Politics

[Escobarp]

7 minutes ago, Ani said:

I think you will acknowledge there really is a massive difference between walking away from a negotiation in business and the situation were are in with the EU. 
 

We have a current deal with our biggest supplier who is also our biggest customer and we are talking about breaking those ties although we will still want to deal with them , just on undefined terms and we have nothing in place to replace any lost business. I would be amazed if you or your company every let a negotiation get to this position. 

Of course ive never been in a situation like this. I was merely highlighting that negotiations aren’t always ones involving numerous other parties lurking in the background. 

[Tonge moor green jacket]

1 hour ago, Ani said:

You are giving reasons for the deal to be modified. My point is when this was pointed out previously anyone questioning the oven ready deal was a traitor. 

What were people questioning it for? To stop brexit, or to push for no deal.

The whole point of a deal is one of compromise. Thats what was done, especially given the time frame and business wanting a bit more security.

As time moves on, any treaty may be subject to change if circumstances necessitate it. 

Personally, I dont know if it needs amending or not- just listening to comments of those closer to it.

One thing I am sure of is that its just brinkmanship. 

 

 

[Tonge moor green jacket]

1 hour ago, Escobarp said:

It won’t happen we all know this but we also have to acknowledge the EU are just as pig headed. If this goes tits up then both sides suffer and both have played a part in it doing so. 
 

if it is no deal then, wait for it, we need to have a second referendum which is leave with no deal or stay in. Simple as that for me. (That should seal another 100 pages on this thread easily). But genuinely It is what I believe. 

That's not happening!!

Any oldies who can answer this- did we have a trade agreement with the eu prior to joining?

How was it all done then?

[Ani]

1 hour ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

What were people questioning it for? To stop brexit, or to push for no deal.

The whole point of a deal is one of compromise. Thats what was done, especially given the time frame and business wanting a bit more security.

As time moves on, any treaty may be subject to change if circumstances necessitate it. 

Personally, I dont know if it needs amending or not- just listening to comments of those closer to it.

One thing I am sure of is that its just brinkmanship. 

 

 

I was questioning the whole thing as it has never been explained what the final outcome looks like.

Do you think given the impact of Carona that the leave date should be flexed to allow a suitable deal to be agreed or are you happy that everything is ok to go ahead as planned ? 
 

Would you rather delay or go ahead with no deal ? 

[mickbrown]

The rugby lad says it better then I can

 

[mickbrown]

And here’s another one, just for good measure. 
 

 

[Escobarp]

Not quite sure that was why he won the election tbh. But whatever floats your boat and makes you feel warm inside 

[Spider]

18 minutes ago, Escobarp said:

Not quite sure that was why he won the election tbh. But whatever floats your boat and makes you feel warm inside 

Me neither.

But he's done nothing but lie at every turn about Brexit.

Zero respect for him and I won't be the only one.

[Farrelli]

The loonies took over the asylum and the result won’t be pretty. 

[mickbrown]

28 minutes ago, Escobarp said:

Not quite sure that was why he won the election tbh. But whatever floats your boat and makes you feel warm inside 

Fair point. Obviously wasn’t just that that won him the election.
 

In fact, you can take out the reference to winning the election if you like and it still shows him to be a complete dick. 

[Cheese]

38 minutes ago, Escobarp said:

Not quite sure that was why he won the election tbh. But whatever floats your boat and makes you feel warm inside 

Of course that's what won him the election. It was basically his only policy.

https://time.com/5749478/get-brexit-done-slogan-uk-election/

Edited September 8, 2020 by Cheese

[Tonge moor green jacket]

5 hours ago, Ani said:

I was questioning the whole thing as it has never been explained what the final outcome looks like.

Do you think given the impact of Carona that the leave date should be flexed to allow a suitable deal to be agreed or are you happy that everything is ok to go ahead as planned ? 
 

Would you rather delay or go ahead with no deal ? 

When the virus first kicked off, I was all for extending the date. Still wouldn't be against it. Thats said, I can understand the concern that it would present more uncertainty for business.

However, there's also a counter argument that covid has fucked with business significantly anyhow, so ticking along temporarily as we have been might be the way to go.

