Shrewsbury Town (H)

[Biggish Dave]

Didn't think Baxter could have done anything with the first or Pompey's goal tbh.

The 2nd last night went through a lot of bodies so he'll have seen it late for sure. 

Doubt Coleman would have done any better, doubt Trafford would have either if he was still with us

[FrancisFogarty]

27 minutes ago, Casino said:

Maybe, but its a moot point

They’re all moot today because it didn’t happen.

[Eddie]

10 minutes ago, Traf said:

We win last night with Coleman in goal...

Joel would have got pelters for letting either of those past him last night and probably the one on Saturday.

It’s a fair point but let’s not start pretending that Baxter needs to be a scapegoat. We also probably lose at Bristol Rovers due to some of the saves Baxter pulled off in those 5 mins post half time and you can’t account for the amount of times that Coleman would have rushed out for unknown reasons causing us problems.

We have plenty of issues but Baxter isn’t one (that’s a pretty shit remix of Jay-Z’s version).

[barrycowdrill]

11 minutes ago, Ani said:

the fact Evatt mentioned it surely means he expected the players to do something ?

 

The idea of just ignoring it is bizarre. There is no one within 10 yards when he shoots. 
 

 

At any level we know a basic rule is pick up any spare men. However there’s also people floating around where you think “he’s not too much of a risk there” and without Rico being in the middle there may have been a view of an extra body for extra security in the box. 
 

if the coaches felt that him being on the edge of the box was a massive risk they would’ve stood someone on him without question. No debate. 
 

the fact no one is anywhere near him can quite easily lead to the view no one was tasked with doing that as the risk was pretty low. 
 

even on the pitch someone would’ve / should’ve been screaming for him to be picked up if it was highlighted in advance 

[bolton va va]

Their goal from the corner......whether it was by design or not, there was a major kerfuffle in the box before the corner was taken that was a big distraction & would have taken our defenders' eyes off the bloke outside the box,.....plus the loss of Santos & Jones & reshuffle of all 3 defenders was sure to unbalance the defence to some extent.......& he did hit it well, i bet he can't do that often,

but Evatt's fault obvs

[FrancisFogarty]

They're all proffesional footballers having been playing since they were kids same as us all. They should know , without being told to pick someone up.

[ianofcleveleys]

2 hours ago, BeeversLeftPeg said:

We continued doing the same thing in the 2nd half when they got corners too. Madness really.

We've given very similar goals away previously this season, with all our bodies in a crowd scene around the 6 yard box and no obviously designated charger and blocker if the ball drops to their bloke on the edge.

It's either stubbornness of approach or, as Evatt's alluding to regarding that goal, players not taking personal responsibility for jobs explained to them and being alive to what's emerging in front of them

There just looked to be a bit of general fatigue / malaise about our defending last night, tiring minds as well as bodies. The efforts to prevent their first goal were pretty lame 

[JimmyRiddle]

It's not all about marking players and runners though,  some should be covering zones.

As I say, a player to hover around the penalty spot could have got to their player last night, or mopped up any second ball we headed clear.

It's so basic??

 

[Under_Score]

In my opinion IE was just shifting the blame onto the players with his comment about the corner routine. If he has had that discussion pre match with the players, how come even after they scored that goal, no one was picking up the attackers on the outside of the box. Surely if it had been discussed and was a mistake from the players point of view, then the player in the same position is picked up on the next corner which didn’t happen. 

Edited April 17 by Under_Score

[barrycowdrill]

1 minute ago, Under_Score said:

In my opinion IE was just putting the blame on the players with his comment about the corner routine. If he has had that discussion pre match with the players, how come even after they scored that goal, no one was picking up the attackers on the outside of the box. Surely if it had been discussed and was a mistake from the players point of view, then the player in the same position is picked up on the next corner which didn’t happen. 

Valid point. Which shows if it was picked up and discussed then they felt it was worth ignoring. Even after we had got stung by it 

[mattbwfc19]

we've done it every game this season, not marking the men on the edge of the box. We have always packed the penalty area with all 11 players in there. its something the players would've been told to do.

[Stig]

2 hours ago, bolton va va said:

Their goal from the corner......whether it was by design or not, there was a major kerfuffle in the box before the corner was taken that was a big distraction & would have taken our defenders' eyes off the bloke outside the box,.....plus the loss of Santos & Jones & reshuffle of all 3 defenders was sure to unbalance the defence to some extent.......& he did hit it well, i bet he can't do that often,

but Evatt's fault obvs

This is how we've set up all season defending corners. We don't leave a man up field and we don't mark the edge of the box.

I understand the rationale - the statistical thinking will be that the more men you pack in the box, the fewer goals you concede, as less likely for clean headers and pot shots from the edge of the box are low likelihood to go in.

But this is the way the players have been coached to defend corners definitely all season, so a coaching issue. We saw a carbon copy at Wycombe away.

[Johnnyrotten]

I haven't trawled through comments, no doubt its been commented on, but if one thing absolutely baffles me about IEs tactics its the defensive set up at corners.  11 back, so that all the opposition can become attackers with no threat of a breakaway, and yet little or no marking. 

So Derby profit in the biggest game of our season, and Shrewsbury score a virtual promotion clincher for Derby. 

At least one other example off top of my head - Wigan's 1st goal here.  But even if its just 1 goal a season its enough, on top of the removal of any realistic attempt at a counter attack.  It also gives possession back immediately to them if we clear it, so they get another chance to build.  Its frustrating to say the least, I'm not having it that these teams would have got the results they got if we'd just chosen to mark men instead of space.

