3-0

Collins, Paris and Killa Cam

14 minutes ago, Farnywhite said:

18 contracted players next season we might be able to sell  one or two but SS is stuck with the vast majority for next season 

Five or six brought in over the summer with hopefully the quality we need for the first team, some of those that realise they won’t be getting game time may wish to move on. If only it was that simple.

4 minutes ago, onefinfrandsen said:

Five or six brought in over the summer with hopefully the quality we need for the first team, some of those that realise they won’t be getting game time may wish to move on. If only it was that simple.

May be  one or two with 12 months left might be persuaded to leave if they get offered  a 2 or 3 year deal somewhere else but on the other hand they might decide to sit were they are and leave on a free the following year .  

With 8 million invested in the current squad were not recouping much back that’s for sure 

Having slept on it, some random thoughts. McAtee & Collins are a hopeless front 2 & a start to our problems. They can't press, can't hold the ball up &  rarely have strikers' instincts in the box. Vic & last seasons' Dion were a miles better combination......but lets not have any bollocks about selling Dion now. Getting nearly a million for a player who wanted out & was clearly on the decline was good business.....the mistake was in not replacing him & with the injury to Vic has left us in a mess upfront.

Sheehan & Morley are too similar & rarely control midfield.....it's one or the other for me.

The wing backs get rinsed against strong wingers like yesterday, switching to slightly better defenders helped but too little too late.

Forino was  worse than Santos which is a concern since i'm guessing he'll be our central defender next season.

SS has messed up with his mass substitutions 2 games running, losing momentum v Rotherham & leaving us with 10 men yesterday

On the bright side, Dempsey & Matete put up a fight. 

18 hours ago, burnden said:

What was going on in our end when all the stewards ran in near the end of the game?

 

3 minutes ago, bolton va va said:

Having slept on it, some random thoughts. McAtee & Collins are a hopeless front 2 & a start to our problems. They can't press, can't hold the ball up &  rarely have strikers' instincts in the box. Vic & last seasons' Dion were a miles better combination......but lets not have any bollocks about selling Dion now. Getting nearly a million for a player who wanted out & was clearly on the decline was good business.....the mistake was in not replacing him & with the injury to Vic has left us in a mess upfront.

Sheehan & Morley are too similar & rarely control midfield.....it's one or the other for me.

The wing backs get rinsed against strong wingers like yesterday, switching to slightly better defenders helped but too little too late.

Forino was  worse than Santos which is a concern since i'm guessing he'll be our central defender next season.

SS has messed up with his mass substitutions 2 games running, losing momentum v Rotherham & leaving us with 10 men yesterday

On the bright side, Dempsey & Matete put up a fight. 

Pretty much my thinking after calming down from yesterday I do think Forino could come good but it didn’t help all the changes and as for Santos I don’t want to see him in a Bolton shirt again really disappointed in his attitude yesterday. 

21 hours ago, noxid said:

Have we won more than one game since Baxter replaced Southwood

Baxter should have been sold in January.

Southwood in net - W10 D2 L5 

 

 

38 minutes ago, wanderer1984 said:

Baxter should have been sold in January.

Southwood in net - W10 D2 L5 

 

 

Can’t sell him if no offers and he will probably got a better deal leaving on a free . 
southwoods records sounds similar to evatts 50 percent 

Edited April 13, 20251 yr by Farnywhite

Bit late to the party, but a few thoughts. 
 

1. Yesterday was bad. As bad as it’s been all season. The first 35 was simply unacceptable. Only the players know how they allowed themselves to be so comprehensively outfought. 

2. There are a huge number of 50/50 games in this division that are decided by little moments of quality or simple resilience. Wigan is a great example. The teams that get promoted don’t generally batter teams. They simply have enough to win more of those 50/50 games. In defence of SS, yesterday was the first game that we didn’t keep it at a 50/50 battle. It’s easy to look for wholesale changes off the back of yesterday, but prior to it, performances had been acceptable. 

3. We concede a lot. However, with a better front two, we stand more chance of scoring first. That’s where clean sheets come from. At 1-0 down, teams chase the game, crowds become anxious and players make bad decisions. This allows teams to get a second and kill the game (as we saw). I don’t think our defensive unit is ‘bad’ but they’re under so much pressure when we have nobody up top to hold the ball and release pressure. There’s a name I could say that would have helped. But a lot don’t like him and he’s injured anyway. Our season would look different if we’d kept him fit. 