To be honest, I don't think anyone can say either way with any certainty.

Whichever way we go, just do it properly. Lots of work for all nations to do at the moment with regard to economies. 

[Tonge moor green jacket]

2 hours ago, Mr Grey said:

Unfortunately some will blame the UK instead of the EU, when in fact the full details are not known.

Apparently state aid rules only apply to NI in the WA, the EU are wanting it to be applied to the whole of the UK, so 'apparently' they are exercising a clause (38), of which the Government reserves the right to make clarifications under the clause.

Yep. Lots of technical stuff. An admission that it could be breaking international law in parliament and a resignation on the other hand.

Still reckon its gamesmanship with a deadline approaching. Dangerous game though.

[mickbrown]

32 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

Yep. Lots of technical stuff. An admission that it could be breaking international law in parliament and a resignation on the other hand.

Still reckon its gamesmanship with a deadline approaching. Dangerous game though.

I’m guessing Starmer is looking forward to tomorrow

[Sweep]

12 minutes ago, mickbrown said:

I’m guessing Starmer is looking forward to tomorrow

He will be, its being made very easy for him at the minute.

[Tonge moor green jacket]

11 minutes ago, mickbrown said:

I’m guessing Starmer is looking forward to tomorrow

So he should be.

That said, if it focuses minds and a deal is sorted, then who knows, might be worth the risk.

High stakes game for sure.

Time will tell.

Not as interested in it at the moment to be honest. In, out, trade deal or not, if hundreds of thousands croak across the continent, there is going to be more of a focus elsewhere. 

[mickbrown]

25 minutes ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

So he should be.

That said, if it focuses minds and a deal is sorted, then who knows, might be worth the risk.

High stakes game for sure.

Time will tell.

Not as interested in it at the moment to be honest. In, out, trade deal or not, if hundreds of thousands croak across the continent, there is going to be more of a focus elsewhere. 

Aye, could take a back seat to everything else

[Gonk]

4 hours ago, Cheese said:

Of course that's what won him the election. It was basically his only policy.

https://time.com/5749478/get-brexit-done-slogan-uk-election/

Even as bad as he might be, at the time there was no credible opposition / alternative. Corbyn and his cronies were unelectable.

[Escobarp]

4 hours ago, Cheese said:

Of course that's what won him the election. It was basically his only policy.

https://time.com/5749478/get-brexit-done-slogan-uk-election/

It didn’t though did it. Just take a look back and look at the cunt sat opposite him in the House of Commons. That’s a bigger reason that he won the election. 

[Cheese]

6 minutes ago, Gonk said:

Even as bad as he might be, at the time there was no credible opposition / alternative. Corbyn and his cronies were unelectable.

 

5 minutes ago, Escobarp said:

It didn’t though did it. Just take a look back and look at the cunt sat opposite him in the House of Commons. That’s a bigger reason that he won the election. 

Fair comments. I agree, a dead duck would've beat Corbyn. But surely you can't deny that Johnson lied about his "oven ready deal". A "deal" that he is now betraying. A deal that certain Tory MP's voted for but are now describing as terrible.

[Escobarp]

32 minutes ago, Cheese said:

 

Fair comments. I agree, a dead duck would've beat Corbyn. But surely you can't deny that Johnson lied about his "oven ready deal". A "deal" that he is now betraying. A deal that certain Tory MP's voted for but are now describing as terrible.

It would appear he has shifted dramatically. And if the deal he crowed about suddenly becomes a shit deal then I for one want to understand why absolutely. 
 

[Spider]

So are we all ok that a British government would break the law, specifically so they don’t have to honour an agreement that they negotiated, voted on, signed, ratified, boasted about, won election on, but are now saying is shit?

We’re there, are we?

[bolty58]

22 hours ago, Spider said:

I've never been in a situation where the other party couldn't pick the phone up to a competitor if negotiations went to shit.

Precisely. We have the rest of the world to make deals with.

[Spider]

Just now, bolty58 said:

Precisely. We have the rest of the world to make deals with.

Correct.

Who needs smelly EU orders?

[bolty58]

1 minute ago, Spider said:

Correct.

Who needs smelly EU orders?

Not me! Tra-la-la....................