Why are we not bombing the fuck out of this lot with the yanks? I can understand why the Commons voted against not to get involved with the Syria thing. But this is different. If anyone needs blasting to fuck it's these cunts.

 If your first reaction when you look at something like that is to question the source or worry that this will give the 'wets' something more to whinge about - then I reckon you need to give your humanity a reboot.

 

Spot On Kent 

Nah, all the thousands that have died are all adult combatants in clean kills.

 

 

Does your anguish over the thousands that have died include Shi'ites murdered by Sunni's and vice versa plus those who die in attacks by Hizbollah and the like or only those killed by Israeli counter attacks, 'western' bombing or by the various and nefarious means of the Syrian government and its major ally?

What a sad state of affairs. People shouldn't use stuff like this to push their point or beliefs.

Sometimes an image hits you and stays with you

 

 

The only bit that registered with me. The rest appears to be what a party political broadcast would sound like from Amnesty International.

 

The media love images like this and of the kid in the Med etc. They gorge on bad news and this is as bad as it gets. If however you think that this image will change the resolve of the Syrian government one iota then you are in dreamland. Sympathise away but it won't change anything that's happening there. There will be millions of such images that you could have seen that haven't been recorded.

 

So when you say 'we should be trying to help', in what way? Accepting refugees by any chance? Hopefully, the whole of Europe is now awake to the perils of such policies.

So when you say 'we should be trying to help', in what way? Accepting refugees by any chance? Hopefully, the whole of Europe is now awake to the perils of such policies.

Well - partly by seeking to find political solutions to problems instead of chucking bombs and weapons at them. Which is what I and many people like me have been arguing for at least the last decade. Or maybe longer. The problem with that is - you keep flinging munitions around and it gets harder and harder to even imagine reaching those agreements. I broadly supported the second Iraq war and having seen the consequences - my worldview changed.

 

In answer to your other point - the moment we started launching air strikes in Syria we had a humanitarian obligation toward the people who were having their lives destroyed (if we didn't have one already) - with all the problems and potential risks that that entails. If we weren't prepared to deal with those consequences - then we shouldn't have got involved.

 

This hell is ultimately only going to be solved by the peacemakers, and I reject the notion that you can shoot your way to a lasting peace.

I agree that political solutions are ideal; unfortunately it seems that by their very nature 'political' means are secondary to or governed by religion or an interpretation of it. Not too long ago we had Christianity trying to thrust itself upon others and behaving in shocking ways. Not too sure theirs much we can do other than give them time to mature for a few hundred years.

Edited August 19, 20169 yr by Tonge moor green jacket

Does your anguish over the thousands that have died include Shi'ites murdered by Sunni's and vice versa plus those who die in attacks by Hizbollah and the like or only those killed by Israeli counter attacks, 'western' bombing or by the various and nefarious means of the Syrian government and its major ally?

I have no idea what the fuck you are on about. My concern is for innocent kids of any extraction, if that's allowed?

 

 

This hell is ultimately only going to be solved by the peacemakers, and I reject the notion that you can shoot your way to a lasting peace.

 

But they used a big fuck off bomb in japan and not a peep of trouble from them since.. 

 

Just give Assad what he wants, the talking heads were right about iraq war 2 being a fuck up , So do what they claimed would be best (ie , just leave him in) this time and it'll work out.

 

Won't it ?

Edited August 19, 20169 yr by e2e4

I have no idea what the fuck you are on about. My concern is for innocent kids of any extraction, if that's allowed?

No you're not allowed to express sympathy or anguish without having an ulterior political motive.

 

You're not allowed to say the bombing should stop or the refugees should be helped without saying borders should be opened and we should allow isis to reign supreme.

 

Whatever the fuck is going on, it needs to stop.

 

Whatever the fuck is going on, it needs to stop.

Bed Wetter

I think a few forget that it's only luck that their kids and grandkids aren't today's collateral damage

 

 

I can live with innocents getting killed as part of a bigger picture, sometimes needs must

 

As for the question of refugees who turn out to be terrorists, aye some will

 

I bet their victims are a fraction of the number of innocents killed and maimed just cos they were unlucky to be born in a war zone

 

I don't expect to change minds, I just console myself that my heads not warped

No you're not allowed to express sympathy or anguish without having an ulterior political motive.

 

You're not allowed to say the bombing should stop or the refugees should be helped without saying borders should be opened and we should allow isis to reign supreme.

 

Whatever the fuck is going on, it needs to stop.

We can stop.

 

We can leave our consciences clear.

 

We can pull out and leave them to it.

 

We can also leave "them" to commit genocide and let them take world to the stone age.

 

There is no easy solution and as terrible the photo is it creates more questions than answers.

 

Or we can leave them to their own devices if it helps us sleep better.

Edited August 19, 20169 yr by Smiffs

Well - partly by seeking to find political solutions to problems instead of chucking bombs and weapons at them. Which is what I and many people like me have been arguing for at least the last decade. Or maybe longer. The problem with that is - you keep flinging munitions around and it gets harder and harder to even imagine reaching those agreements. I broadly supported the second Iraq war and having seen the consequences - my worldview changed.

 

In answer to your other point - the moment we started launching air strikes in Syria we had a humanitarian obligation toward the people who were having their lives destroyed (if we didn't have one already) - with all the problems and potential risks that that entails. If we weren't prepared to deal with those consequences - then we shouldn't have got involved.

