Boothy Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 Didn’t Blackpool dodge a points penalty ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 7 hours ago, Farrelli said: According to the local Stoke newspaper former Port Vale owner Norman Smurthwaite is looking at our situation as possible new owner. Asset stripper par excellence Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DomRepWanderer Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 9 minutes ago, Boo said: This could actually happen. https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/17632936.bolton-wanderers-attract-interest-from-chinese-investors/ Does sound promising. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tombwfc Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 32 minutes ago, Hoppy510 said: Nixon implying that the decision underpinning buying now from Anderson v buying out of admin = saving £28 million v 12 point deduction. Frankly I don't think this is the case or that the numbers are necessarily right, but if it was the case I'd rather take the deduction and hope the money was spent on putting together a team that would get promoted despite the deduction - and form the basis of a Championship contending side the following season. Playoffs might be doable starting on -12, but we'd need to be aiming for over 100 points to go up automatically. Whatever team you'd have to build to make that likely would probably cost £10m+. 10m for 12 points guaranteed would be a smart investment, if you had the money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Tonge moor green jacket Posted May 10, 2019 Site Supporter Share Posted May 10, 2019 Suppose it depends entirely on the actual debt. And dealing with kunterson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarence Carter Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 5 minutes ago, Boothy said: Didn’t Blackpool dodge a points penalty ? They did, don't know how they managed it. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/47899636 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
embankment Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 1 hour ago, Mounts Kipper said: This Chinese buyout please please come true, it doesn’t happen to BWFC does it. This will not happen. Not a cat in hells chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter RONNIE PHILLIPS Posted May 10, 2019 Site Supporter Share Posted May 10, 2019 Declan Rice to be our flagship signing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itdiddidit? Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 1 minute ago, embankment said: This will not happen. Not a cat in hells chance. nor a dog in hells chance flied wice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jol_BWFC Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 10 minutes ago, Clarence Carter said: They did, don't know how they managed it. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/47899636 Appointment of receivers is quite different to administration, so presumably not a breach of the EFL rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benny The Ball Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 38 minutes ago, Clarence Carter said: Would have to be some team to get promotion, we could be looking at a 20 point deduction. If we started on minus 20 we would have to play like league winners and aim to finish 6th and go up by the play offs In the last 5 seasons including this season in League one the gap between champions and 6th place has been 21 , 27 , 27 , 13 & 30 points so its theoretically possible in most seasons Realistically - a very tall order Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pricey Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 It's all speculation, the lot of it, the investors, the points deductions. Something I have learn't over the last few months since joining here, is don't believe fuck all until it happens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProfessorWoland Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 3 hours ago, Sluffy said: I'll have a punt at answering this but it really is very difficult to actually know what the answer is!. First of all I assume you are talking about the £5m loaned to KA who then loaned it to the club, which then went on to pay the BluMarble loan with. It seems by the time the loan was issued there must have been some doubt if Eddie would have got it back without securing the loan on something or other, as apparently he had loaned KA previously £3m (if what is H has been telling us is correct - and I've no reason to doubt him on that) as an unsecured loan. I guess if the 'trust' was still there then this £5m would have been loaned as per the previous one/s? The reason I have read that the loan was not secured against club assets directly was apparently and the clubs assets had been 'maxed' out, so it was secured instead against KA's assets I thought originally that the loan was against the share ownership but looking more deeply into it I believe the loan was secured against the company that owned the share ownership namely Inner Circle Investments Limited. And accordingly a charge for £5m was set against ICI Ltd. (on the 7th Sept, 2018) https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/09782053/charges/fm5WZUnhZHCq-kA5LdXv1g9627M Ken in turn some days later then presumably 'found' £5m from somewhere because he made himself a secured creditor of the club (presumably for the £5m) on the 27th Sept, 2018, BUT under his own name and not that of ICI Ltd! https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/00043026/charges/zuFLo9CUMVpD9kLSumePBFGSR-g Poor Eddie passed away on the 11th Sept, 2018 And the BluMarble loan was reportedly settled on the 12th Sept, 2018 - presumably for circa £5m, being £4m capital plus around £800k interest(?). https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/45483786 However note the timeline for all these events If BM was paid £5m on the 12th Sept, then where did the £5m KA loaned the club come from TWO WEEKS LATER? Companies House clearly shows the BM loan being satisfied on the 24th September... https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/03674979/charges/_53gxL4LeazNGlMRE9QxDhU0CgQ ...so where did his £5m come from to secure against the club 27th Sept? I can only reason from all this that the £5m Eddie loaned KA to pay BM actually did happen and that the £5m Ken put in the club as a secured creditor was completely separate and apart from the Davies loan. In short it really was from KA (although that may have been funded on advances on player sales and ST sales revenue, factored in advance?) Are you still with me so far! We've dealt I think with the monies going in, so what about the money being paid back? I won't trouble you by repeating the lengthy and informative narrative Howard has previously given on this and just pick things up where H has informed us that putting the club into Admin does not invalidate the sum of £5m still being owed to Eddies estate. As it stands as far as I understand it, it basically means that if the default is called in by Moonshine they take control of ICI Ltd, who are the holding company for the club. IF I've got this correct (and I certainly don't guarantee I have!) then I also believe that the conditions of the loan also prevent ICI Ltd going into voluntary Liquidation as H suggests it may well