Quitting palace. Where next? Back to sun'lun?

IF we had made it to the Champions' League we would have been unseeded in the qualifying round. Of the 14 teams we might have met only 3 lost (including Ajax). Both the Glasgow 'giants' were seeded, however, as were Tampere United, so qualification was certainly possible.

IF we had got into the last 32 we would have been in the lowest pot. None of the pot 4 teams which had begun in the qualifying rounds made the last 16, although Olympiakos, the only direct entrants to the group stage to be in pot 4, did make the last 16.

I think it’s prefty much gospel that one of the three names Allardyce wanted was Habib Beye. Didn’t know Sorin was one, though I recall we chased him for ages one summer.

 

As for his Newcastle signings, Geremi’s knees were absolutely shot by the time he rocked up there. Chelsea laughed all the way to the bank with that one.

Alan Smith was never the same after injury, and his lengthy contract still boils the Geordies piss.

 

Couple of dodgy centre halves too on his record I recall. Rozehnal & Cacapa. His transfer record up there is definitely still lambasted to this day.

yeah forgot about Anelka, they hardly continually opened the chequebook though - Anelka, Diouf, maybe Campo?

 

you reap what you sow

 

cue Casino's graph

 

which will probably lead to Gonzo's Muamba stats at some point as the blame game starts as to why we got relegated

 

At the time Allardyce left he'd spent the previous summer saying he wanted to go until Eddie offered up the big money for a striker, we got Anelka.

 

You have to look at Eddie's involvement, to that point he'd helped the club out of a desperate situation with a modest amount of money and then started to back Sam with some money for Diouf, Anelka etc...but I still think he saw himself as someone safeguarding the club rather than bankrolling it.

 

I think that changed later (understand he sold some of his other businesses though nobody seems sure) but whether it was Eddie's personal situation or the club's I don't know. But I do think the context was that Eddie didn't particularly want to bankroll Sam long term, knowing that every window he'd be asked for more, when he'd been very reluctant to spend his money directly on players up until that point.

 

Of course in hindsight its different. But I can't really blame Eddie for in that particular moment thinking "you've just had my money to break the club's record transfer fee". 

Sam was told that there was no money left until the next Sky money came in the summer.

That's why there was money to spend after he'd gone. It wasn't because they were withholding it.

Of course in hindsight its different. But I can't really blame Eddie for in that particular moment thinking "you've just had my money to break the club's record transfer fee". 

 

aye, not at all, me neither, but likewise you can't blame Alladyce for wanting to do the best for the club as he could and take it as far as he could, every season under him we progressed and got stronger, and he saw that the next step would need more investment

 

it wasn't coming, and we know what happened next

 

can't blame Sam either for leaving, there just seems to be a lot more animosity than he probably deserves when you look at his 8 years, but it seems to mostly come from folk seemingly naive enough to believe the official line about needing a break from the game, because it was about as transparent and believable as any other excuse offered by other managers with ambition that we couldn't match who wanted to move on

Edited January 9, 20188 yr by ZicoKelly

Looking back Allardyce had earned the right to ask for that money and if he’d got it we most likely extended our stay in premiership it was a dropped bollock without a doubt especially as we gave that and more to Megson.

Edited January 9, 20188 yr by Mounts Kipper

I think it’s prefty much gospel that one of the three names Allardyce wanted was Habib Beye. Didn’t know Sorin was one, though I recall we chased him for ages one summer.

 

As for his Newcastle signings, Geremi’s knees were absolutely shot by the time he rocked up there. Chelsea laughed all the way to the bank with that one.

Alan Smith was never the same after injury, and his lengthy contract still boils the Geordies piss.

 

Couple of dodgy centre halves too on his record I recall. Rozehnal & Cacapa. His transfer record up there is definitely still lambasted to this day.

Thing is, Sam may well have got the best out of them. Ben Haim, Dioufy and Faye were all great for him. Not so much without

IF we had made it to the Champions' League we would have been unseeded in the qualifying round. Of the 14 teams we might have met only 3 lost (including Ajax). Both the Glasgow 'giants' were seeded, however, as were Tampere United, so qualification was certainly possible.

