(That long since we've had any, couldn't find the thread)

Alan Nixon: "Top Liverpool starlet Cameron Branagan will Ben allowed out on loan in Jan.

Bolton lead the race for the 20 year old midfielder"

Edited December 11, 20169 yr by Ratwhite

23 minutes ago, Roger_Dubuis said:

Does the German Charity Sheild count  as a real trophy?  I know when Liverpool supporters are doing their lists of which club in England has won the most trophies they don't include the Charity Shield for some reason

it's more than he's ever won at Spurs

It is an absolute that a player is only worth what someone pays for him.

A club can ask for more, put out a large valuation, but that's meaningless if no one pays it.

However, that is monetary value- a player can be worth a heck of a lot to a parent club in different ways.

1 hour ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

It is an absolute that a player is only worth what someone pays for him.

A club can ask for more, put out a large valuation, but that's meaningless if no one pays it.

However, that is monetary value- a player can be worth a heck of a lot to a parent club in different ways.

What about players who are top class but stay at one club, like maldini or Gerrard or scholes or Muller 

Or players who don't command transfer fees because they leave on frees 

Like messi 

Or lampard 

Etc 

Contacts and circumstances can inflate or deflate prices but it's possible to look at a fee and relative to similar players or transfers know whether it seems like a good deal, or not 

£1m for Thomasson would be a great deal for us, especially compared to Dapo who went for 500k

We might accept a bid of 750k for Santos, if we need the cash

What about them?

If no one buys them, then, as I said, their worth is only to the parent club. Monetary value is only decided once sold.

A free transfer is something entirely different, and is often a thank you to the player by the club, but is still reflective of the fact they're not really wanted any more.

1 minute ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

What about them?

You can assign them a monetary value as to what they'd be worth in the transfer market at any given time 

Eg 

Messi in his prime would've been worth £100m

Just because no one bought him doesn't mean that's not what he would've been worth 

Every Bolton fan was amazed we got £8m for Madine, because he wasn't worth £8m 

Rob Holding was an absolute steal at £2.5m, compared to other players making moves at the time, he was worth more than that, but we were desperate to sell at the time 

Etc 

As for frees 

kane could've decided to see out his contract 

Like Zaha did at palace, who were offering him 200k a week to stay  

 

4 hours ago, Roger_Dubuis said:

Does the German Charity Sheild count  as a real trophy?  I know when Liverpool supporters are doing their lists of which club in England has won the most trophies they don't include the Charity Shield for some reason

Rags have never won it.

Sounds like he's off to me

31 minutes ago, Zico said:

You can assign them a monetary value as to what they'd be worth in the transfer market at any given time 

Eg 

Messi in his prime would've been worth £100m

Just because no one bought him doesn't mean that's not what he would've been worth 

Every Bolton fan was amazed we got £8m for Madine, because he wasn't worth £8m 

Rob Holding was an absolute steal at £2.5m, compared to other players making moves at the time, he was worth more than that, but we were desperate to sell at the time 

Etc 

As for frees 

kane could've decided to see out his contract 

Like Zaha did at palace, who were offering him 200k a week to stay  

 

Not sure what your point is. Are you saying we should let Thomason go for less because he's not worth what they're offering in your opinion?

Edited August 12, 20232 yr by Cheese

8 minutes ago, Cheese said:

Not sure what your point is. Are you saying we should let Thomason go for less because he's not worth what they're offering?

So when we sold Curcic and Thompson for the standard £4.5m did you never think they are worth more than that simply on the basis of that's what we accepted?

6 for Cahill 

7 minutes ago, Cheese said:

Not sure what your point is. Are you saying we should let Thomason go for less because he's not worth what they're offering in your opinion?

why would anyone ever say that?

I don't think he's worth £1m when we consider we got £500k for dapo

I'd be happy with that as a deal as I don't expect him to start much for us 

My point is, you can look at a player and consider what good market value would be for them, and not just go off their transfer fee, if indeed they even have one

20 minutes ago, L/H White said:

Sounds like he's off to me

Agreed - Evatt only talks about something when it’s going to happen. If the club are happy with the bid then I can’t see Thomason turning down the chance to move up to the Champ.

Fair play to the lad, it’s some rise from where we got him from and clearly Bristol see something in him. Personally I just don’t see it, even today when he came on I just don’t think he looks comfortable on the ball and he’s probably our 5/6th choice centre mid which suggests Evatt rates a number of our current players higher. He might go on to become a cracking player, he has improved a lot and is only 22 (although I don’t think that puts him in the ‘youngster’ category that others seem to think it does).

