changed and that approach isn't as effective now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Wanderer Posted February 16, 2023 Share Posted February 16, 2023 2 hours ago, gonzo said: Boxing/Self Defence should be part of the school curriculum. A lot of Kids carry weapons through fear. Take the fear away, you may remove some of the problem. Would be great to see. Also teaches young people to swallow pride when necessary and not go looking for conflict. How many road accidents, shootings, stabbings etc. are caused when people can’t lose face and let something go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
royal white Posted February 16, 2023 Share Posted February 16, 2023 I’ve just seen the video of last weeks stabbing in LH. Little fucker about 16/17 with a rambo knife straight into another lads neck. A couple of mil the other way and he would be dead. There was another bad incident in LL and I’m sure I heard somewhere someone was stabbed and died in leigh? All in the space of a week and a few miles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duck Egg Posted February 16, 2023 Share Posted February 16, 2023 6 hours ago, royal white said: And sprinting. I know you jest but I recall someone a few years ago advocating just that. Apparently, in several of the stabbing incidents they'd looked at, the victims were still trying to defend themselves, talk the situation down or only realised too late the danger they were in, rather than just get the hell away from the situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
royal white Posted February 16, 2023 Share Posted February 16, 2023 14 minutes ago, Duck Egg said: I know you jest but I recall someone a few years ago advocating just that. Apparently, in several of the stabbing incidents they'd looked at, the victims were still trying to defend themselves, talk the situation down or only realised too late the danger they were in, rather than just get the hell away from the situation. I’m being 100% serious. I’ve already drilled it into my kids if anyone starts on you leg it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gonzo Posted February 16, 2023 Share Posted February 16, 2023 Reckon we all just need more knives. Give everyone knives to carry in little holsters and it will deter folk from getting theirs out. Every classroom should be armed to the teeth with knives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traf Posted February 16, 2023 Share Posted February 16, 2023 1 hour ago, gonzo said: Reckon we all just need more knives. Give everyone knives to carry in little holsters and it will deter folk from getting theirs out. Every classroom should be armed to the teeth with knives. Don't be so stupid. You can't deflect a bullet with a knife. You need to give them all guns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweep Posted February 16, 2023 Share Posted February 16, 2023 2 minutes ago, Traf said: Don't be so stupid. You can't deflect a bullet with a knife. You need to give them all guns. I bet I can, I've got well quick reactions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traf Posted February 16, 2023 Share Posted February 16, 2023 1 minute ago, Sweep said: I bet I can, I've got well quick reactions Yeah, but you're the exception to the rule. Those reactions are why you're UKs #2 tennis player Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Casino Posted February 16, 2023 Moderators Share Posted February 16, 2023 9 hours ago, royal white said: I’ve just seen the video of last weeks stabbing in LH. Little fucker about 16/17 with a rambo knife straight into another lads neck. A couple of mil the other way and he would be dead. There was another bad incident in LL and I’m sure I heard somewhere someone was stabbed and died in leigh? All in the space of a week and a few miles Leigh is the girl this thread was started about Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
royal white Posted February 16, 2023 Share Posted February 16, 2023 17 minutes ago, Casino said: Leigh is the girl this thread was started about This is different I think? https://www.leighjournal.co.uk/news/23312009.stabbing-suspect-incident-leigh---victim-hospital/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Casino Posted February 16, 2023 Moderators Share Posted February 16, 2023 34 minutes ago, royal white said: This is different I think? https://www.leighjournal.co.uk/news/23312009.stabbing-suspect-incident-leigh---victim-hospital/ My apologies Wtf is going on Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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