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Wanderers Ways. Neil Thompson 1961-2021

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Posted (edited)

Lets be sensible....if the options were win the group and play Colombia then Germany/Brazil or finish 2nd and play Japan then Mexico....I know where I'd rather finish.

 

By the time we play Belgium we'll know the best route. Ultimately no route is easy but psychologically for our young team Germany in the quarters might be too much. And whilst Germany look poor we know, what happens when it comes to the crunch. 

 

it's true that that route is what most fans would prefer but every pundit (ex player) so far has said go out and win no matter what

 

it's going to be difficult, if the manager thought the same as the fans, to get the players to think the same and go out to lose

 

but we wont know who we play in the next round when we play our game, and only an inkling of who we might play in the quarters

 

and the best chance of winning that will be to go into it having won 4 on the bounce and not having tried to get an easier route by losing a game, which would probably be even more psychologically damaging 

Edited by ZicoKelly
Posted

it's true that that route is what most fans would prefer but every pundit (ex player) so far has said go out and win no matter what

 

it's going to be difficult, if the manager thought the same as the fans, to get the players to think the same and go out to lose

 

but we wont know who we play in the next round when we play our game, and only an inkling of who we might play in the quarters

 

and the best chance of winning that will be to go into it having won 4 on the bounce and not having tried to get an easier route by not losing a game, which would probably be even more psychologically damaging 

 

Damned if he does damned if he doesn't scenario . . . 'throw' the Belgium game and then lose anyway and he gets slated.   win and then lose to, say, Germany and he should have done ensured second place.

 

You'd have to agree that momentum and winning games is the best preparation though.

Posted

Serious question for anyone itk, where can i get early confirmed Line-ups before each game?

There's going to be a lot of players rested in this round and i don't want to back players who aren't going to be starting.

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Posted

it's true that that route is what most fans would prefer but every pundit (ex player) so far has said go out and win no matter what

 

it's going to be difficult, if the manager thought the same as the fans, to get the players to think the same and go out to lose

 

but we wont know who we play in the next round when we play our game, and only an inkling of who we might play in the quarters

 

and the best chance of winning that will be to go into it having won 4 on the bounce and not having tried to get an easier route by losing a game, which would probably be even more psychologically damaging 

 

I think he'll make changes. Other nations are clever in these scenarios. I don't want to lose the game, but everyone would prefer to avoid a section of the draw with Germany/Brazil if they could. 

 

It isn't easy, you can't throw the game, but certainly if it is the case, conserve some energy, rest some key players.

 

I get the whole momentum thing, but Belgium will make changes and rest some and ultimately beating them then losing to Brazil in the quarters whilst Belgium go through won't feel great. There are no guaranteed victories though its more psychological, play Germany or Brazil and the players will have that psychological monkey on their backs. 

  • Moderators
Posted

Damned if he does damned if he doesn't scenario . . . 'throw' the Belgium game and then lose anyway and he gets slated.   win and then lose to, say, Germany and he should have done ensured second place.

 

I don't think he will get criticized/damned for that, only a mentalist would think otherwise

 

and those folk would also assuming we'd beat the other teams in our way no problem

 

mexico are doing alright, we could yet play Columbia in the next round, they look q

 

and we might not even get to the 1/4s

 

the only way he's fucked is if he sends the team out to lose (IMO)

  • Moderators
Posted (edited)

I think he'll make changes. Other nations are clever in these scenarios. I don't want to lose the game, but everyone would prefer to avoid a section of the draw with Germany/Brazil if they could. 

 

It isn't easy, you can't throw the game, but certainly if it is the case, conserve some energy, rest some key players.

 

I get the whole momentum thing, but Belgium will make changes and rest some and ultimately beating them then losing to Brazil in the quarters whilst Belgium go through won't feel great. There are no guaranteed victories though its more psychological, play Germany or Brazil and the players will have that psychological monkey on their backs. 

