Site Supporter Tonge moor green jacket Posted December 5, 2018 Site Supporter Share Posted December 5, 2018 (edited) 10 minutes ago, birch-chorley said: Dp. Edited December 5, 2018 by Tonge moor green jacket Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwfcfan5 Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 15 minutes ago, birch-chorley said: Have your cake and eat it basically, it doesn’t take into account the red lines laid out by the EU It’s as far fetched as anything Boris has come up with But again, it’s easy offering a position when you don’t have to go and deliver it Its very deliverable. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if it was exactly where we end up on this merrygoround. It won't please the hardcore Brexiteers though - but there does appear to be a parliamentary plan being hatched to push towards this option. I'm not saying it is a good one - simply that May ruled it out right from the start - and actually it is a better option economically in all likelihood than what she has delivered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwfcfan5 Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 56 minutes ago, Cheese said: Nonsense. There's nothing in the legal advice that wasn't already revealed in the Withdrawal Agreement. The oddest thing about all this is why the Government were so willing to act in contempt of Parliament to keep it hidden. Bizarre. That is true. Except that the government and May specifically tried to insinuate that EU and international law meant in reality we couldn't be "trapped" - a poster on here picked up on that a while ago in one of her Commons' addresses. However, the legal advice says the exact opposite! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salford Trotter Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 14 minutes ago, tyldesley_white said: Does anyone know how much it costs Norway for this membership https://fullfact.org/europe/norway-eu-payments/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miamiwhite Posted December 5, 2018 Author Share Posted December 5, 2018 So then, which poster is winning the prediction race ? Im pretty sure Mounts has consistently said No Deal will be the final outcome. Will leave my rod on the riverbank.....:D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birch-chorley Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 Norway has free movement of people as well, not quite the model people voted for I’m fine with it though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwfcfan5 Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 2 minutes ago, miamiwhite said: So then, which poster is winning the prediction race ? Im pretty sure Mounts has consistently said No Deal will be the final outcome. Will leave my rod on the riverbank.....:D No he hasn't. He's said we'll get a great deal and everything will be cushty.....time and time again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwfcfan5 Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 1 minute ago, birch-chorley said: Norway has free movement of people as well, not quite the model people voted for I’m fine with it though Well indeed - but then who knows what people voted for? Certainly not what is on offer. One might argue that more would support the Norway model than the one on the table given a Norway model would satisfy some Brexiteers and a lot of remainers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birch-chorley Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 39 minutes ago, bwfcfan5 said: Its very deliverable. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if it was exactly where we end up on this merrygoround. It won't please the hardcore Brexiteers though - but there does appear to be a parliamentary plan being hatched to push towards this option. I'm not saying it is a good one - simply that May ruled it out right from the start - and actually it is a better option economically in all likelihood than what she has delivered. Is it? From what I can recall from the Confrence speech Corbyn was very woolly with regards free movement of people to work and travel across the EU. I’m sure his position was that he wouldn’t ignore the country’s clear message from the referendum - take back control Trying to get full access to the single market whilst refusing to accept free movement of people has always been a red line Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MalcolmW Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 Norway applied for EEC membership at the same time as Denmark, Ireland and UK. Like Denmark and Ireland, Norway held a referendum before joining, but the Norwegian proposal was lost, so Norway remained in EFTA (where UK and the others had been), whereas the Danish and Irish populations agree to join. The UK (Heath's Conservative government) joined without a public vote, but the Labour government (Wilson's second) gave a referendum on staying or leaving. Norway tried again but the public again did not accord with the political class, so they settled for their current position (out with no representation, but some benefits at significant cost). No-one, not Mark Carney, not Mervyn King knows how this will pan out whichever option we end up with. The USA has its problems (!), Germany is at the end of an era and preparing for the unknown, France's brash new broom is threatening to fall apart, Russia continues to act as a rogue state and China massages its growth figures. So, all in all, everything is a mess and I doubt anyone knows what will be the situation in 5 or 10 years' time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwfcfan5 Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 27 minutes ago, birch-chorley said: Is it? From what I can recall from the Confrence speech Corbyn was very woolly with regards free movement of people to work and travel across the EU. I’m sure his position was that he wouldn’t ignore the country’s clear message from the referendum - take back control Trying to get full access to the single market whilst refusing to accept free movement of people has always been a red line Oh aye there are problems with Labour's position which moves constantly. And he went from calling for a Norway model to not calling for a Norway model to essentially calling for it but not calling it a Norway model. Its a mess. However, what I meant was, May could have agreed that deal with the EU. And probably had a better chance with it . Both the Tory red lines and Labour tests are "undeliverable" in their entirety. