Keep Get Rid

[Tonge moor green jacket]

12 hours ago, VividDreamer said:

He’s got another year at Sunderland 

Ta.

Will be going either way- they are unlikely to take him back and play him.

[Zico]

It's funny

Know a Grimsby lad who asks how McAtee and Matete are doing

He rates them highly 

Was expecting better

In hindsight I should've reminded myself that he saw them at NL and L2 level

[ianofcleveleys]

1 hour ago, Zico said:

It's funny

Know a Grimsby lad who asks how McAtee and Matete are doing

He rates them highly 

Was expecting better

In hindsight I should've reminded myself that he saw them at NL and L2 level

I think that's where there's been a bit of an issue this season, players like those two and Collins, Schon, Tutu,  have been brought in with significant outlay and related hype about them helping make us 'championship ready' when there's been little in their CV to suggest that L1 isn't their ceiling. 

Schon and Tutu a bit harder to judge as their backgrounds/journeys have been different, but the others have done all that they've done at L1 level or, largely, below. The two outliers amongst them are Dan, who somehow played a dozen games of Premier League football, and Vic, who played 60 games in the Championship. 

Matete has played 8 games in Championship but hardly enough to suggest he'd elevate us in midfield and he's looked what he's been, an average L1 player. 

Collins wasn't exactly prolific for Forest Green or Bristol Rovers, while McAtee was bought on the back of one decent season in L1 for Barnsley. Prior to that, 4 in 26 games for Grimsby and 1 in 30 for Scunthorpe.

Of course, a player can improve in an environment and structure that suits them and, in reality, it could be argued those two's numbers for us are about as good this season as can have been expected

I suppose where I'm going with it is we've shelled a lot out on a host of players who aren't as good / productive as we might have been led to believe. In some cases because they've been played out of position (Vic, arguably McAtee), in others because they've turned out injury prone, and generally because they fitted into Evatt and Markham's fanciful idea of how we were going to flick and trick our way out of the Division

[Zico]

9 minutes ago, ianofcleveleys said:

I think that's where there's been a bit of an issue this season, players like those two and Collins, Schon, Tutu,  have been brought in with significant outlay and related hype about them helping make us 'championship ready' when there's been little in their CV to suggest that L1 isn't their ceiling. 

Schon and Tutu a bit harder to judge as their backgrounds/journeys have been different, but the others have done all that they've done at L1 level or, largely, below. The two outliers amongst them are Dan, who somehow played a dozen games of Premier League football, and Vic, who played 60 games in the Championship. 

Matete has played 8 games in Championship but hardly enough to suggest he'd elevate us in midfield and he's looked what he's been, an average L1 player. 

Collins wasn't exactly prolific for Forest Green or Bristol Rovers, while McAtee was bought on the back of one decent season in L1 for Barnsley. Prior to that, 4 in 26 games for Grimsby and 1 in 30 for Scunthorpe.

Of course, a player can improve in an environment and structure that suits them and, in reality, it could be argued those two's numbers for us are about as good this season as can have been expected

I suppose where I'm going with it is we've shelled a lot out on a host of players who aren't as good / productive as we might have been led to believe. In some cases because they've been played out of position (Vic, arguably McAtee), in others because they've turned out injury prone, and generally because they fitted into Evatt and Markham's fanciful idea of how we were going to flick and trick our way out of the Division

McAtee did have a 14 in 37 season when Grimsby got promoted from the NL and a fair few assists, that's the reason my mate rates him

but yeah, whilst we got McAtee and Matete off Championship clubs, they've done nothing at that level and been deemed surplus to requirements, hence we got them

[ianofcleveleys]

I spoke to a Barnsley lad a few months back about McAtee, to get a sense of how they got what they did out of him. His view was that he didn't really have a defined position but it worked for them in how they were set up, he tended to float around mainly on the right, just off their front men.

Problem we have is him and Collins are of the same ilk, floaters, mavericks, who like dropping off the front, facing the goal while somebody else does the heavy lifting and is the man who stays between the posts. Evatt had four goes, with those two, Vic and Dan but none of them are that person. Doyle did a great job of that sort, at the level he could manage at his age, has never been replaced.

[Stig]

On 28/04/2025 at 12:24, Johnnyrotten said:

I think the chat about Matete (valid points, I'm not saying he's perfect by any stretch) just illustrates that we can't say "keep or get rid" without knowing what the alternatives are.  If we can sign that 32 year old ex championship defensive midfielder who tackles and drives the team on, get rid of Matete by all means. 

If its essentially the current midfield, we'd be losing our only tackler and only player capable of beating a man and carrying the ball forward.  He would also look better with a proper CF to pass to.  Just in the last 3 games I lost count of the number of times he played a good 10 or 15 yard pass into the feet of Lolos, Etete, Collins or McAtee and with a Wrexham or Stockport forward that ball sticks and we create a half chance.  But with us it just bounces off them, the ball is cleared and Matete is running back to retrieve a situation he's partly to blame for, out of position by overestimating our ability to hold up a simple ball.

 

It's a good point, but given the limited scope to make space in the squad and how easy he is to get rid of, I'd get rid and hope we can do better.

To me he's a known quantity and not good enough for a promotion chasing team imo. He's had a couple of good spells but not consistently shown up over the season. So, take the punt and see who else we can get for me.

[Johnnyrotten]

3 hours ago, Stig said:

It's a good point, but given the limited scope to make space in the squad and how easy he is to get rid of, I'd get rid and hope we can do better.

To me he's a known quantity and not good enough for a promotion chasing team imo. He's had a couple of good spells but not consistently shown up over the season. So, take the punt and see who else we can get for me.