 

This hell is ultimately only going to be solved by the peacemakers, and I reject the notion that you can shoot your way to a lasting peace.

Mate you can't negotiate with people who no matter what, see anyone who isn't a Muslim as a kuffar.

 

They don't want to negotiate. And no amount of peace pipes and cuddles will change their opinions.

 

It's fucked!!

Edited August 19, 20169 yr by Smiffs

I have no idea what the fuck you are on about. My concern is for innocent kids of any extraction, if that's allowed?

 

 

No surprise but it appears that Tonge Moor Green Jacket and Smiffs got it.

 

You are one of the rule makers on here matey so pointless asking me what is and isn't allowed.

Whatever the fuck is going on, it needs to stop.

 

 

We don't disagree on this point, no matter how much of an impossible goal that really is, but the point I was trying to make was that emotionally charged photo's in the media garnering massive outpourings of sympathy do not stop these atrocities.

 

You will be too young to remember but I give you the most iconic of all time - just Google Phan Thi Kim Phuc Oont. These media highlights have been around since will before 1972 and napalm.

 

Seems some minds on here are roughly aligned with mine. Leave the tyrants in place in the Middle East and let them work their way through a few centuries of development. Keeps the trouble generally within their own borders unless we stick our oar in. Their hatred of each other will keep the numbers down and maybe our TV screens needn't be filled with the results.

I watched an episode of top gear the other day on Dave. Was about 5 years old but all 3 of those smug gobshites managed to drive across the length of Syria and the worst thing that happened was that the old one bumped his head.

 

That's as much as I can think to contribute here. This whole shitstorm has been going on in one way or another for a thousand years, it's not going to stop now, not by talking, not by bombing, not by showing pictures of kids who simply don't deserve it.

 

If I had to make a decision from a British point of view, then we'd all be fucked because I think I'd just napalm the entire area. Unless I'd just had a wank, in which case I'd do a big leaflet drop asking everyone to just be nice to each other.

It seems the last paragraph is indeed the best way forward. We've intervened previously in many places, and sometimes with little succes, even if its with the best of intentions. Latterly, our willingness to help people has become a poisoned chalice too many ungrateful individuals using it against us.

When we do go in many say we shouldn't. If we don't others say we're shirking responsibilities.

Now time to realise we should look after ourselves primarily; if others want to learn then fine we'll help. If not fine, go your own way but keep your shite inside your own borders.

 

Frankly fed up of images of suffering continually on the screen. We know its reality but so it the Olympics and a refreshing change it is to behold. Not sure I want my lad growing up constantly bombarded with " bad stuff" to the extent where he begins to feel some sort of guilt or responsibility.

There are decent human beings out there son, be one yourself, stick with them and enjoy life.

If we intervene, it's all our fault...if we don't intervene, it's all our fault.

 

People whose lives are governed by a backward, medieval religion will continue to behave in a backward, medieval way & unless they are prepared to progress into more civilised, tolerant & (especially) secular societies, there is little that we can do except to try to limit the damage by backing the least worst options.

tiinfoil hat twitter reckons the dude that took the photo of the boy with concrete on him is the same dude that took a selfie with some (anti-assad?) rebels that cut the head off a boy (palestinian migrant/refugee in syria ?) sometime last month.

 

https://twitter.com/walid970721/status/766599938155417601/

 

he's wearing a blue shirt in both pics , not looked if its a "..This Looks Shopped" or not , but the shirt's super blue, and the bottom left is a super vulnerable empty place to add the guy in, but the thread goes on with more pics different shirts and headbands.

 

some kinda propaganda from someone. I can't really figure it out, might be infighting or summat.

 

And i just get reminded of some alternate history books like Camp of the Saints or the Last Article or that episode of Star Trek with Joan Collins in.

 

it'll get memory holed if the kid or the photographer is part of some militia somewheres and maybe have to give his pulitzer prize back

 

[sarc/notsarc]Probably all got german passports too

 

:/

Edited August 20, 20169 yr by e2e4

Grim...

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-37147717

Another high ranking IS brainwashed goes to meet the invisible man in the sky, good riddance......

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-37224570

http://news.sky.com/story/is-torture-cells-for-women-discovered-by-rebel-fighters-in-syria-10561503

 

Looks a right hoot in here

Seems some minds on here are roughly aligned with mine. Leave the tyrants in place in the Middle East and let them work their way through a few centuries of development. Keeps the trouble generally within their own borders unless we stick our oar in. Their hatred of each other will keep the numbers down and maybe our TV screens needn't be filled with the results.

 

I'm more usually roughly aligned with kent_white on issues like this but I constantly find myself pulled towards Bolty's views with each sickening atrocity/find

 

That report the other day Bolty where they found 72 mass graves containing 15,000 bodies means I can't just believe that we can leave them to it. The innocents just get slaughtered. I have no idea what the answer is though but sadly I don't think that kent's solution of leaving it to peacemakers would ever work either. ISIS have one view, and one view only, and they are never going to listen to any rational solution

http://news.sky.com/story/is-torture-cells-for-women-discovered-by-rebel-fighters-in-syria-10561503

 

Looks a right hoot in here

 

 

photoshop

photoshop

is that the photos of the torture cells or the people cutting off their beards and throwing off their burkas?