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyldesley_white Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 1 hour ago, miamiwhite said: So then, which poster is winning the prediction race ? Im pretty sure Mounts has consistently said No Deal will be the final outcome. Will leave my rod on the riverbank.....:D No I think Mounts said we would get a deal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Spider Posted December 5, 2018 Site Supporter Share Posted December 5, 2018 8 hours ago, Mounts Kipper said: The commons will vote against TM plan and the government will have to go back to the EU for more concessions and suprise suprise concessions will follow. I see just as predicted earlier in this thread Corbyn failed to do the TV debate. It’s all so predictable. The only thing you’ve correctly predicted in the last 2 years is the result of the referendum beyond that, your record is dreadful Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Spider Posted December 5, 2018 Site Supporter Share Posted December 5, 2018 2 hours ago, MalcolmW said: Norway applied for EEC membership at the same time as Denmark, Ireland and UK. Like Denmark and Ireland, Norway held a referendum before joining, but the Norwegian proposal was lost, so Norway remained in EFTA (where UK and the others had been), whereas the Danish and Irish populations agree to join. The UK (Heath's Conservative government) joined without a public vote, but the Labour government (Wilson's second) gave a referendum on staying or leaving. Norway tried again but the public again did not accord with the political class, so they settled for their current position (out with no representation, but some benefits at significant cost). No-one, not Mark Carney, not Mervyn King knows how this will pan out whichever option we end up with. The USA has its problems (!), Germany is at the end of an era and preparing for the unknown, France's brash new broom is threatening to fall apart, Russia continues to act as a rogue state and China massages its growth figures. So, all in all, everything is a mess and I doubt anyone knows what will be the situation in 5 or 10 years' time. At times of uncertainty there is strength in numbers i do believe Mr Churchill said something along those lines. He certainly benefited from the assistance of a large ally.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MalcolmW Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 8 minutes ago, Spider said: At times of uncertainty there is strength in numbers i do believe Mr Churchill said something along those lines. He certainly benefited from the assistance of a large ally.... We allied with Stalin's unholy Soviet Union before Pearl Harbour brought FDR's USA into action. JSL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MalcolmW Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 3 hours ago, bwfcfan5 said: That is true. Except that the government and May specifically tried to insinuate that EU and international law meant in reality we couldn't be "trapped" - a poster on here picked up on that a while ago in one of her Commons' addresses. However, the legal advice says the exact opposite! A sovereign nation such as UK can abrogate a treaty. An international body, such as EU, is not a nation and cannot do so. EO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Spider Posted December 5, 2018 Site Supporter Share Posted December 5, 2018 9 minutes ago, MalcolmW said: We allied with Stalin's unholy Soviet Union before Pearl Harbour brought FDR's USA into action. JSL Third times a charm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweep Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 3 hours ago, miamiwhite said: Im pretty sure Mounts has consistently said No Deal will be the final outcome. That's the exact opposite of what he's predicted - in fact he's always maintained we'll have an excellent deal, that sees us a lot better of than we currently are Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mounts Kipper Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 12 minutes ago, Sweep said: That's the exact opposite of what he's predicted - in fact he's always maintained we'll have an excellent deal, that sees us a lot better of than we currently are Did you miss his fishing rod comment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Casino Posted December 5, 2018 Moderators Share Posted December 5, 2018 3 hours ago, bwfcfan5 said: However, what I meant was, May could have agreed that deal with the EU. And probably had a better chance with it . so, a deal that saw free movement at its core not a chance for me, id go norway deal but a seat at the making the decisions table Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mounts Kipper Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Spider said: The only thing you’ve correctly predicted in the last 2 years is the result of the referendum beyond that, your record is dreadful Go on I’ll play what have I predicted? Edited December 5, 2018 by Mounts Kipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwfcfan5 Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 29 minutes ago, Casino said: so, a deal that saw free movement at its core not a chance for me, id go norway deal but a seat at the making the decisions table Not a chance of what? Getting through parliament? I think it would. Pleasing everyone? No it wouldn’t but then nothing will. I will go with your third line! Absolutely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mounts Kipper Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 56 minutes ago, Sweep said: That's the exact opposite of what he's predicted - in fact he's always maintained we'll have an excellent deal, that sees us a lot better of than we currently are Nearly right but not quite, I’ve said a deal will get sorted, but I never ever said a lot better off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter MickyD Posted December 5, 2018 Site Supporter Share Posted December 5, 2018 4 minutes ago, Mounts Kipper said: Go on I’ll play what have I predicted? I think you once predicted Bolton to win 3-0. We lost 2-1. You're shit at predictions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miamiwhite Posted December 5, 2018 Author Share Posted December 5, 2018 1 hour ago, Mounts Kipper said: Did you miss his fishing rod comment? No wonder they swallow the EU guff when they can’t even see a rod Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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