IF we had got into the last 32 we would have been in the lowest pot. None of the pot 4 teams which had begun in the qualifying rounds made the last 16, although Olympiakos, the only direct entrants to the group stage to be in pot 4, did make the last 16.

 

Is this based on finishing 4th? I know its highly unlikely but we could have finished higher and how would this have impacted on seeding?

Edited January 9, 20188 yr by freds dad

Looking back Allardyce had earned the right to ask for that money and if he’d got it we most likely extended our stay in premiership it was a dropped bollock without a doubt especially as we gave that and more to Megson.

 

 

Sam was told that there was no money left until the next Sky money came in the summer.

That's why there was money to spend after he'd gone. It wasn't because they were withholding it.

Is this based on finishing 4th? I know its highly unlikely but we could have finished higher and how would this have impacted on seeding?

 

Third or fourth. At that time only top two went directly to group stage.

The thing he conveniently glosses over is that he'd have fucked off a year earlier with the full backing of Gartside if he'd got his way.

Edited January 9, 20188 yr by mickbrown

aye, not at all, me neither, but likewise you can't blame Alladyce for wanting to do the best for the club as he could and take it as far as he could, every season under him we progressed and got stronger, and he saw that the next step would need more investment

 

it wasn't coming, and we know what happened next

 

can't blame Sam either for leaving, there just seems to be a lot more animosity than he probably deserves when you look at his 8 years, but it seems to mostly come from folk seemingly naive enough to believe the official line about needing a break from the game, because it was about as transparent and believable as any other excuse offered by other managers with ambition that we couldn't match who wanted to move on

  

Looking back Allardyce had earned the right to ask for that money and if he’d got it we most likely extended our stay in premiership it was a dropped bollock without a doubt especially as we gave that and more to Megson.

We had huge discussions on here when he left. The general consensus was that gartside was right in not going too far with spending and endangering the club.

We'll never know which way it would have gone had Sam been given the money.

Daft thing is, we seemingly did fuck up with spending in trying to stay in then get back into the premier league.

 

Hindsight is great, but I bare no I'll will to either. Stuff happens, but football carries on.

  

We had huge discussions on here when he left. The general consensus was that gartside was right in not going too far with spending and endangering the club.

 

 

I thought most of the discussion was whether Sam had been caught screwing Gartside's wife or daughter.

aye, not at all, me neither, but likewise you can't blame Alladyce for wanting to do the best for the club as he could and take it as far as he could, every season under him we progressed and got stronger, and he saw that the next step would need more investment

 

it wasn't coming, and we know what happened next

 

can't blame Sam either for leaving, there just seems to be a lot more animosity than he probably deserves when you look at his 8 years, but it seems to mostly come from folk seemingly naive enough to believe the official line about needing a break from the game, because it was about as transparent and believable as any other excuse offered by other managers with ambition that we couldn't match who wanted to move on

 

I honestly don't think Sam had the best interests of the club at heart. He was looking at his own career post nearly but not actually getting the England job.

 

I don't blame him. But the narrative that he would have stayed forever if Eddie had forked out in January simply isn't true. Lets say we spent some money but narrowly missed out on 4th place. Then what? Sam wouldn't have said "fair enough" he'd have wanted to spend more in the summer. Eventually there would be a point where he would have left anyway because a bigger club would have come for him.

 

I don't blame him at all. But he put a particular spin on his exit that some think is gospel. The club backed him that season when many would have dumped him over panorama and 6 months later not only did he leave (via a lie about wanting a break) but also proceeded to slag the club off for not backing him, time and time and time again. The man had no grace and what was a shame was that he left before the last game and we didn't even get to give him a proper send off. 

Edited January 11, 20188 yr by bwfcfan5

We've been here before; no doubt it still rankles with him somewhat. He seems to always have a bit of bitterness.

