We had a discussion on here a while back, which suggested quite a substantial opposition to the project.

Now that there are rumours that the Northern section will be scrapped, what are the views now?

I was always an opponent of it, though softened slightly when an expert lady explained in more detail about the capacity issues on the East and West Coast mainlines.

4 hours ago, Mounts Kipper said:

It will be easier for starmer if the Tories cancel it…. Don’t think it makes any sense to continue, to answer your question I doubt starmer will continue with it.

RS will have to say we will keep it 

Vote winner 

even through he and the Con's are Fucked 

still wants to try to Keep  Northeren Votes 

59 minutes ago, little whitt said:

RS will have to say we will keep it 

Vote winner 

even through he and the Con's are Fucked 

still wants to try to Keep  Northeren Votes 

That’s possible but unlikely in my opinion. 

2 hours ago, little whitt said:

RS will have to say we will keep it 

Vote winner 

even through he and the Con's are Fucked 

still wants to try to Keep  Northeren Votes 

They'll have already decided to scrap it

Edited October 1, 20232 yr by Lt. Aldo Raine

Keep up chaps . He’s fixing potholes instead. 

Manchester City centre is going to be a pain in the fucking arse this week.

Not least because it will be heaving with chinless wankers pretending they adore northern culture before scurrying back to the Home Counties and being fumigated on Friday.

100% getting fucked off.

12 hours ago, Spider said:

Manchester City centre is going to be a pain in the fucking arse this week.

Not least because it will be heaving with chinless wankers pretending they adore northern culture before scurrying back to the Home Counties and being fumigated on Friday.

Heaving is a stretch. They've had to move the main hall space to where they normally put the press due to low numbers and it'd be really visible the gaps in the main hall. It currently hasn't helped the situation very much....

1 hour ago, Not in Crawley said:

Heaving is a stretch. They've had to move the main hall space to where they normally put the press due to low numbers and it'd be really visible the gaps in the main hall. It currently hasn't helped the situation very much....

I’m sure they’ll be corralling southern blue hearts up for the big speeches.

I doubt Grant Shapps could pull a crowd if he was dishing out £50 notes at the end of every sentence.

32 minutes ago, Spider said:

I’m sure they’ll be corralling southern blue hearts up for the big speeches.

I doubt Grant Shapps could pull a crowd if he was dishing out £50 notes at the end of every sentence.

This made me chuckle

HS2 gone, what a monumental cock up. So now UK will surely have the shortest high speed rail link in the world. Politicans should hang their heads in shame.

Know your place Northern scum.

Tomorrow I'll be getting thameslink and then hop on the brand new Elizabeth line.

#levellingup

So the only Conservative mayor of a large urban conurbation comes out at the party conference and says don't scrap it as it'll be a general.misswd opportunity. The PM scraps the northern leg of this project in the city it was supposed to serve.

Even The Thick of It's party conference went better than this.

What a fucking shambles.

6 minutes ago, Not in Crawley said:

Know your place Northern scum.

Tomorrow I'll be getting thameslink and then hop on the brand new Elizabeth line.

#levellingup

That Elizabeth line would look like the Jetsons to a lot of northern oiks

Even though I’m a bit meh about HS2, the timing of this announcement is fucking amazing.

Lets see what they’d going to do with the money.

18 minutes ago, Spider said:

Even though I’m a bit meh about HS2, the timing of this announcement is fucking amazing.

Lets see what they’d going to do with the money.

They'll say that it'll be spent on improving the East/West transport links. Folk will lap it up. It won't actually happen. 

10 minutes ago, Sweep said:

They'll say that it'll be spent on improving the East/West transport links. Folk will lap it up. It won't actually happen. 

If they committed to improving the fucking bastard cunting roads around GM, then no problem as far as I’m concerned.

But I just can’t see it.

Inflation is a form of tax apparently.

There should be an enquiry as to what went wrong and why. Lessons need to be learnt.

From a political standpoint I can understand Burnham's gripe if the Manc leg doesn't happen but I can also see the other side that the costs are just unaffordable.

Back to the top then, why is it so expensive? Listening to various 'experts' on the radio seems to suggest compulsory purchase is not the main cause of overspend, so what is?

9 minutes ago, gonzo said:

Inflation is a form of tax apparently.

News to me. File that alongside those 7 bins, taxes on eating meat, etc.

The bloke just spouts meaningless shite and then repeats it on a loop.

 

What type of twat do you have to be to want attend a Tory party conference of your own free choice. Weirdos

32 minutes ago, Winchester White said:

There should be an enquiry as to what went wrong and why. Lessons need to be learnt.

From a political standpoint I can understand Burnham's gripe if the Manc leg doesn't happen but I can also see the other side that the costs are just unaffordable.

Back to the top then, why is it so expensive? Listening to various 'experts' on the radio seems to suggest compulsory purchase is not the main cause of overspend, so what is?

I think there’s various, but, I think the sub contract model these things are often built with contributes massively to extra costs . 
Subbies use subbies and every one puts their % on, so, the bag of stone costs the project a lot more than the £30 the lad laying it paid for it , multiply this by every single thing done, chuck in bad structure, too many chiefs on mega bucks and not  enough Indians costs soon spiral . 
I’ve done some work for hs2, already up here , our costs made a decent profit , our client will pass that on to the project with a decent mark up too. 
Not the sole cause but certainly a contributing factor in my opinion.

1 hour ago, Spider said:

Even though I’m a bit meh about HS2, the timing of this announcement is fucking amazing.

Lets see what they’d going to do with the money.

 

11 minutes ago, fatolive said:

I think there’s various, but, I think the sub contract model these things are often built with contributes massively to extra costs . 
Subbies use subbies and every one puts their % on, so, the bag of stone costs the project a lot more than the £30 the lad laying it paid for it , multiply this by every single thing done, chuck in bad structure, too many chiefs on mega bucks and not  enough Indians costs soon spiral . 
I’ve done some work for hs2, already up here , our costs made a decent profit , our client will pass that on to the project with a decent mark up too. 
Not the sole cause but certainly a contributing factor in my opinion.

I’m involved with some of the high rise towers being built in manchester.

In one case, the Chinese company who are the main contractor only directly employ 6 people. This for a set of building with almost 1,000 apartments in them.

Beyond that, the amount of sub contracted is unreal. One particular product we’re supplying goes through 5 price uplifts by the time the final price is paid by the contractor.

Assuming this model applies to big government civil projects, it’s no wonder everything spirals.

But - and this is key - the government is the client and ought to manage it much much better.

48 minutes ago, Spider said:

I’m involved with some of the high rise towers being built in manchester.

In one case, the Chinese company who are the main contractor only directly employ 6 people. This for a set of building with almost 1,000 apartments in them.

Beyond that, the amount of sub contracted is unreal. One particular product we’re supplying goes through 5 price uplifts by the time the final price is paid by the contractor.

Assuming this model applies to big government civil projects, it’s no wonder everything spirals.

But - and this is key - the government is the client and ought to manage it much much better.

Are you doing anything with Salboy? 

3 minutes ago, royal white said:

Are you doing anything with Salboy? 

Indirectly, yes. It’s their M&E guys I work with.

Busy boys though they are