Fair enough, it will be interesting to return to this topic on 1st September, see who's in our midfield!  Only then can we judge, but happy to let SS get on with reshaping his own squad. 

Re not being good enough for a promotion chasing team, hard to say as it depends who else is in the squad, but IMO we currently look weaker when he doesn't play and I'd be hard pressed to come up with many of our squad that could be in the category of "good enough for a promotion chasing team".  A big summer for SS.

[TrickyTrotter]

Also Player's Player of the Season

 

[Big E]

12 hours ago, Tonge moor green jacket said:

Ta.

Will be going either way- they are unlikely to take him back and play him.

If Schumacher wants him sound but really he’s another nlundulu. Done very little on his loan 

[DazBob]

10 minutes ago, Big E said:

If Schumacher wants him sound but really he’s another nlundulu.

Sickening.

[Dr. Feelgood]

12 hours ago, TrickyTrotter said:

Also Player's Player of the Season

Well done to the lad. Never seen him but that's an achievement.  Problem is most of us will write him off. He has to be worth a squad place this coming season.

[frank_spencer]

If we were signing a you lad who was the previous season player of the season at Crewe we'd be thinking it a good signing. 

Conway has more than shown he's up to playing for us.

[meanderson93]

8 minutes ago, frank_spencer said:

If we were signing a you lad who was the previous season player of the season at Crewe we'd be thinking it a good signing. 

Conway has more than shown he's up to playing for us.

Definitely gives you a good perspective of what we've got doesn't it when you look at it as if we were linked to signing him. 

21 Year Old, 6 Foot, Left Back/LWB, Player and Player's Player of the Year at a League 2 club that finished 12th and he scored their goal of the season. 

How much would we be paying for that player do we reckon? 

[bolton va va]

I've never seen Conway play so don't know how good he is, but having had a successful season playing in men's football at a good level, he must be the best hope of one of our young players breaking into the 1st team squad next season.

Sending players out on loan has worked well this season with Conway & Morley ( even Dan seemed to do well at Cambridge )& weeded out one or two others.

It might be better for the likes of Big Dave, SSA & Inwood to have a season gaining experience & toughening up in League 2/national league rather than a few minutes here & there in our 1st team squad.

[Rival Son]

4 hours ago, Dr. Feelgood said:

He has to be worth a squad place this coming season.

Isn’t he a free place in the squad, as a 21 year old academy graduate?

No-brainer, if so.

[Dr. Feelgood]

1 hour ago, Rival Son said:

Isn’t he a free place in the squad, as a 21 year old academy graduate?

No-brainer, if so.

Yep.

Injured by mid September for my money.

[Johnnyrotten]

5 hours ago, meanderson93 said:

Definitely gives you a good perspective of what we've got doesn't it when you look at it as if we were linked to signing him. 

21 Year Old, 6 Foot, Left Back/LWB, Player and Player's Player of the Year at a League 2 club that finished 12th and he scored their goal of the season. 

How much would we be paying for that player do we reckon? 

I hope he comes back so that we can have a look at him in our team and he fully deservers a chance especially when we see the standard of player IE brought in to replace him.  But to answer your question, how much would our likely player of the season go for?  We might finish 8th in L1 compared to 12th in L2, but  Cogley wouldn't be attracting a huge fee to go to the division above IMO.

This is no disprespect to players of season, but I take them with a pinch of salt as a lot of players are out of the running due to being sold/bought in Jan and injuries.  Even Cogley's biggest fan wouldn't say he's in the top 3 of our best or most valuable players. 

[only1swanny]

Luke matheson? 

Reckon he's done OK on the few occasions I've seen him, dealt a poor hand with Evatt..

 

 

[Tonge moor green jacket]

2 minutes ago, only1swanny said:

Luke matheson? 

Reckon he's done OK on the few occasions I've seen him, dealt a poor hand with Evatt..

 

 

Aye.

Can't see him being involved though.

[gonzo]

11 minutes ago, only1swanny said:

Luke matheson? 

Reckon he's done OK on the few occasions I've seen him, dealt a poor hand with Evatt..

 

 

There's been nothing stopping the manager that's been in charge for the 2nd half of season from picking him.

Other than he's nowhere near good enough.

[only1swanny]

10 minutes ago, gonzo said:

There's been nothing stopping the manager that's been in charge for the 2nd half of season from picking him.

Other than he's nowhere near good enough.

Thought he'd been sent out on loan?

[Whitesince63]

Not trying in any way to diminish Max Conway’s achievement but wasn’t Cogley Tranmere’s player of the season when we signed him? On that basis I’d definitely be giving young Max a chance here next year but possibly as second choice if we can find an experienced left back from higher up that he can learn from. Two really good, experienced fullbacks plus a similar Centre Forwsrd up top would even at that improve us massively.

[frank_spencer]

11 minutes ago, only1swanny said:

Thought he'd been sent out on loan?

Think he went on a development loan to non league at one point but no league side wanted him in January 

[Cheese]

12 minutes ago, only1swanny said:

Thought he'd been sent out on loan?

 Yep. Alfreton Town in the National League North.

[Zico]

5 minutes ago, Whitesince63 said:

Not trying in any way to diminish Max Conway’s achievement but wasn’t Cogley Tranmere’s player of the season when we signed him? On that basis I’d definitely be giving young Max a chance here next year but possibly as second choice if we can find an experienced left back from higher up that he can learn from. Two really good, experienced fullbacks plus a similar Centre Forwsrd up top would even at that improve us massively.

Cogley wasn't even first choice RWB

We signed him but Kane Wilson was the number one target 

But we missed out and as such Cogley became the number one regular