Politics

[bolty58]

On 13/11/2020 at 17:00, birch-chorley said:

https://www.ft.com/content/99299608-85b9-4770-afea-a7c621f2fc75

The vaunted compromise on agriculture — which the UK had made a priority in the hope of raising sales of value-added exports such as cheese — has less substance than London suggests. Britain failed to secure new so-called tariff rate quotas, which allow EU farmers to sell a limited quantity of sensitive food products to Japan at lower tariffs. The UK can instead use any quota left unfilled by the EU in 10 of 25 products covered by the EU-Japan agreement. Officials insist there are gaps the UK could fill. But the deal puts the UK second to the EU on agricultural exports to Japan — even if, in monetary terms, this is not a vital market.

 

Much to like here. Cheese being exported.

[Mounts Kipper]

9 minutes ago, paulhanley said:

Me neither. But this is the mentality we are dealing with. If someone has a different opinion the modern day liberal seeks to marginalise it by deeming it "inappropriate". Censorious and sinister. And they don't like it being pointed out to them.

Absolutely and sadly we’ve a few on here who fit that description. 

[paulhanley]

Just now, Mounts Kipper said:

Absolutely and sadly we’ve a few on here who fit that description. 

Yes. The same characters who thought it was OK to spend the period from 2016-2019 egging on those who were trying to deny the outcome of a national referendum.

Democracy denying and trying to close down free speech. Not a great CV really is it.

[birch-chorley]

It was only a very small number / minority who proposed ignoring the referendum all together and staying as we are 

The issue was you have about a million different versions of BREXIT, from a Switzerland model with free movement and free trade at one end with a hard BREXIT at the other. Each and every version would honour the referendum (after all, how often did we hear ‘Switzerland aren’t in the EU and they are doing fine’) 

Most the legal arguments against BREXIT were made so Parliament gets a say on which version we end up with, after all that’s our democratic process. It shouldn’t be left to a handful of people to decide on such a bug issue that has implications for all aspects of live for such a long period of time 

Given the Cummings news I’m holding out a bit of hope that we do end up with a softer Switzerland style model, couldn’t bare the short / medium term pain of a hard Brexit on top of Covid, Fuck that! 

[Spider]

This development confirms that there’ll be a deal.

I expect it mean Boris has conceded on pretty much everything.

Fishing is the one to watch. For some reason, hardened brexiteers seem to have latched onto that as being the gauge of how good a deal will be.

[Escobarp]

1 minute ago, Spider said:

This development confirms that there’ll be a deal.

I will let some major businesses who are clients of mine know 👍🏼

Edited November 14, 2020 by Escobarp

[Spider]

7 minutes ago, Escobarp said:

I will let some major businesses who are clients of mine know 👍🏼

Dont forget to tell them the details 🤪

Edited November 14, 2020 by Spider

[Farrelli]

36 minutes ago, Escobarp said:

I will let some major businesses who are clients of mine know 👍🏼

You should be happy, I'm prepared to admit that you visionaries were right, I think we are going to get a deal as you predicted. I had not factored in Cummings going which changes the whole picture. Hopefully we will get a deal which keeps us more aligned to the EU and allows business to continue more normally, win win.

The hard brexiteers will probably be a little upset at the concessions we make though. Even with a deal there is still plenty of work to do at the ports and NI/Ireland border but the door is open and Boris has the opportunity to swallow his pride and do what is right. 

[Escobarp]

2 minutes ago, Farrelli said:

You should be happy, I'm prepared to admit that you visionaries were right, I think we are going to get a deal as you predicted. I had not factored in Cummings going which changes the whole picture. Hopefully we will get a deal which keeps us more aligned to the EU and allows business to continue more normally, win win.

The hard brexiteers will probably be a little upset at the concessions we make though. Even with a deal there is still plenty of work to do at the ports and NI/Ireland border but the door is open and Boris has the opportunity to swallow his pride and do what is right. 

I’m delighted IF what we both now think is about to happen actually happens. Plenty mocked when we said it was a very hard negotiation and I personally said both sides would need to make concessions and would do just that as it was clearly in neither sides interest to go down the no deal route  

many mocked one particular poster on here repeatedly about it.

