Wrexham (H)

[Johnnyrotten]

24 minutes ago, ianofcleveleys said:

The three up front, if none of them are the type to run at players and take them on, stifles the scope for the wing backs to get forward. Too often, Collins and McAtee wanted to come away from their defence to get involved in little passing exchanges that didn't amount to anything and crowded the area between their back line and halfway. 

We now have a sackful of forwards who are good at the same things and not so good at the same things, while with JDB gone our main bit of physicality, heading and hold up ability has gone with him. 

But don't forget he was injury prone

[Stig]

2 minutes ago, Johnnyrotten said:

Agree with that.  We got to chatting at the game today about how you'd never get Jeff Chandler, David Lee, Willy Morgan, Peter Thompson, Scott Sellars, Mark Gavin doing much defending.  Then we realised not one of them would have played for us if IE had been our manager.  And neither would Phil Brown, John Ritson, Tony Dunne, Jimmy Phillips, Steinson etc.  Yet is this better?  What's so wrong with 2 full backs that can defend and 2 wingers that can attack and cross a ball?  And 2 strikers in the box?  Instead we fall between 2 stools with players that don't either attack or defend particularly well, they just seem to play everything safe and go for damage limitation.

Yep. Imagine having a proper winger to put some of those crossing chances in today

[MancWanderer]

28 minutes ago, boogs said:

😂 I'm in.

I'll happily buy the bugger one. He's not worthy of the fine looking green kit though. He can have that pink/purple abomination 😁

[ianofcleveleys]

17 minutes ago, Johnnyrotten said:

But don't forget he was injury prone

He was, but to not replace him with someone similar is questionable to say the least. None of the five we have on the books now are capable of fulfilling such a role. Vic's the only one anywhere near being able to and he's no great shakes at it, especially in the air

[TroySwoosh]

Vic's first touch is shocking

[Ryan]

1 hour ago, Stig said:

MacLean? The guy who has terroristed us for years? Cogley did pretty well containing him while still attacking I thought.

To be fair McClean is 35 and whilst still a decent player at League One level I’m sure he isn’t going to be terrorising defenders with pace any more. Certainly not for long periods. Revan on the other side looked more than capable of speeding in behind Schön but I do believe JDC didn’t have quite the same level of threat to deal with and so could have been a tad more adventurous but perhaps I am not giving McClean enough credit and maybe he’s still quicker than he looks.

[Cheese]

5 minutes ago, TroySwoosh said:

Vic's first touch is shocking

I disagree. There were several moments today when it looked like he was on a hiding to nothing, and he somehow managed to win/keep the ball with 2 or 3 defenders breathing down the collar of his shirt. He has the makings of a great target man at this level. He looks a different prospect to last season imo.

[FrancisFogarty]

2 hours ago, MancWanderer said:

 

If I fight @FrancisFogarty will @boogs buy a shirt for my nephew CB? The MASSIVE turncoat 

Nephew? Yes  S or M tops. He’ll have one named and numbered I’m sure. 

[Wanderlust]

I think it has to be said that we defended well and didn't make any monumental cock ups at the back and with Johnston back, we have the makings of a solid base. But like others it seems our lack of creativity and threat in attack was a disappointment.

Thing is that we bought Collins, McAtee and Schon because they allegedly have the ability to create something from nothing and as it turned out today, McAtee was anonymous for much of the game, Collins played in patches and Schon was tidy but kept passing back - when we'd sort of hoped he would be tearing WBs a new one. TBF to Schon, Wrexham's new signing Revan has pace to burn.

On the other side, JDC was a shadow of himself when it came to getting forward - perhaps he was under instructions to be wary of McClean - but on the few occasions when he did get forward his crossing was diabolical.

I'm not sure Evatt is the best man to teach 3 strikers how to rotate their runs but something has to be done to mix it up a bit if we're not going to prolong the frustration.  I got the feeling that McAtee and Collins weren't playing with any freedom and yet we know they have the ability.  I guess things will get better as they develop a better understanding of each other but I'd like to see them going off-script a bit more because the whole attack seemed micromanaged into predictability and very few risks were taken other than Collins coming inside and having a shot - and I don't mind strikers taking risks when the ball is at the far end of the pitch. I might be barking up the wrong tree here but strikers with the ability of ours should be free to take people on, shoot on sight and run where their instinct tells them to and yet it felt like they were under instructions to stay put.

Edited August 19, 2024 by Wanderlust

[bolty58]

Two games in. 1 W, 1D.  Far from the finished article which is what you'd want at this stage.

Don't get the negheads (I do really, we have always had an abnormally sized proportion within our support base). When we romped this division under Jimmy Armfield, we lost 3 of our first 7 league games. 

Ten games in. Start assessing it then. Teams need to gel and get up to pace. Unlike some, I am perfectly satisfied with our start. Could have nicked that yesterday. Dion was unlucky. He will make amends at the Valley.

[perth_white]

1 hour ago, bolty58 said:

Two games in. 1 W, 1D.  Far from the finished article which is what you'd want at this stage.

Just finished reading through and seems actually less negative than the win at Orient thread. My take is that there are a fair amount of people who believe we would have lost both these games last season so it could be argued that we are already 4 points better off.

I'll keep positive.

[embankment]

Seen enough yesterday to come to the conclusion, Evatt will keep us up.

 

[Eddie]

5 hours ago, Wanderlust said:

I think it has to be said that we defended well and didn't make any monumental cock ups at the back and with Johnston back, we have the makings of a solid base. But like others it seems our lack of creativity and threat in attack was a disappointment.

Thing is that we bought Collins, McAtee and Schon because they allegedly have the ability to create something from nothing and as it turned out today, McAtee was anonymous for much of the game, Collins played in patches and Schon was tidy but kept passing back - when we'd sort of hoped he would be tearing WBs a new one. TBF to Schon, Wrexham's new signing Revan has pace to burn.