[Mantra]

5 hours ago, gonzo said:

Exactly what @CumbrianWhitewas saying last night. 

Wish we would identify things like this in game and change our system to counteract it.

No idea why we don’t bring off a defender and bring on an extra forward player rather than doing what we did last night which was bring Dempsey off, play Collins in behind Charles and Nlundulu.

Forrester had a stinker, was like watching Aimson in possession again. Spare man constantly doing nothing with it. If we’d brought on Randell for him, we could have had Collins and him on the wings and had a different element to our game.

[embankment]

Be Reet 

[Johnnyrotten]

50 minutes ago, Stig said:

This is how we've set up all season defending corners. We don't leave a man up field and we don't mark the edge of the box.

I understand the rationale - the statistical thinking will be that the more men you pack in the box, the fewer goals you concede, as less likely for clean headers and pot shots from the edge of the box are low likelihood to go in.

But this is the way the players have been coached to defend corners definitely all season, so a coaching issue. We saw a carbon copy at Wycombe away.

Agree with your post - that's how we play, rightly or wrongly.  I would add that surely there would be less clean headers and virtually no pot shots from the edge of the box if someone was stood on their toes?  I get that anyone can beat anyone else in a challenge, but as a minimum you'd expect some physical jostling etc would remove the chance of a "free" header or shot.  We just seem to invite it, and just hope the lack of quality at L1 level keeps the ball out of the net - we've seen loads of shots hit high or wide, we aren't playing against great players, but why give them a chance to find out.

[peebles]

15 hours ago, RUREADY2ROLL said:

Need to rest Sheehan, Santos, Charles and Jones until the playoffs which is 2 1/2 week off. Hopefully they will be fit by then.

Charles ran over to the bench and took some tablets after the 2nd goal. If he's fit he needs minutes to sharpen up but is he fit?

[Burndens Bogs]

Having played amateur footy for many years, the first thing you do whilst defending a corner is put a man on anyone who’s hanging around outside your penalty area.

It isn’t rocket science.

Having said that, the bloke who scored could take that shot 100 times and 99 of them would  end up in the North Upper.

[QFPants]

Was an unbelievable strike, but early in the second half they took a short corner and from memory we were a bit lucky to get a block on the pull back as they tried to work it to the edge of the box (and unmarked man) a 2nd time, so it’s not like lessons were learned

[Stig]

1 hour ago, Johnnyrotten said:

Agree with your post - that's how we play, rightly or wrongly.  I would add that surely there would be less clean headers and virtually no pot shots from the edge of the box if someone was stood on their toes?  I get that anyone can beat anyone else in a challenge, but as a minimum you'd expect some physical jostling etc would remove the chance of a "free" header or shot.  We just seem to invite it, and just hope the lack of quality at L1 level keeps the ball out of the net - we've seen loads of shots hit high or wide, we aren't playing against great players, but why give them a chance to find out.

Yeah I'm not a fan of 11 back within 12 yards of our goal at all. I understand the rationale, but as I mentioned after the Wycombe game, I think the statistics will be misleading on this as they won't count all the second, third, fourth phase play after we've given the ball back to the opposition unopposed.

Imagine if we were left with a man free on the edge of the box for a pot shots every game, we'd love it

[Traf]

6 hours ago, Eddie said:

It’s a fair point but let’s not start pretending that Baxter needs to be a scapegoat. We also probably lose at Bristol Rovers due to some of the saves Baxter pulled off in those 5 mins post half time and you can’t account for the amount of times that Coleman would have rushed out for unknown reasons causing us problems.

We have plenty of issues but Baxter isn’t one (that’s a pretty shit remix of Jay-Z’s version).

Not scapegoating, mate, not my style.
They were all shit last night, apart from Maghoma and possibly Jerome.

I was merely offering an alternate to the 'strikers missing easy chances' script.
If you keep clean sheets, you can't lose and only need a goal to win.
We shouldn't need to be scoring three to beat Shrewsbury at home.

[Dr Faustus]

tbh I'm more disappointed with Baxter on the first, his angles are slightly wrong- it was barely blasted past him. Joel, with his bigger frame, possibly saves that. Similar to Portsmouth.

That said, its also his responsibility to organise and ensure edges are picked up, unless expressly told not to; the shot itself though was travelling, and moved- the two defenders in the way hamper his reaction time

[Johnnyrotten]

18 hours ago, RUREADY2ROLL said:

Need to rest Sheehan, Santos, Charles and Jones until the playoffs which is 2 1/2 week off. Hopefully they will be fit by then.

3 of those 4 are carrying an injury but Charles is coming back from one, he looked bloody awful last night so presume he needs game time to get upto speed before the play offs.

[Johnnyrotten]

11 hours ago, radcliffe white said:

Absolutely and I’ve been saying this for the last 2/3 transfer windows, I love JDB but he’s a sicknote and his record is clear to see, the other 2 have brought absolutely nothing 

I like JDB too and accept he doesn't always play well (like every striker we have) but how is he a sicknote?  Injured last night but not sure when that last happened.  Charles, Dan, Vic, Santos etc all sick notes this season in comparison to Bod.

[Lt. Aldo Raine]

6 minutes ago, Johnnyrotten said:

I like JDB too and accept he doesn't always play well (like every striker we have) but how is he a sicknote?  Injured last night but not sure when that last happened.  Charles, Dan, Vic, Santos etc all sick notes this season in comparison to Bod.

To be fair, he missed 27 matches through injury last season and took a while to get up to speed this season

He's now also out for the rest of this season