Covid-19

[Rudy]

22 minutes ago, Mr Grey said:

Does that go for smokers, drinkers, drug addicts etc ?

Bullshit statement, someone said years ago that the NHS shouldn't treat smokers, absolute nonsense.

Last time I looked the Vaccine was a choice and not mandatory.

They’re lifestyle choices aren’t they?

[Tonge moor green jacket]

1 minute ago, Rudy said:

They’re lifestyle choices aren’t they?

So is taking a vaccine or not.

Unless it became compulsory, some just won't have it. That move wouldn't work neither. 

Whether a contribution to their own treatment could be levied legally I don't know.

[Rudy]

1 minute ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

So is taking a vaccine or not.

Unless it became compulsory, some just won't have it. That move wouldn't work neither. 

Whether a contribution to their own treatment could be levied legally I don't know.

Yeah but you can stop smoking and drinking or lose weight they aren’t necessarily reliant on the NHS.
 

A pandemic is. if you don’t get the vaccine but then you catch it and take up a hospital bed, that’s beyond a lifestyle choice, you’re then further putting a strain on the NHS when you don’t really need to. 
 

You were given the option to protect yourself with a free vaccine and declined.
 

Back of the queue 

[Rudy]

15 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

Refusing treatment is indeed ridiculous, and breaks the hippocratic oath. Wouldn't be the right way to go.

Maybe offer incentives to those that do though.

That said, is it not unreasonable for individual business owners to decide on their own rules with regards to non vaccinated folk. Now necessary for some jobs.

There are no laws to prevent discrimination against smokers for example, so an employer could insist on non smoking employees. I would presume similar could apply to covid.

No better incentive than not dying 

[Tonge moor green jacket]

7 minutes ago, Rudy said:

Yeah but you can stop smoking and drinking or lose weight they aren’t necessarily reliant on the NHS.
 

A pandemic is. if you don’t get the vaccine but then you catch it and take up a hospital bed, that’s beyond a lifestyle choice, you’re then further putting a strain on the NHS when you don’t really need to. 
 

You were given the option to protect yourself with a free vaccine and declined.
 

Back of the queue 

You can stop smoking etc, but damage is often already done.

I know where you are coming from, and agree in general terms, however you're asking doctors to refuse treatment on the basis of a medical decision by a patient. That's an unfair burden to place upon them, and as I said before, almost certainly would mean them breaking their own code.

A thin end of the wedge- "did you smoke for a few years in your youth?"

"Yes"

"Extra year's delay before treatment then"

Same could be said for drugs, booze, lack of exercise, bad diet, etc. What if the poor diet is in part caused by not having much money?

Huge can of worms, and if you introduced such rules, then you may find folk who have a reaction to it or still got ill looking to sue the authorities.

Not sure what the answer is, perhaps some additional payment for treatment, but you'll not get any government going down this route.

[Rudy]

9 minutes ago, Mr Grey said:

The Vaccine is a choice.... and your point ?

Alright then, smoking drinking and obesity are self inflicted. 
Pandemics aren’t.

The vaccine is a way to reduce your chances of catching it before you do.

Not treat you 30 years down the line of abusing your body. That’s my point.

Edited December 1, 2021 by Rudy

[DazBob]

I don't think the unvaccinated should be refused treatment.  That'd be grossly unfair.

However, if there is a shortage of beds then they should be at the back of the queue.  Can't say fairer than that.

[Guest]

17 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

You can stop smoking etc, but damage is often already done.

I know where you are coming from, and agree in general terms, however you're asking doctors to refuse treatment on the basis of a medical decision by a patient. That's an unfair burden to place upon them, and as I said before, almost certainly would mean them breaking their own code.

A thin end of the wedge- "did you smoke for a few years in your youth?"

"Yes"

"Extra year's delay before treatment then"

Same could be said for drugs, booze, lack of exercise, bad diet, etc. What if the poor diet is in part caused by not having much money?

Huge can of worms, and if you introduced such rules, then you may find folk who have a reaction to it or still got ill looking to sue the authorities.

Not sure what the answer is, perhaps some additional payment for treatment, but you'll not get any government going down this route.

Herein lies the problem of the NHS, free at point of care.

Edited December 1, 2021 by boltondiver

[mickbrown]

Just now, DazBob said:

I don't think the unvaccinated should be refused treatment.  That'd be grossly unfair.

However, if there is a shortage of beds then they should be at the back of the queue.  Can't say fairer than that.

Saw a doctor yesterday saying how he had to cancel a cancer patient's surgery yesterday because all the ICU beds were taken up by unvaxxed covid patients. He wasn't a happy chap.

[DazBob]

1 minute ago, mickbrown said:

Saw a doctor yesterday saying how he had to cancel a cancer patient's surgery yesterday because all the ICU beds were taken up by unvaxxed covid patients. He wasn't a happy chap.

Disgusting.

Each one of them should be informed of that fact.  They'll probably not care though as selfish people generally don't.

[bolton_blondie]

You lot wanna come do a shift in the NHS? You'd lose your rag with the self entitlement some scroats have. 

"I pay your wages darling" Some scrubber said to me once. It's not professional for me to drop kick someone.