4. Forino should never play right of a 3. He’s an out and out centre half. I worry that bringing Santos in yesterday may have caused some serious relationship damage between Forino and SS. He was shunted out to fit Santos in (I’d have started with Cogley right of a 3 and Jones at RWB for a more physical presence on Humphrey’s). I’m a big fan of Santos, and there’s nothing wrong with his attitude. But he’s clearly not match fit. Dempsey has been eased back in. Santos was thrown a dummy yesterday by SS. 

The season is ‘probably’ over. SS has work to do in the summer. But he will have some money and if players won’t leave, I imagine they’ll be frozen out or sent on loan. Etete and Matete will go, Santos, Baxter and Jones will go. Randall and Lolos will, I expect, be told to find new clubs. And if a few quid comes in for Collins or Sheehan, I expect they’ll may also go. 

Characters are needed as the team lacks leaders. But we’ve no God given right to win this league. It may take another year after next. 

Edited April 13, 20251 yr by thebells

11 minutes ago, thebells said:

I’m a big fan of Santos, and there’s nothing wrong with his attitude.

Bless.

Couldn't be more wrong.

27 minutes ago, Dr. Feelgood said:

Bless.

Couldn't be more wrong.

I’m all for opinions on here. And I’ll always be respectful with mine. 

I’m afraid you’re condescending reply of ‘bless’ says far more about you than me. 

Out of interest, what is it that makes you think he has a bad attitude?

Edited April 13, 20251 yr by thebells

33 minutes ago, thebells said:

3. We concede a lot. However, with a better front two, we stand more chance of scoring first. That’s where clean sheets come from. At 1-0 down, teams chase the game, crowds become anxious and players make bad decisions. This allows teams to get a second and kill the game (as we saw). I don’t think our defensive unit is ‘bad’ but they’re under so much pressure when we have nobody up top to hold the ball and release pressure. There’s a name I could say that would have helped. But a lot don’t like him and he’s injured anyway. Our season would look different if we’d kept him fit. 

The conceding issue is rooted more for me in us regularly starting games too slowly, not matching the intensity even of modest sides and shipping the first goal, though I do agree that a front line with someone who can hold it would help us to keep the ball away from our goal, particularly when we're away at sides who are decent and up for it from minute 1.

'Start fast, score first' is a pretty simple mantra to send them out with before kick off. Start slow/sloppy, concede first has been the way of far too often, leaving us in the game chasing situation and giving an open invite to any amount of shithousing by the opponents.

For what it's worth, our defensive unit of the last two seasons hasn't been good enough and needed better protection from a more robust holding midfielder or even two in a double pivot set up. You are right though that some of the unacceptable volumes of goals we've shipped this season has been down to a front line that is weak / unwilling physically and doesn't help with the 'defending from the front' anywhere as much as when it was Charles and Kachunga. We didn't score as many but conceded far fewer and, unsurprisingly, lost far fewer games.

1 minute ago, ianofcleveleys said:

The conceding issue is rooted more for me in us regularly starting games too slowly, not matching the intensity even of modest sides and shipping the first goal, though I do agree that a front line with someone who can hold it would help us to keep the ball away from our goal, particularly when we're away at sides who are decent and up for it from minute 1.

'Start fast, score first' is a pretty simple mantra to send them out with before kick off. Start slow/sloppy, concede first has been the way of far too often, leaving us in the game chasing situation and giving an open invite to any amount of shithousing by the opponents.

For what it's worth, our defensive unit of the last two seasons hasn't been good enough and needed better protection from a more robust holding midfielder or even two in a double pivot set up. You are right though that some of the unacceptable volumes of goals we've shipped this season has been down to a front line that is weak / unwilling physically and doesn't help with the 'defending from the front' anywhere as much as when it was Charles and Kachunga. We didn't score as many but conceded far fewer and, unsurprisingly, lost far fewer games.

Agree with all of that mate. 

I’d add that many managers will have cottoned on to our slow starts. Interesting that Barnsley, Blackpool, Shrewsbury, Crawley, Rotherham all faded after fast starts against us. In 3 cases the game was up by that point. 

Im sure SS can see what we see and will look for some muscle and some experience next season. 

34 minutes ago, thebells said:

I’m all for opinions on here. And I’ll always be respectful with mine. 

I’m afraid you’re condescending reply of ‘bless’ says far more about you than me. 

Out of interest, what is it that makes you think he has a bad attitude?

Because he has. If you can't see that then I have no reason to be condescending to you, you achieve it for yourself.