People think Cummings going is a huge step forward and it sort of is. but he’s only going because imo a deal has almost been agreed and he’s gone as he can’t be a part of a softer brexit as that’s not why he was brought in my those in the shadows. So he’s going after the event and isn’t the decisive factor as some are making out. 
 

it’s about time boris grew a pair and thank fuck he has , and I hope many on here will in time admit they were actually wrong about his own personal intentions regarding brexit 

[paulhanley]

20 minutes ago, Farrelli said:

You should be happy, I'm prepared to admit that you visionaries were right, I think we are going to get a deal as you predicted. I had not factored in Cummings going which changes the whole picture. Hopefully we will get a deal which keeps us more aligned to the EU and allows business to continue more normally, win win.

The hard brexiteers will probably be a little upset at the concessions we make though. Even with a deal there is still plenty of work to do at the ports and NI/Ireland border but the door is open and Boris has the opportunity to swallow his pride and do what is right. 

You are "prepared to admit" from your lofty liberal perch. How grateful us lowly mortals are. It's fabulous of you to acknowledge that our votes counted in 2016. Pity you didn't do that  straight from June 24, 2016 though. Bit of an oversight on your part. Just a blip in your otherwise impeccable track record of being a democrat no doubt.

[Tonge moor green jacket]

1 hour ago, Spider said:

This development confirms that there’ll be a deal.

I expect it mean Boris has conceded on pretty much everything.

Fishing is the one to watch. For some reason, hardened brexiteers seem to have latched onto that as being the gauge of how good a deal will be.

Fish are more important to the EU as they eat more of them. That means its a good negotiating tool.

Be madness not to allow some sort of access or purchasing system, as drops in sales would damage the industry. 

What is good is the ability to control environmental conditions, techniques etc. Got to be a better way of utilising by catch as opposed to wazzing it back in the sea for example. 

[mickbrown]

3 hours ago, paulhanley said:

If you talk about immigration that automatically makes you a racist in the minds of our liberal friends. It is not "appropriate". Surely you must know this by now Mounts.

It's poorly written gibberish. Is it Google translated?

[Spider]

7 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

Fish are more important to the EU as they eat more of them. That means its a good negotiating tool.

Be madness not to allow some sort of access or purchasing system, as drops in sales would damage the industry. 

What is good is the ability to control environmental conditions, techniques etc. Got to be a better way of utilising by catch as opposed to wazzing it back in the sea for example. 

I know that

You know that

But there are a lot of red faced, angry fat blokes on Twitter who say that backing down on fishing is unacceptable.

Not that these guys would have the first clue even if we said we weren’t allowing a single foreign vessel in our waters, and there were Spaniards and french ships emptying the North Sea anyway.

Lets see the deal.

My prediction: It’ll be a light version of what we had when we were in the EU and both sides will claim a victory and this thread will hit a million pages.

Edited November 14, 2020 by Spider

[mickbrown]

3 hours ago, Mounts Kipper said:

Aye I know that, but as long as you know your not racist it’s like water of a ducks back.  Failure to raise these issues for fear of being labelled racist isn’t happening to me. 

You martyr you. 

Mounts single handedly holding back the swathes of Islamic fundamentalists😀

[Tonge moor green jacket]

8 minutes ago, Spider said:

I know that

You know that

But there are a lot of red faced, angry fat blokes on Twitter who say that backing down on fishing is unacceptable.

Not that these guys would have the first clue even if we said we weren’t allowing a single foreign vessel in our waters, and there were Spaniards and french ships emptying the North Sea anyway.

Lets see the deal.

My prediction: It’ll be a light version of what we had when we were in the EU and both sides will claim a victory and this thread will hit a million pages.

They'll be able to get some of our fish, and we'll be able to get Belgian spuds.

Cars, meat and all such in between will pass to and fro.

You might even sell some tanks to the Irish.

[Mounts Kipper]

12 minutes ago, mickbrown said:

You martyr you. 

Mounts single handedly holding back the swathes of Islamic fundamentalists😀

Thank you good sir. 😂

[mickbrown]

1 minute ago, Mounts Kipper said:

Thank you good sir. 😂

👍

[paulhanley]

47 minutes ago, mickbrown said:

It's poorly written gibberish. Is it Google translated?

Hardly a surprise. If you're a 21st century liberal you think you've cornered the market on wisdom to the point where you can attempt to annul the result of a referendum. Any kind of challenge will therefore naturally come across as gibberish. A foreign language in fact. 