[Tonge moor green jacket]

20 minutes ago, bolton_blondie said:

You lot wanna come do a shift in the NHS? You'd lose your rag with the self entitlement some scroats have. 

"I pay your wages darling" Some scrubber said to me once. It's not professional for me to drop kick someone.

You should. 

Council workers get it too. No one actually said it to my face when I was there, which is just as well, as I'd probably have lost my job. 

[athywhite1958]

I think the acid test will be next summer when travel companies and countries abroad insist on a COVID passport or you can't fly or enter their country, does that make it discriminatory?

[Tonge moor green jacket]

38 minutes ago, boltondiver said:

Herein lies the problem of the NHS, free at point of care.

Very much a political hot potato over the years, and I can't see that basic principle and function being radically changed any time soon. 

I don't know where a government would stand legally if they tried to legislate against non vaccinated folk over free care. Human rights and all that jazz, and a potential change to the nhs' basic principles. 

[Tonge moor green jacket]

3 minutes ago, athywhite1958 said:

I think the acid test will be next summer when travel companies and countries abroad insist on a COVID passport or you can't fly or enter their country, does that make it discriminatory?

Already done that haven't they. It's up to other countries.

[Rudy]

40 minutes ago, Mr Grey said:

It's also a choice, like a lot of things in life.

To refuse a smoker or a drinker NHS treatment is ludicrous, it's legal and they pay a shitload of tax on cigarettes & Alcohol. 

A nice nit of Oasis in there for you as well.

I’m not saying that. What I’m saying is Covid isn’t a lifestyle choice but you are being offered a preventative measure. If you refuse it it’s your choice but if you want it In the future or are taken ill as a result of it then you should have to pay because you’re now taking up a bed when you wouldn’t have done if you took the free bastard vaccine

[athywhite1958]

1 minute ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

Already done that haven't they. It's up to other countries.

I think other countries will be stricter as we go into the new year

[Rudy]

32 minutes ago, bolton_blondie said:

You lot wanna come do a shift in the NHS? You'd lose your rag with the self entitlement some scroats have. 

"I pay your wages darling" Some scrubber said to me once. It's not professional for me to drop kick someone.

It’s a good thing you’re a calm tempered soul

[Sweep]

9 minutes ago, athywhite1958 said:

I think other countries will be stricter as we go into the new year

I think that'll be nailed on, especially if you're headed to the US or the EU

[Rudy]

Just now, Mr Grey said:

I myself have chosen preventive measures, booster jab tomorrow morning.

However I don't have a problem with people who are refusing the vaccine, they have their reasons and I'm respectful of them.

But I don't have much sympathy with covid deniers, that's a whole new ball game, again though, we shouldn't refuse them treatment, we are a democracy, people have different views, we can't change them, even putting mandatory vaccines in place won't change their way of thinking.

The bed situation is pretty severe, but there's also a situation developing we're non-covid related illnesses and operations are now causing deaths, maybe that's another reason why the Government want every fucker jabbed as quickly as possible.

 

Just had mine myself not sure why you wouldn’t but hey ho. It’s never going to happen we aren’t China. Just wish people would get off Facebook and live in the real world and we’ll get through this quicker 

[medwaywhite]

1 hour ago, mickbrown said:

Saw a doctor yesterday saying how he had to cancel a cancer patient's surgery yesterday because all the ICU beds were taken up by unvaxxed covid patients. He wasn't a happy chap.

My wife works in theatre and said all the beds in icu are taken up with non vaccinated people 

[Sweep]

3 minutes ago, Mr Grey said:

Fortunately folk have different opinions, it wouldn't do for you all to think the same, that would be like China.

They don't all think the same in China at all, they just do as they're told

[Spider]

Where are the tens of thousands dying from the vaccine that the fucking cranks claimed would happen?

Where are the deformities and thousands of brain damaged folk who’ve been ruined by the jab?

The anti-vaccine narrative now seems to be that it does nothing. Fine, whatever. Dicks.

Dont get one, but enjoy watching the normals jetting off on their holidays next year whilst you’re stood outside the local complaining about a new world order and secretly realising you’ve made a right prick of yourself.

Knobs

[MickyD]

6 minutes ago, Spider said:

Where are the tens of thousands dying from the vaccine that the fucking cranks claimed would happen?

Where are the deformities and thousands of brain damaged folk who’ve been ruined by the jab?

The anti-vaccine narrative now seems to be that it does nothing. Fine, whatever. Dicks.

Dont get one, but enjoy watching the normals jetting off on their holidays next year whilst you’re stood outside the local complaining about a new world order and secretly realising you’ve made a right prick of yourself.

Knobs

I think most are worried about the long-term effects rather than short-term. Like the extra limbs they’ll be growing in twenty years time.

[ErnestTurnip]

I work with someone who says they won’t get jabbed because their gran has stage 4 cancer.

Their reasoning is that if they’re jabbed and get covid then they’re more likely to be asymptomatic and pass it on to their gran unwittingly.

The only possible way I can process that is that they are lying and are just full moon man conspiracists and scared to say so because the alternative is even more frightening.