 

Garty always said he'd be happy for Sam to go to a big club; I don't think he expected him to stay forever.

 

Remember an interview on radio manc where he said if utd came knocking he'd drive Sam there himself.

There was undoubtedly a good relationship there that went terribly sour.

Shame, but its chip wrappers now.

aye and one bloke cant give his side of the story

 

if sam was asked about it again, id hope he'd just say i think i did a fantastic job, shame how it ended but its all water under the bridge

Absolutely.

aye and one bloke cant give his side of the story

 

if sam was asked about it again, id hope he'd just say i think i did a fantastic job, shame how it ended but its all water under the bridge

 

that's pretty much what he said in that video wasn't it?  and then when asked not so long ago about a return:

 

http://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/wanderers/15648058.Big_Sam__I_won_t_manage_Bolton_Wanderers_again__but_I_d_be_willing_to_help_in_the_future/

 

“Maybe one day, if they needed help, and they wanted to properly move forward, get back into the Premier League and re-invent themselves then I’d come on in some capacity.”

 

Allardyce says he regrets the bitterness which ensued after his departure at Wanderers, shortly before they embarked on a second European campaign.

 

“Even now, I will say it was still such a shame to have left the club under the circumstances I did. It was my very, very sad decision to make,”

 

That to me sums up the sentiments you want him to express, those being it's a shame how it ended, but it's water under the bridge, because he'd be open to coming back in some capacity at some point

 

that's pretty much what he said in that video wasn't it?  and then when asked not so long ago about a return:

 

http://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/wanderers/15648058.Big_Sam__I_won_t_manage_Bolton_Wanderers_again__but_I_d_be_willing_to_help_in_the_future/

 

“Maybe one day, if they needed help, and they wanted to properly move forward, get back into the Premier League and re-invent themselves then I’d come on in some capacity.”

 

Allardyce says he regrets the bitterness which ensued after his departure at Wanderers, shortly before they embarked on a second European campaign.

 

“Even now, I will say it was still such a shame to have left the club under the circumstances I did. It was my very, very sad decision to make,”

 

That to me sums up the sentiments you want him to express, those being it's a shame how it ended, but it's water under the bridge, because he'd be open to coming back in some capacity at some point

 

 

It doesn't stop him telling everyone how "lacking in ambition the club was" every single interview he does where he has that opportunity. 

 

Its almost like he regrets leaving and is trying to justify it to himself. 

 

Its no shame a manager outgrowing a club. He very clearly had. But even if you're frustrated, even if you've fallen out with a long term friend, you can still leave with a bit of grace and best wishes.

 

Nobody came out of it well, but only Sam is left to still bang the same drum. 

It doesn't stop him telling everyone how "lacking in ambition the club was" every single interview he does where he has that opportunity. 

 

Its almost like he regrets leaving and is trying to justify it to himself. 

 

Its no shame a manager outgrowing a club. He very clearly had. But even if you're frustrated, even if you've fallen out with a long term friend, you can still leave with a bit of grace and best wishes.

 

Nobody came out of it well, but only Sam is left to still bang the same drum.

 

You may well be right about him justifying his decision to himself. Maybe he wonders what might have been.

Not arsed now.

Still wouldn't surprise me to see him involved in some way in a takeover later, but equally it might never happen.

You can forgive some of the turgid footy Sam serves up when you're picking up the points. When you're getting gubbed however...

Edited January 13, 20188 yr by Duck Egg

You can forgive some of the turgid footy Sam serves up when you're picking up the points. When you're getting gubbed however...

Very true.

 

This is as bad as anything koeman did at the end, utter dross.

Maybe its the players?

Its everyone, players, manager, dof, owner.

Very true.

 

This is as bad as anything koeman did at the end, utter dross.

Quite right. Because he did well here, it doesn't mean everyone else has to love him.

 

Difference from our hey day was I think he was cutting edge in transfers pro zone etc now he is simply efficient. A big difference in my opinion