[mickbrown]

1 hour ago, paulhanley said:

Hardly a surprise. If you're a 21st century liberal you think you've cornered the market on wisdom to the point where you can attempt to annul the result of a referendum. Any kind of challenge will therefore naturally come across as gibberish. A foreign language in fact. 

Eh? What bollocks is that?

So you telling me I'm a snowflake because it's poorly translated?

Edited November 14, 2020 by mickbrown

[Farrelli]

3 hours ago, paulhanley said:

You are "prepared to admit" from your lofty liberal perch. How grateful us lowly mortals are. It's fabulous of you to acknowledge that our votes counted in 2016. Pity you didn't do that  straight from June 24, 2016 though. Bit of an oversight on your part. Just a blip in your otherwise impeccable track record of being a democrat no doubt.

You got brexit and we are leaving, time to move on isn't it ?

There is no point fighting the 2016 referendum forever, you have been the one telling us that since the vote.

If we get a deal then I'm happy that the government have at least delivered that aspect.

The Conservatives are the ones most responsible for not delivering brexit until now.

[paulhanley]

19 minutes ago, Farrelli said:

You got brexit and we are leaving, time to move on isn't it ?

There is no point fighting the 2016 referendum forever, you have been the one telling us that since the vote.

If we get a deal then I'm happy that the government have at least delivered that aspect.

The Conservatives are the ones most responsible for not delivering brexit until now.

Not the point is it. Donald Trump rightly gets pelters for trying to deny the clear outcome of an election. But often its from people who were trying to do exactly the same between 2016-19. It was a disgrace and the repeated attempts to pretend it never happened will not work. Donald Trump may not be a democrat but it is very, very clear that many liberal remainers are in the same camp as him.

[kent_white]

17 minutes ago, paulhanley said:

Not the point is it. Donald Trump rightly gets pelters for trying to deny the clear outcome of an election. But often its from people who were trying to do exactly the same between 2016-19. It was a disgrace and the repeated attempts to pretend it never happened will not work. Donald Trump may not be a democrat but it is very, very clear that many liberal remainers are in the same camp as him.

I can see the point you're trying to make - but I don't agree.

Donald Trump is refusing to accept that he's actually even lost the election due to voter fraud. 

Nobody on here has ever suggested that happened around Brexit have they? Or anyone else as far as I can remember.

[Escobarp]

14 minutes ago, kent_white said:

I can see the point you're trying to make - but I don't agree.

Donald Trump is refusing to accept that he's actually even lost the election due to voter fraud. 

Nobody on here has ever suggested that happened around Brexit have they? Or anyone else as far as I can remember.

Ok splitting hairs. So it’s ok then , in your opinion , if trump calls for a second vote yes to make sure people knew what they were doing in the first one? 
 

and ok for Republicans to stall the process of biden getting in by taking whatever spurious legal action they can find? That’s ok as well correct? Or do you not remember all this happening and people on here supporting it?

Edited November 14, 2020 by Escobarp

[paulhanley]

10 minutes ago, kent_white said:

I can see the point you're trying to make - but I don't agree.

Donald Trump is refusing to accept that he's actually even lost the election due to voter fraud. 

Nobody on here has ever suggested that happened around Brexit have they? Or anyone else as far as I can remember.

They spent three years trying to de-legitimise the result, actively looking for any slight whiff of wrongdoing (without finding any), lecturing that people "didn't know what they voted for" and egging on out and out democracy deniers like Lord Adonis and Gina Miller. It was utterly appalling. Until 2016 I'd have never thought we lived in a country where a significant number of people think they can manipulate/ignore/suppress the result of a referendum. We now know different.

The debate between remainers and leavers was inevitable. The attempts to undermine the result on June 23, 2016 quite another. It has destroyed trust and raised deep suspicions about coercive tendencies that clearly lurk in the liberal mindset. Since December 2019 there seems to have been a retrenchment whereby those responsible want to airbrush their behaviour between 2016 and 2019. It will not be forgotten.

[miamiwhite]

1 hour ago, Farrelli said:

You got brexit and we are leaving, time to move on isn't it ?

There is no point fighting the 2016 referendum forever, you have been the one telling us that since the vote.

If we get a deal then I'm happy that the government have at least delivered that aspect.

The Conservatives are the ones most responsible for not delivering brexit until now.

Theresa May firstly, followed by a load of twats like Gina Miller and Co.

Once Boris Johnson got in, then there was no turning back for you democracy deniers.

Thank me later when you're not part of a Federal State or EU Army trying to give it the big one