5 hours ago, dusan nikolic said:

I totally agree regarding the mess S.S has inherited , it may take him a season to sort it out to be fair . There are limited players out of contract and lets be honest how many clubs are going to pay for most of the others , that's if the players are willing to leave .

Regarding the teams all 3 have inherited i think Bruce and Big Sam took over teams that had a lot of quality at that point and both showed 3 signings or so could dramatically change the seasons fortunes , Bruce did it with what was basically Neal's team and likewise Big Sam would probably have done it also regarding Toddy's , ( Eidur's injury and a corrupt official aside ) , i'm not sure S.S inherits the settled sides they did , no doubt there are quality players here but the squad is so disjointed , we have Collins and Mcatee and Sheehan and Randall who are 2 cheeks of the same backside and other than that we are soft as shit all through the team . I also think Dion being here still would have given us more points on the board and the January dealings were bizarre to say the least . But we aren't out of it yet but i think the injuries of the last few games will be the final nail in the coffin.

 

Totally agreed. The fact there were some still backing Evatt as he decimated the squad this season was crazy. 

19 minutes ago, Dr. Feelgood said:

Because he has. If you can't see that then I have no reason to be condescending to you, you achieve it for yourself.

But surely you must know ‘because he has’ isn’t a reasoned argument. 

I can tell you (because I know him) that his attitude is not an issue. His body language may give off a ‘don’t care’ at times. But the fella played through an injury almost no pro would have done earlier in the season. He's committed himself to getting fit so he can play a part in our end of season (and he’s leaving so could have just tossed it off) and is desperate for the club to succeed.

He struggled yesterday as he’s not match fit (I seem to recall you saying you didn’t watch yesterdays game (apologies if I’m wrong). 
 
Be as condescending as you like. I’ll always be respectful. But I’m coming at this from a position of knowledge. Unless you know something I don’t, I don’t think you have anything more than an opinion. 

6 minutes ago, thebells said:

But surely you must know ‘because he has’ isn’t a reasoned argument. 

I can tell you (because I know him) that his attitude is not an issue. His body language may give off a ‘don’t care’ at times. But the fella played through an injury almost no pro would have done earlier in the season. He's committed himself to getting fit so he can play a part in our end of season (and he’s leaving so could have just tossed it off) and is desperate for the club to succeed.

He struggled yesterday as he’s not match fit (I seem to recall you saying you didn’t watch yesterdays game (apologies if I’m wrong). 
 
Be as condescending as you like. I’ll always be respectful. But I’m coming at this from a position of knowledge. Unless you know something I don’t, I don’t think you have anything more than an opinion. 

I will take your word for it regards Santos as you seem to have good knowledge of what is happening but I was at the game and in my opinion he just didn’t look interested that was just my opinion but I stand corrected . 

5 minutes ago, Rizlar said:

I will take your word for it regards Santos as you seem to have good knowledge of what is happening but I was at the game and in my opinion he just didn’t look interested that was just my opinion but I stand corrected . 

Fair enough mate. I’m not here to defend him where he doesn’t deserve. And he absolutely struggled yesterday. I agree he’s not the player he was. 

I just find it difficult to hear his attitude questioned when I know that’s not the issue (it was before he came to Bolton). 

Many of the same people are happy to back Baxter who openly did an interview two weeks ago where he admitted he’d become overweight earlier this season. Yet, amazingly, his attitude was never questioned and many were praising him for another interview where he said he loved the club and wanted to stay (he’ll be off at the merest whiff of a championship club). 

Anyway, I’m off on holiday tomorrow so I’ll let Rico fight his own battles 😊

7 hours ago, woolli said:

You wont get out of this league playing nicey tippy tappy football, its not how it works in this league. We are desperate for some physicality in midfield and up front, im sure SS already knows what needs addressing.

I agree entirely but Joe Powell isn’t tippy tippy he’s one of the best crossers of a ball I’ve seen at this level and he does it consistently. 

I was surprised when Southwood was dropped and Baxter suddenly put back in. He hadn't covered himself in glory on Bristol R's winning goal but had otherwise, for me, been generally decent, defenders seemed to have confidence in him and he'd cut out the dithering and risk level when Baxter had the ball in his possession. I'd like to see him brought back in for the last few games as he's likely to be the No1 come August 

9 hours ago, desperado said:

Good post pal.

The last sentence sums up where I am at the minute.