do so. I say this on the basis of the charge saying - under 5.2 that disposal of security assets can't be made (and security assets being defined in the Definitions as all of the assets subject to the deed). Therefore in my thinking anyway, if the deed is about taking control of ICI in default, then how can it dispose of itself first by voluntary liquidation? https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/09782053/charges/fm5WZUnhZHCq-kA5LdXv1g9627M Of course I am very much out of my depth on these matters and would appreciate comments and or guidance from those who are more knowledgeable about these things? If however Moonshift calls in the debt, taking charge of the share ownership by acquiring ICI would settle the £5m debt in full. I can only hazard guess at what happens in the event of an Administrator taking control but as far as I understand things the shareholders lose their rights immediately? If so and Moonshift not calling in their debt - they would be presumably in a position to serve notice to take over ICI Ltd and I guess if there are insufficient funds there, they simply go after the Director for the balance if the company is found to be trading whilst insolvent? Ken still has a secured £5m in the club (which on paper at least seems to be his personal money?) so he would be in a position to fulfil that obligation if necessary? I'm sorry that I am unable to give a definitive answer to your question and hopefully others who are more knowledgeable on these matters can add to/shoot down to my reply above, whichever is the most relevant to do so. One small item of interest whilst I was researching the facts to answer your query was an article by Iles dated 10th September, which included this sentence - "The funding gap for the next 12 months, taking into consideration only those debts which are due and outstanding bills, is thought to be close to £13m". I'm not intending to be an apologist for Anderson but it wasn't any secret that he was not funding the club from his personal wealth and with a £13m black hole in funding to plug, then is it really such a big surprise that players, HMRC and everybody else ended up not getting paid and the club looking to move into Administration 8/9 months later? https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/16833145.bolton-wanderers-set-for-administration/ Thank you very much for such a detailed answer. It's reassured me in a funny way as I worried when I asked the question that I was simply being dim in still not being sure what had happened, but reading your account I feel better as I'll bet I'm not the only one that hadn't followed all of this. I'm going to read this again now, sit down in a darkened room and see if I've got it fully worked out but until then thanks again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc505 Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, Mounts Kipper said: Really!! GTF any crest any colour, they can put Chinese writing in the players undies for all I care. What's point then? Lose your identity and what's next, move it to another town? Well they weren't arsed when we changed their heritage and our surveys show we'd make more money in x place than Bolton so we'll shift it all. Fuck that. Edited May 10, 2019 by Marc505 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc505 Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 2 hours ago, Mantra said: The kit change wouldn’t bother me too much but the name change would be a bit different. However as long as it had Bolton in the name not much of a big deal. Like when Hull’s owner wanted to change from Hull City to Hull Tigers. I get why people made a fuss over it but with owners like Oyston and Anderson around, I don’t think changing our name to Bolton Lions is the worst thing that could happen to us. And of course it could always be changed back. Anyway getting a bit ahead of ourselves. Getting taken over by super rich Chinese is unlikely in itself, one step at a time, then we can argue about the cost of our identity... To be fair yeah we're more likely to be taken over by the pop man than this lot so it's pointless worrying. Rola Cola Wanderers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Zico Posted May 10, 2019 Moderators Share Posted May 10, 2019 1 hour ago, Mounts Kipper said: I’d doubt they’d be doing that business on BWFC property. Prob not, just thinking up scenarios which don't get my hopes up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Zico Posted May 10, 2019 Moderators Share Posted May 10, 2019 55 minutes ago, Boo said: This could actually happen. https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/17632936.bolton-wanderers-attract-interest-from-chinese-investors/ Mark Taylor looks like a reanimated corpse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TroySwoosh Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 1 minute ago, ZicoKelly said: Mark Taylor looks like a reanimated corpse Well the chinese are leading the world in crazy science experiments, I hear Emiliano Sala's available Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Supporter Tonge moor green jacket Posted May 10, 2019 Site Supporter Share Posted May 10, 2019 I'm with you Marc. Fuck around too much and you turn folk off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blondi Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 1 hour ago, Boo said: This could actually happen. https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/17632936.bolton-wanderers-attract-interest-from-chinese-investors/ I actually think I'll ball my eyes out crying with happiness if this comes true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barrycowdrill Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 The very thought of anyone with a couple of quid to their name let alone this mob interested in taking us on fills me with scepticism, fear and basically a ‘will they bollocks’ attitude beaten down by all this I just can’t get excited about anything or anyone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mounts Kipper Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 (edited) 47 minutes ago, Marc505 said: What's point then? Lose your identity and what's next, move it to another town? Well they weren't arsed when we changed their heritage and our surveys show we'd make more money in x place than Bolton so we'll shift it all. Fuck that. I’ll worry about that if and when the Chinese takeover and if your wild scenario ever came to fruition. Edited May 10, 2019 by Mounts Kipper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pricey Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 8 minutes ago, barrycowdrill said: The very thought of anyone with a couple of quid to their name let alone this mob interested in taking us on fills me with scepticism, fear and basically a ‘will they bollocks’ attitude beaten down by all this I just can’t get excited about anything or anyone This!! Well said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 47 minutes ago, ZicoKelly said: Mark Taylor looks like a reanimated corpse I thought it was Jeremy Kyle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ10 Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 Parent company has some revenue :-/ from Bassini to this... deffo too good to be true! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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