On the other side, JDC was a shadow of himself when it came to getting forward - perhaps he was under instructions to be wary of McClean - but on the few occasions when he did get forward his crossing was diabolical.

I'm not sure Evatt is the best man to teach 3 strikers how to rotate their runs but something has to be done to mix it up a bit if we're not going to prolong the frustration.  I got the feeling that McAtee and Collins weren't playing with any freedom and yet we know they have the ability.  I guess things will get better as they develop a better understanding of each other but I'd like to see them going off-script a bit more because the whole attack seemed micromanaged into predictability and very few risks were taken other than Collins coming inside and having a shot - and I don't mind strikers taking risks when the ball is at the far end of the pitch. I might be barking up the wrong tree here but strikers with the ability of ours should be free to take people on, shoot on sight and run where their instinct tells them to and yet it felt like they were under instructions to stay put.

First half in particular, both McAtee and Collins were making plenty of runs off the shoulder of their defenders but the ball wasn’t being played - mainly because it was with our centre backs and they aren’t capable / didn’t want to risk it. The amount of times they tried it and then turned around in frustration when it didn’t come and the ball was back with the wing back, keeper or other side of defence.

The problem is, as soon as you get the ball to someone who can play that pass in behind (Sheehan / GT), the space has gone in behind and they can’t make that run. I don’t know what the answer is but I don’t think it was the willingness to make the run that was the issue, it was having the right person on the ball to play the pass.

[W.cramp]

One hell of a lot of over analysis (standard).   End of the day we defended very well,  george a massive plus.   Evatt had already said we will get better as we progress through the games and while we are doing so then I am quite happy not losing a game like that

[Lt. Aldo Raine]

8 hours ago, Johnnyrotten said:

But don't forget he was injury prone

He was

[gonzo]

8 hours ago, Cheese said:

I disagree. There were several moments today when it looked like he was on a hiding to nothing, and he somehow managed to win/keep the ball with 2 or 3 defenders breathing down the collar of his shirt. He has the makings of a great target man at this level. He looks a different prospect to last season imo.

He's a number 9. Always has been and always will be. His game is running on to things, through balls and crosses in the box. 

He's not a number 10 or wide man of a 3.

Dion needs to shape himself, I love the lad but he can't keep missing vital chances. Vics well on his tail for that position imo.

[masi 51]

Please can somebody explain what system or shape we played the last 25 mins because we still had two wingbacks on, but we withdrew three forwards and replaced them with a forward and two midfielders.

Is it a case of not altering a 5/2/3 or 3/5/3  same formation but one is plan a and the other plan a mark 2 

Seems that last 25 it was a play where you want  mentality

[radcliffe white]

Vic did ok and had a thankless task when he came on giving the lack of support he had, those subs wow

 

[barrycowdrill]

11 minutes ago, gonzo said:

He's a number 9. Always has been and always will be. His game is running on to things, through balls and crosses in the box. 

He's not a number 10 or wide man of a 3.

Dion needs to shape himself, I love the lad but he can't keep missing vital chances. Vics well on his tail for that position imo.

See this is the thing, Vic has always been a number 9. But only while he’s been here. Prior to that he was a wide man in a 3 and Evatt has said himself he’s still learning the central role. Has his touch, hold up and link up play got better whilst he’s been here? Yes. Is it now something you can rely on, the ball sticking, holding off defenders and bringing others in? No. And I wouldn’t back him to take the chances Dion misses either. They’re both a 1 in 3 chances player I think. Different attributes but generally the same outcome 

Edited August 19, 2024 by barrycowdrill

[masi 51]

1 minute ago, radcliffe white said:

Vic did ok and had a thankless task when he came on giving the lack of support he had, those subs wow

 

wow indeed, no thought in how they would effect the shape or game........Same last year when it was Charles and Collins off and Jerome/Bod/Vic on settle for no more goals

[ZiggyStardust]

9 hours ago, RoadRunnerFan said:

Yup. Collins looked like a 'cheat code' in the kids parlance back end of last season.

Today he was taking throw ins from left back.

We was told he would need a pre-season before we saw what Evatt had in mind with him.

[nantwichwhite]

I think the forwards need to relax a little bit, they are very eager to please. Collins's first touch last year was sublime, this season it is not as good. Macatee is finding his feet (as Collins did last year), Vic's all round game has improved and we all know Dion's weaknesses but he also has a positives too. As said above defence looked solid and we probably have the best keeper in the league. Also, George is arguably now the best midfielder in the division,  I liked the way Toal and the Johnson supplemented the midfield but still remain unconvinced about Sheehan's effectiveness in his current role. There is still stuff to work in but only tweaks and not wholesale changes.

[L/H White]

crying out for Jerome last 20

[Eddie]

8 minutes ago, nantwichwhite said:

I think the forwards need to relax a little bit, they are very eager to please. Collins's first touch last year was sublime, this season it is not as good. Macatee is finding his feet (as Collins did last year), Vic's all round game has improved and we all know Dion's weaknesses but he also has a positives too. As said above defence looked solid and we probably have the best keeper in the league. Also, George is arguably now the best midfielder in the division,  I liked the way Toal and the Johnson supplemented the midfield but still remain unconvinced about Sheehan's effectiveness in his current role. There is still stuff to work in but only tweaks and not wholesale changes.

That’s a huge statement. He’s not even the best midfielder in our squad.

[only1swanny]

10 hours ago, boogs said:

😂 I'm in.

I'll happily buy the bugger one. He's not worthy of the fine looking green kit though. He can have that pink/purple abomination 😁

Love the purple and pink one, although there weren't many blokes wearing it! 

Wife and kids have the green ones, not all matching :p