You can bounce back from a poor performance. But 4 injuries in one game to key players, when there’s only 4 games left will, like you say, probably be a hurdle too far.

Shame, as I genuinely thought prior to yesterday that 6th was very much in our sights, I’m really not so sure now.

I was looking forward to Friday being a real Easter holiday spectacle, part of our good run-in, taking on and beating a promotion rival, Morley showing Wycombe what they were missing.

But now I have a bad feeling 🙁

I think we have too much to do looking at the remaining games but beat Wycombe and who knows ,  but the dreadful goal difference will probably be our undoing.

Edited April 13, 20251 yr by dusan nikolic

A real disaster really. Defended like absolute idiots and were truly horrible even though we created 4-5 incredibly good opportunities.

The goals we conceded were amateurish as best. Not tackling, backing off, getting twisted inside out and turning backs, the last one.. Jeez the guys running away from goal and we let him turn and pick out a man. Just incredible really.

Then the injuries... Quite happy to see the back of many of these players, but to lose them with little to no back-up, is worrying. 

Schumacher won't stand for any more of that and rightly so. I think a few players condemned themselves to the bottom of League One for next season with that performance. Because that's where a lot of them will end up. 

A lack of respect from the players and I know it sounds like an overreaction, but it's true. They lack respect for the manager, the fans, the club and eachother. 

1 hour ago, boltonboris said:

lack of respect from the players and I know it sounds like an overreaction, but it's true. They lack respect for the manager, the fans, the club and eachother. 

There absolute shower probably one or two give a fuck think jones and one other supposedly didn’t go on the Xmas piss up because of the form at the time . Then we had the only a couple actual train property when evatt isn’t about accusation .

There over paid underperforming bottlers as a group and been given chance after chance they have been praised , booed , backed by large followings home and away , change in tactics formations nothing works .

How many hammerings have we had with this squad conceding 4 snd 5 s .

Once it’s put on them or it’s going wrong they cave . They need to fuck off  there is no way there capable of winning 4 on the bounce sneak in the play offs then navigate 3 games for promotion 

Edited April 14, 20251 yr by Farnywhite

Once it’s put on them or it’s going wrong they cave . They need to fuck off  there is no way there capable of winning 4 on the bounce sneak in the play offs then navigate 3 games for promotion 

A few of these players will be leaving under a cloud, as did the bloke that signed them, that can't be good for their self esteem or their future football careers, most should have gone after the Oxford debacle as should the bloke that signed them.

This season had FAILURE written all over it from the time it took ages for the club or Evatt to acknowledge anything last summer , then 6 weeks into the new season and it was more or less over with, manager apparently offered to walk but NO, we're Bolton Wanderers so we'll carry on with our heads in the sand making the same mistakes, hoping that people keep turning up and clapping happily at 1-1 home draws etc. In the 70s a lot of people only went cos you could get a beer after the pubs had shut, by the 80s you didn't need to so they didn't bother, now you can see any game you want from the comfort of your own house god only knows what's gonna keep people going for the foreseeable coz its certainly not the football.

 

23 hours ago, wanderer1984 said:

Baxter should have been sold in January.

Southwood in net - W10 D2 L5 

 

 

still not good enough for promotion with that form

Santos and Forino cannot play in the same team. Ever..

This time next year rodney 

You see, I don’t view it as an effort, attitude, application problem. Not under SS anyway, maybe it ended that way under IE. 

That’s the first indication under SS of complete and utter under-performance, without there being the other qualities needed to scrap out a 1-0 win.

I think there’s other things more at play to explain away Saturday; players coming back in who aren’t up to speed, injuries, players not consistent enough to perform Tue/Fri, mental fatigue/or permanent mental frailties but more pertinent IMO they are largely average L1 players (who show flashes occasionally of being better) who fall into performances like that. Regularly under Evatt, less so under SS.

Some of them (sometimes I think quite a lot them) under a different manager now, with some key summer signings that compliment them rather than more of the same, can perform to a top L1 level possibly even championship.

So this idea of fucking all the players off, castigating them for an attitude/effort issue (which I don’t think it is) would be an over-reaction and is providing a platform for a frustrated fan base to start turning their anger and abuse to players who currently, regardless of any attitude/effort, just aren’t good enough as a collective.

If this now turns into booing them onto the pitch, you’re not fit to wear the shirt, fuck off out of our club, you set of lazy batards etc. then I’ll be arguing with a few around me as it serves no purpose whatsoever.

 

 

Edited April 14, 20251 yr by desperado