Having said all that, if you’d have said that we’d get £200k for Thomason this summer then I’d have been elated - £1m (although I’d imagine it’s nowhere near that up front) is bonkers! Good luck to the lad but it’s a seriously good deal for us in my opinion. 

6 minutes ago, Zico said:

why would anyone ever say that?

I don't think he's worth £1m when we consider we got £500k for dapo

I'd be happy with that as a deal as I don't expect him to start much for us 

My point is, you can look at a player and consider what good market value would be for them, and not just go off their transfer fee, if indeed they even have one

If Bristol buy him, he's worth whatever they pay. Simple as that. There is literally no other way you can value a player. We've sold players for more and less than we "think" they're worth, but their value is determined by the transaction.

We've signed a lad from Luton and another on loan from Brentford. Neither are getting in the first eleven, but I don't think that means they're not good enough, as I don't with Thomason.

Weird, as I think he is comfortable with the ball, but he prefers to move it quite quickly. He's not going to dribble round loads of players, but then again none of our midfield three do. They may drop a shoulder and ease beyond an opponent etc, and that's part of their make up, as is Thomason's willingness to run hard, get it back and get the transition underway. 

Horses for courses.

Be interesting to see who plays in the next home games.

20 minutes ago, Eddie said:

don’t think he looks comfortable on the ball and he’s probably our 5/6th

Don’t think you have watched him properly if you think he isn’t comfortable on the ball 

9 minutes ago, Farnywhite said:

Don’t think you have watched him properly if you think he isn’t comfortable on the ball 

By properly, do you mean with my eyes half shut or something?

All about opinions and I don’t expect everyone to agree with me, but you fire a ball into Sheehan 10 times when he’s got a few opposition players around him, then do the same with Thomason - the difference in outcome would be stark.

28 minutes ago, Cheese said:

If Bristol buy him, he's worth whatever they pay. Simple as that. There is literally no other way you can value a player. We've sold players for more and less than we "think" they're worth, but their value is determined by the transaction.

I agree with you. Value and worth are two different things

Folk can argue worth all day long. It's an opinion. Value is what two clubs agree on

22 minutes ago, Eddie said:

By properly, do you mean with my eyes half shut or something?

All about opinions and I don’t expect everyone to agree with me, but you fire a ball into Sheehan 10 times when he’s got a few opposition players around him, then do the same with Thomason - the difference in outcome would be stark.

Sheehan probably does have finer ball control.

However if you ask sheehan to withstand physical challenges or make crunching tackles, then compare that to someone bigger and stronger, again the difference will be clear.

Room for all types.

5 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

Sheehan probably does have finer ball control.

However if you ask sheehan to withstand physical challenges or make crunching tackles, then compare that to someone bigger and stronger, again the difference will be clear.

Room for all types.

I don’t completely disagree (I actually think Sheehan withstands challenges more due to his close control and better balance) but it wasn’t my point - I simply said I don’t think he’s comfortable on the ball. He’s improving, because he’s clearly an absolute grafter with a cracking attitude, but I just don’t think it is natural for him like it is for some others.

Re. Thomason, one must assume Bristol City's scouts have watched him & see he has worth. For fun let's imagine they have a clue.

Fair to assume also that, almost by coincidence, they've seen Sheehan, Dempsey etc. at the same time. They have a deal of cash but it's Thomo they've come for.

We may find that odd but it's them splashing the dosh.

Players are worth what the current market says, the Saudi explosion has significantly and quickly inflated fees at PL level, if that inflation percolates down to Champ / L1 deals we should cash in. Good luck to Bristol C getting what they did for their lad, if they want to chuck a bit more than par at us because of it all well and good

2 minutes ago, ianofcleveleys said:

Players are worth what the current market says, the Saudi explosion has significantly and quickly inflated fees at PL level, if that inflation percolates down to Champ / L1 deals we should cash in. Good luck to Bristol C getting what they did for their lad, if they want to chuck a bit more than par at us because of it all well and good

My concern would be getting someone in, with so little time left. Even with cash available, it would be a test of the club's system etc.

We've got 3 weeks

Just now, jmjhb said:

We've got 3 weeks

Not long, if we went in for someone, that person's club has even less time. Makes it less likely that players are available and certainly at a price we are prepared to go to. Such things have been made clear several times- we won't pay beyond what we see fit.

Back to the value of a player- we may not cough up the cash, so the player is only worth what he offers his current club.

No offence to the lad but for us is he not just a bang average squad player, there's a wringing of hands on social media as though we are letting the next big thing go for next to nothing?