 

 

aye, it's a tough one

 

rest players, they lose momentum maybe, whilst the ones coming in will be chomping at the bit, e.g. vardy, rashford

 

Belgium are in a no lose situation in that respect, though it'd be nice to lose 4-3 in the last minute following a great performance

 

however it'd be equally galling to lose to Columbia in the next round and happen to see the Belgians (or whoever) beat an out of sorts German or Brazilian team "that we'd have beat no problem had we bothered to try and win the group"

 

probably best not to worry about it and just go out and try to beat whoever from here on it

Edited by ZicoKelly
Posted

rest a few, give Cahill, Dier, Vardy etc a run out

 

entertaining draw where both teams dont really lose any momentum and we out yellow card them 3-1 and accidentally drop to 2nd in the group

Posted

[quote name="bwfcfan5" post="1801768" timestamp="1529933288

 

play Germany or Brazil and the players will have that psychological monkey on their backs.

 

If we are to have a chance, we’ll have to beat the best teams

Posted

If we are to have a chance, we’ll have to beat the best teams

 

Yep no argument from me. And I get that Mexico or Senegal or anyone on their day could easily beat us. 

 

I guess it more a question of do you build momentum now, or hope that as you go through the knockouts you build momentum with a young team. 

 

I feel that it would be gutting to see Belgium get to the semis in a relatively easier (not easy) portion of the draw whilst we end up facing say Colombia then Brazil or Germany....

Posted (edited)

i dont see how a draw or defeat against Belgium (unless it was an absolute hiding) would affect the confidence / momentum the group is building.

 

qualified handsomely, played some great stuff, created loads of chances and we're in the next round. if the draw does open up favorably id guess the players would be thinking "fucking bring it on" rather than worrying over the result of a dead rubber 

 

sometimes you lose, but you really win 

Edited by barrycowdrill
Posted

i dont see how a draw or defeat against Belgium (unless it was an absolute hiding) would affect the confidence / momentum the group is building.

 

qualified handsomely, played some great stuff, created loads of chances and we're in the next round. if the draw does open up favorably id guess the players would be thinking "fucking bring it on" rather than worrying over the result of a dead rubber 

 

sometimes you lose, but you really win 

 

IF  they lose, then the correct response is to say we'll beat them next time, and hope that is the final.

 

Then again, that applies to both sides.

Posted

IF  they lose, then the correct response is to say we'll beat them next time, and hope that is the final.

 

Then again, that applies to both sides.

 

Of course and i think the squad would be pretty confident no matter who they play however i do think a potential easier route would give them greater belief to go with that confidence

Posted

I don't think he will get criticized/damned for that, only a mentalist would think otherwise

 

and those folk would also assuming we'd beat the other teams in our way no problem

 

mexico are doing alright, we could yet play Columbia in the next round, they look q

 

and we might not even get to the 1/4s

 

the only way he's fucked is if he sends the team out to lose (IMO)

 

You're probably right but you know how the press are . . .

 

I think we try and win but if second spot looks decent he could possibly rest a few more?

 

Agree that Mexico, Columbia etc could give us a tougher test than many think

Posted

3 changes maximum from us, go all out to win the game. Tournaments are all about building momentum, and that is starting to happen with us. A defeat against these lot would set that back.

 

I remember the last Euros after we beat Wales, we should have built on that by putting a strong team out against Slovakia. We didn't, the game was dire and we lost the momentum from the Wales match.

 

On a separate note, does anyone know anywhere with a decent outside screen showing the game Chorley/Adlington/Horwich way?

  • Moderators
Posted

3 changes maximum from us, go all out to win the game. Tournaments are all about building momentum, and that is starting to happen with us. A defeat against these lot would set that back.

 

I remember the last Euros after we beat Wales, we should have built on that by putting a strong team out against Slovakia. We didn't, the game was dire and we lost the momentum from the Wales match.

 

 

agree, also, Wales won their next group games, got momentum, got to the semis

Posted

So Far:

 

Top Half of the draw:

 

Uruaguay, Portugal, France, Argentina

 

Bottom Half:

 

Spain, Russia, Croatia, Denmark

 

As it stands, Brazil & germany would be top half, Switzerland & Mexico in the bottom half.

 

Winner of our group is top half.

Posted

3 changes maximum from us, go all out to win the game. Tournaments are all about building momentum, and that is starting to happen with us. A defeat against these lot would set that back.

 

I remember the last Euros after we beat Wales, we should have built on that by putting a strong team out against Slovakia. We didn't, the game was dire and we lost the momentum from the Wales match.

 

On a separate note, does anyone know anywhere with a decent outside screen showing the game Chorley/Adlington/Horwich way?

Top barn up Rivington did something for the Panama game that looked decent

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